Receiving The Holy Spirit & Speaking In Tongues

[KeptByTheWord]

Originally Posted by CalledOut238

Has anyone studied the Old Testament usage of Prophesy or Naba’? Our Heavenly Father has been using this affirmation of his spirit since sanctifying Moses and the elders.

The difference is that in the Old Testament; God moved upon his people. Whereas in the New Testament He indwelled in His Children.

Selah

The difference, seems to be that the spirit of Jesus, who was raised from the dead, comes to dwell in the heart of people now. But the spirit of the Lord was already at work within the hearts and lives of people all throughout the NT. The difference is in what happened at the death, burial and resurrection of Jesus, and we are now given power over death, hell, sin and the grave, which the church of the OT did not have yet.

Acts 1:8 But you will receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you; and you shall be My witnesses both in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and even to the remotest part of the earth.”

Jesus said they would receive power when the Holy Spirit comes UPON you. The difference is not in that the HS comes upon you (which happened many times in the OT and NT before the DOP too), but what Jesus was speaking would happen - power - that is what was different.

The POWER is the difference between the OT and the NT church.

[KeptByTheWord]

Originally Posted by Jito463

One way I've heard it spoken of before, is that the sound of speaking in tongues is that of birth. If repentance is our death to the old man, and baptism is our burial then it stands to reason that the infilling of the Holy Ghost is our rebirth.

What happens when a new born child comes into the world for the first time? They cry out. That rush of air into the lungs gives them something they've never experienced before, and it causes them to cry out, which is how we know that the child is alive.

Similarly, when a newborn child of God experiences the rush of the Holy Ghost filling them spiritually, they cry out, which is how we know that they are alive in Christ.

I can't remember when or where I heard that, but it's stuck with me ever since. I'm sure it's been preached many times by many preachers, though.

I've heard this too. Maybe we heard the same preacher say it?

[KeptByTheWord]

Originally Posted by Esaias

A child may be born, but if they don't BREATHE they will "die in childbirth". And, crying for that first time is how the amniotic fluid is purged from the lung.

I'm sure there's about a dozen sermons in there...

I'm there are a bunch of sermons, yes indeed...

[CalledOut238]

Originally Posted by KeptByTheWord

I've heard this too. Maybe we heard the same preacher say it?

Wow, what a great allegory. Thank you for sharing.

[covey]

Originally Posted by KeptByTheWord

Covey,

Thank you for your excellent response. I'm sorry I've taken a while to get back to you. I've had computer issues the last few days.

I appreciated your link to the blueletterbible. I was not aware of that site, and it is very nicely done, and very easy to follow. Thank you

However, I do have to disagree with you still about the definition of sound in John 3:8. In fact, when I went to the blueletterbible site, I noticed this very helpful link:

The KJV translates Strong's G5456 in the following manner: voice (131x), sound (8x), be noised abroad (with G1096) (1x), noise (1x).

I notice that you were focusing on the "voice" links. However, when I clicked on the "sound" link, I found this.

I am sorry, but he focus of the passage is "the sound of everyone that is born of the Spirit." From that point on, the only sound that can possibly come from everyone born of the Spirit is from the tongue. There is no other option, yet you forced an option onto the passage that is NOT there.

It appears you are studying the Bible to prove your are correct, instead of examining the Scriptures to see what is true. I can't see how you could have possibly read the definition of "sound", then turn around and give an example by comparison of an inanimate thing (trumpet) to the "sound" of every living one that has a tongue. the definition does not allow it.

Originally Posted by KeptByTheWord

I didn't copy all of the similar passages where sound is used, there are 13 of them, but John 3:8 is in this same link of passages where sound is varied, and not just a human voice.

Varies in what way" Inanimate things compared to living things? Yes, and you disregarded 133 comparisons to find one or two you like?

Originally Posted by KeptByTheWord

I understand that Jesus would not lie... and He didn't. He said that as the sound of the wind comes and no one can see it coming, so is everyone born of the spirit. And then we read of the sound of the wind that came first in Acts 2:2, and then the believers were filled with the spirit, with speaking in tongues evidenced. It is quite obvious he was pointing to the event to take place on the DOP, yes I agree.

It is only obvious to you, because it is what you want to believe. Jesus did not say anyone would hear the sound of the wind whenever anybody (everyone), is born of the Spirit. You are superimposing onto the passage what you desperately want to be true. He said would world hear the sound ("Phone'": voice, tongue, speech) of everyone born of the Spirit.

Originally Posted by KeptByTheWord

, Jesus was using the wind as a concept in which to understand how the spirit would come into a life. As the wind blows, and no one can see it, that is how one is born of the spirit.

No, I am sorry, but you are seeing something that is not in this passage. Please look at the definition of the Greek word here and apply it to the sound of everyone (living things) that is born of the Spirit.

Originally Posted by KeptByTheWord

am not disqualifying tongues being present on the DOP, not at all. But John 3:8 is simply a comparison of the wind coming and going and not being seen, and then Jesus said, so are those who are born of the spirit. It is a comparison between the wind and the spirit simply. Trying to use the word "sound" to be tongues, instead of relative to wind is really taking liberties with the scripture, in my opinion.

I am beyond sorry. The only one taking liberties is your insistence the sound of the wind will be heard by everyone born of the Spirit. Despite what happened on the DOP and millions of people alive today, you insist speaking in tongues is not a sound of Everyone born of the Spirit.

[w4yne]

If I were to read through this thread and pick out all the errors and flaws in your doctrine and theology and point them out to you...
would you be offended and hate me or would you be grateful and reward me for helping you to know that to which is not true in what you believe?

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by w4yne

If I were to read through this thread and pick out all the errors and flaws in your doctrine and theology and point them out to you...
would you be offended and hate me or would you be grateful and reward me for helping you to know that to which is not true in what you believe?

You have the pride of life warned of in 1 John. It's part of this world that passes away, and that pride will pass away with it. There is no self-denial and cross in your posts. No one will engage you. Bye.

[w4yne]

Originally Posted by mfblume

You have the pride of life warned of in 1 John. It's part of this world that passes away, and that pride will pass away with it. There is no self-denial and cross in your posts. No one will engage you. Bye.

Are you speaking just for yourself or for everyone?

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by w4yne

Are you speaking just for yourself or for everyone?

Just watch and see. Why weren't you the least bit humble? Your first post turned everyone off. Watch and see.

[w4yne]

Originally Posted by mfblume

Just watch and see. Why weren't you the least bit humble? Your first post turned everyone off. Watch and see.

You give yourself way to much credit. But better you than me.