Where do one steppers go to church?

[MarcBee]

Originally Posted by Real Realism

That said, I still keep coming away with the impression that "if any man have not the Spirit of God he is none of his" and that tongues are clearly the initial sign of receiving the baptism of the Holy Ghost.

I'm puzzled about how what is essentially a direct, clear quote from the bible can be in any way blunted or adjusted by saying "coming away with the impression that..."

Can relatively clear phrases (at least by biblical standards) be really be recast as your impression?

Originally Posted by Real Realism

I'm not saying that if someone truly repents of their sin and then dies before being baptized or receiving the Holy Ghost that he's not saved. .

Same question--what part of "none of his" is unclear?

Originally Posted by Real Realism

...I'm also not saying that people who live their whole lives only knowing repentance and baptism in the titles won't receive their reward...
.

Etc., etc...

[Real Realism]

Hey, man, you're preaching to the choir here. Look - the Bible does not say "explicitly" that "tongues are the initial evidence of receiving the Holy Ghost." Yes, there are instances where it talks about someone receiving the Holy Ghost, and tongues aren't "mentioned." But, IMO, the absence of information does not mean that something did not exist, just that it was not noted or documented.

I've asked twice in the last couple months on this forum for a one-stepper to give their understanding of Acts 8, and why it was so very evident that SOMETHING physical and observable happened when the Samaritans received the Holy Ghost. ALSO, why were the apostles called upon to pray for them to receive the Holy Ghost, if they had "already received it when they believed" (which they clearly had believed already, as they were baptized). No one has taken it upon themselves to try to give an answer.

So...anyway...yeah, I'm with you. But I know this isn't a debate that begins and ends with how you and I read our Bibles.

(Oh, and on the part of someone "not being saved" if they lived a life of devotion to God without speaking tongues...not for me to judge, if it's not something that was revealed to them in God's word. All I know is what I read and must obey, and preach and teach the same. God is bigger than me, though, so I don't discount his ability to have mercy upon whom he will have mercy.)

[MarcBee]

Originally Posted by Real Realism

...

So...anyway...yeah, I'm with you. But I know this isn't a debate that begins and ends with how you and I read our Bibles.

Fair enough, thanks. But as a believer, I was strongly a three-stepper, and just couldn't find scriptural justification for the wiggle room you are describing (although it would have made life easier had I found that wiggle-room.)
But carry on....

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by Timmy

Definitely not here:

[navygoat1998]

Originally Posted by MarcBee

Fair enough, thanks. But as a believer, I was strongly a three-stepper, and just couldn't find scriptural justification for the wiggle room you are describing (although it would have made life easier had I found that wiggle-room.)
But carry on....

Much of it is in indoctrination. When I read the bible now I see one step all over it.

When we left God told me to read the Bible like a new born babe without my denominational glasses to cloud my judgement of what He was and is doing.

Like I have been told maybe it was not God but the debil.

[Real Realism]

MarcBee, Just noticed your current belief system isn't Biblical. I respect, though, that even in your current state, you see some of the same clarity - even if you don't believe it yourself anymore.

I was at a point in my life a few years ago where I had a decision to make - Faith...or No Faith. I chose faith. Yes, I agree that there are many things in the Bible that seems clear cut and dry and hard to swallow (and then there are other things that are "way out there" and hard to believe in our natural understanding), but I cannot get past the intangible truth that I see and feel a God in this great big world. Now, I could be some sort of "spiritual" person without a belief system...maybe go to a Unitarian church...or I could choose to trust that the Bible is the documented Word of God and his plan for humanity. I chose the latter, and I'm grateful that God was merciful upon me to allow me to make that choice.

At one point, I told a close friend - agonizingly - that I didn't know how to just "believe" something that I didn't believe. He told me: It's a choice. At the time, I didn't understand. Now I do. I choose faith, and I choose to read and obey what I continue to see in his Word. Whether or not God is bigger than my understanding (oh, and I have no doubt that He is) is irrelevant to me.

I must obey what I see...and for the minutia that I don't "see" in the Word...I choose not to make an issue out of those things. Who was Christ harshest on in Scripture? It was the people who created rules and regulations and placed them as hurdles to salvation. He said (Matthew 23:13): "What sorrow awaits you teachers of religious law and you Pharisees. Hypocrites! For you shut the door of the Kingdom of Heaven in people’s faces. You won’t go in yourselves, and you don’t let others enter either."

I choose faith, but I also choose not to create stumbling blocks to salvation by going outside the Word. Anyway - all this is totally off-topic, but a good dialogue nonetheless.

[Real Realism]

Originally Posted by navygoat1998

When we left God told me to read the Bible like a new born babe without my denominational glasses to cloud my judgement of what He was and is doing.

I've been hearing the same thing. Just read the Word. Get rid of the dogma, get rid of the tradition, and read the Word.

While I've no doubt that the Christian walk certainly begins before someone speaks in tongues...I do see in the Word that it the Holy Ghost is a PROMISE, and that all believers should be encouraged to receive the gift he has for us. I'm still not on board with seeking "tongues" for the sake of "making sure you're ready." But in my journey, I've taken issue with churches that do not teach about and encourage all believers to experience the baptism of the Holy Ghost.

[navygoat1998]

Originally Posted by Real Realism

I've been hearing the same thing. Just read the Word. Get rid of the dogma, get rid of the tradition, and read the Word.

While I've no doubt that the Christian walk certainly begins before someone speaks in tongues...I do see in the Word that it the Holy Ghost is a PROMISE, and that all believers should be encouraged to receive the gift he has for us. I'm still not on board with seeking "tongues" for the sake of "making sure you're ready." But in my journey, I've taken issue with churches that do not teach about and encourage all believers to experience the baptism of the Holy Ghost.

I am only telling you what I felt God told me. Also I am Pentecostal and believe that the Baptism of the Holy Ghost with the evidence of speaking in tongues as the Spirit gives utterance is for today.

We had a Holy Ghost shout down last night at church with many youth losing their English.

I want all that God has for me.

[Real Realism]

I think we're pretty close to the same place. But I need baptism in Jesus name to seal the deal. And the AG churches in my area laughed at me when I asked (okay, actually, they didn't laugh...they were quite kind in their responses) and pointed me to the AG.org Statement of Faith. (I believe you said your church does, indeed, baptize in Jesus name, right?)

[navygoat1998]

Originally Posted by Real Realism

I think we're pretty close to the same place. But I need baptism in Jesus name to seal the deal. And the AG churches in my area laughed at me when I asked (okay, actually, they didn't laugh...they were quite kind in their responses) and pointed me to the AG.org Statement of Faith. (I believe you said your church does, indeed, baptize in Jesus name, right?)

That is another member here whose church Baptizes in Jesus Name.

Our church Baptizes according to Matthew 28:19.