Rockets hitting Jerusalem

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

I realize that, Prax. You were the last to comment on the Palestinians being Ismael's descendents, so I replied to the last person commenting.
http://www.apostolicfriendsforum.com...&postcount=230


Sigh.....Yes, I continued to comment, because the issue is the same for me - Ishmael's people were the Arabian nations, the Hagarenes, Saracens, and Turks. The Jewish writings call the Turkish empire the "kingdom of Ishmael".

That's not what he and I were discussing.

Regardless of whether or not the Romans started the whole Palestina thing, these nations and peoples evolved into the great nation of Islamic Muslims.

You keep saying there was no Islam at the time. I don't know why that makes a difference. Same people, Mohammand gains a following and BAM - you have Islam - it is the same people - evolved.

Because HE said Muslims are SPIRITUAL descendents of Ishmael....That's why. He and I are not discussing genetics nor geneology.

Islamic Muslim is not a nation. It's a religion. Christianity/Christians is not a nation.

Isn't that the great nation God spoke about that would increase in numbers and He would make into a great nation? Genesis 17:20

If not, then who is God talking about?[/QUOTE]
That's not what he and I were discussing.

But the answer could be Arabia. But that is genetic. The bible never speaks of Ismael's descendents being a religious group unrelated to Ismael, particularly when Ishmael didn't invent that religion

You responded to me responding to his comment on Muslims being SPIRITUAL descendents of Ishmael.

Who authorized that? God?

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by shazeep

well, but to a figurative 8 year old--me--you are. Rockets hitting Jeru is a...'bad' thing, that you feel compelled to side against, right? But no rocket hits Jeru w/o God's allowance. Ergo, there is a larger picture here, that may easily be obscured.

Please answer me. What is my POV you keep talking about?

BTW since NO rockets have hit Jerusalem haven't you just implied that is God's desire?

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

That's not what he and I were discussing.


Because HE said Muslims are SPIRITUAL descendents of Ishmael....That's why. He and I are not discussing genetics nor geneology.

Islamic Muslim is not a nation. It's a religion. Christianity/Christians is not a nation.

Isn't that the great nation God spoke about that would increase in numbers and He would make into a great nation? Genesis 17:20

If not, then who is God talking about?

That's not what he and I were discussing.

But the answer could be Arabia. But that is genetic. The bible never speaks of Ismael's descendents being a religious group unrelated to Ismael, particularly when Ishmael didn't invent that religion

You responded to me responding to his comment on Muslims being SPIRITUAL descendents of Ishmael.

Who authorized that? God?

I don't think God had to speak of their religion. Mainly, because if that is who he is talking about, Islam had not evolved as yet.

Nations normally have a religion tied to them. So, it's not out of the norm to refer to the Arabic nations as Muslim any more than we refer to America as a Christian nation.

[Pressing-On]

JERUSALEM — Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu of Israel said on Thursday that he would not agree to any cease-fire proposal that does not allow the Israeli military to complete its mission of destroying Hamas’s tunnel network in Gaza.

“So far we have neutralized tens of terror tunnels,” Mr. Netanyahu said in televised remarks at the start of a government meeting at military headquarters in Tel Aviv. “We are determined to continue to complete this mission with or without a cease-fire,” he added.

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/08/01/wo...lict.html?_r=0

[shazeep]

Originally Posted by aegsm76

shaz - you are not apolitical. You have a political viewpoint, that you show in your posts.
My general observation was that liberals, as currently defined, do not like Christianity and do like Islam. I have been able to have several actually admit that during discussions with them. And, they really do not know why they like Islam, after I point out to them some core beliefs.
Thus, I still believe that we "war not against flesh and blood", but it is a spirit that hates the Jews AND hates Christians.
Also, they are not like "us".
Unless the "us" you refer to is 700 years ago.

Christianity today had an article in their Jan/Feb issue that spoke of the effect that Christian Missionaries had on "democratizing" countries.
Not very many successful democratic/republic governments in countries ruled by Islam.
No, they are not like "us", they have an entirely different cultural mindset.

hmm. i consider myself an anarchist--despite the negative connotations that term has gained; so i'm not sure what my posts have revealed to you that i am not seeing, or don't realize. doesn't mean you aren't right, tho!

i love Christianity! i just don't see too many people practicing it...and, just as i see a divide between nation and country, i see a similar one in the doctrines of an established religion, v its adherents. Generalizations can be made about a religion; but one usually wanders astray, i think, when trying to apply these to individuals--they become 'prejudice.'

so, i agree that we war not against flesh and blood--which i would characterize man-made religion, including Christianity, into; but against principalities, etc., and so any spirit that hates a generalized group such as Jews or Christians, or Muslims, is just a prejudiced hate group, a la Hamas. i detest Islam as much as Christianity--but love the adherents. To be less confusing, it should be understood that i believe that satan runs religion, but people come to religion seeking God--and so the two concepts are at cross-purposes. I hate the RCC, but have found Catholics to be awesome.

@ "not very many successful Dem Rep countries under Islam," i would reply that i don't know of any under Christianity, either know of any? that aren't morally and financially bankrupt, i mean? I note the Rothschild Central bank seems to have the least spiritual hold in Arab countries, as they (the nation) strictly avoids usury in any form, which is the Rothschild raison de etre.

Interesting how we here just assume inflation, as a natural thing--we do not even know what real money is. Our financial 'foundation' is built upon usury--if you have a dollar in your pocket, you are participating in it. willingly, if ignorantly.

and i will have to maintain that they are like us where it matters; although they are much more vibrant, these most oppressed of the monotheist believers that i have found--and strangely, they live in a kind of paradise, and don't seem to realize it--no one drinks dried tea there, it's all fresh; the best food to be had is in their 7-elevens! etc. But they all just want to be Americans, and are slowly being programmed into our ways. Sad to me.

[shazeep]

"Islamic Muslim is not a nation. It's a religion. Christianity/Christians is not a nation."

i disagree, but see that we are using differing definitions for "nation." A nation, to me, is the people of a certain culture--the Arab Nation, the Latin Nation, etc, regardless of state lines or whatever. the cultural nation. The one God defines.

[shazeep]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

Please answer me. What is my POV you keep talking about?

BTW since NO rockets have hit Jerusalem haven't you just implied that is God's desire?

ok, at "pov" i think we have the same definition? i just mean to refer to any pov of the moment that you or, more likely, John Q holds. Prolly I replied in general to one of your posts, and didn't mean to be singling you out--unless you hold the common pov.

and i'm not sure why you say that no rockets hit Jeru? but rest assured, when they do, it is only God's will. Not sure about ascribing 'desire' to God tho.

[shazeep]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

I don't think God had to speak of their religion. Mainly, because if that is who he is talking about, Islam had not evolved as yet.

Nations normally have a religion tied to them. So, it's not out of the norm to refer to the Arabic nations as Muslim any more than we refer to America as a Christian nation.

ya, that is my meaning as well. Religions are just inevitable outgrowths of a nation's culture. Christian Arabs would be considered as a different nation than Muslim Arabs, even tho they live in the same country.

[aegsm76]

shaz - you have a religion. And a political view.
It's called conspiracy theory!

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by shazeep

a valid point. but we cry 'peace' when there is war. I came not to bring peace, but a sword.

I don't know what your point is...

What did you believe my POV was? You've mentioned "Your POV" but never seem to know what my POV is and I've asked you several times now