Bott 2020

[votivesoul]

Originally Posted by Nicodemus1968

Do you believe a spirit can afflict a person through sickness?

Yes.

But it doesn't matter what I believe here. Correlation does not imply causation. Some people go to BOTT and afterward, subjectively claim they were being harassed by a spirit of infirmity, and are so weakened by it, they have to call an AFF member to be delivered, with one even heading to the hospital and receiving medical attention for what they claimed is a demonic affliction, and then the AFF member they called comes here and makes a claim they picked up a spirit at BOTT because of something that was allegedly released there, whatever that means?

Whatever happened to loving the LORD your God with all your mind?

Do you not see that the more parsimonious conclusion is that, even if these folks really were afflicted by a spirit of infirmity, and it wasn't just Montezuma's Revenge or a migraine or some other NATURAL health issue, it's because they were already so spiritually infirm it was EASY for such a spirit to take hold of them and give them a good trouncing?

Let's be honest here. If Holy Spirit-filled, truth-believing and preaching saints of God are so easily whipped by a devil, how Holy Spirit-filled, truth-believing and preaching are they, as saints? Tred on serpents and scorpions? Bruise Satan's head under your feet? Cast out, devils? Anyone?

And why couldn't they recognize the attack for what it was, and rebuff it in the name of Jesus? Why did they need to make a phone call to someone who knows how to "pray deliverance"? Why don't they know how? BOTT is for ministers of the Gospel, right? But they can't kick the devil in the teeth when he comes smiling in their faces?

See, it's always blaming someone or something else for your personal weaknesses. It's not me, it was BOTT. It's not me, it's the depressed sister who takes meds who got a handclap. It's not me, it's R. Kelly's silly song being sung. It's never me, it's a spirit. It's not me. Not me, not me, not me. Sounds like Adam's finger-pointing at God and Eve, to me.

Grow up and take some responsibility for your own current level of spirituality, already.

[Nicodemus1968]

Originally Posted by votivesoul

Yes.

But it doesn't matter what I believe here. Correlation does not imply causation. Some people go to BOTT and afterward, subjectively claim they were being harassed by a spirit of infirmity, and are so weakened by it, they have to call an AFF member to be delivered, with one even heading to the hospital and receiving medical attention for what they claimed is a demonic affliction, and then the AFF member they called comes here and makes a claim they picked up a spirit at BOTT because of something that was allegedly released there, whatever that means?

Whatever happened to loving the LORD your God with all your mind?

Do you not see that the more parsimonious conclusion is that, even if these folks really were afflicted by a spirit of infirmity, and it wasn't just Montezuma's Revenge or a migraine or some other NATURAL health issue, it's because they were already so spiritually infirm it was EASY for such a spirit to take hold of them and give them a good trouncing?

Let's be honest here. If Holy Spirit-filled, truth-believing and preaching saints of God are so easily whipped by a devil, how Holy Spirit-filled, truth-believing and preaching are they, as saints? Tred on serpents and scorpions? Bruise Satan's head under your feet? Cast out, devils? Anyone?

And why couldn't they recognize the attack for what it was, and rebuff it in the name of Jesus? Why did they need to make a phone call to someone who knows how to "pray deliverance"? Why don't they know how? BOTT is for ministers of the Gospel, right? But they can't kick the devil in the teeth when he comes smiling in their faces?

See, it's always blaming someone or something else for your personal weaknesses. It's not me, it was BOTT. It's not me, it's the depressed sister who takes meds who got a handclap. It's not me, it's R. Kelly's silly song being sung. It's never me, it's a spirit. It's not me. Not me, not me, not me. Sounds like Adam's finger-pointing at God and Eve, to me.

Grow up and take some responsibility for your own current level of spirituality, already.

I guess were not seeing the same thing.

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Nicodemus1968

I guess were not seeing the same thing.

Can the hospital get rid of a demon of infirmity?
They couldn’t do it with the woman with the issue of blood.

[Nicodemus1968]

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

Can the hospital get rid of a demon of infirmity?
They couldn’t do it with the woman with the issue of blood.

You more than I know that it cannot. The hospital your referring to cannot prescribe the medicine that the patient needs. Yet, the church, the ER has the medicine for those patients.

[Nicodemus1968]

Originally Posted by votivesoul

Yes.

But it doesn't matter what I believe here. Correlation does not imply causation. Some people go to BOTT and afterward, subjectively claim they were being harassed by a spirit of infirmity, and are so weakened by it, they have to call an AFF member to be delivered, with one even heading to the hospital and receiving medical attention for what they claimed is a demonic affliction, and then the AFF member they called comes here and makes a claim they picked up a spirit at BOTT because of something that was allegedly released there, whatever that means?

Whatever happened to loving the LORD your God with all your mind?

Do you not see that the more parsimonious conclusion is that, even if these folks really were afflicted by a spirit of infirmity, and it wasn't just Montezuma's Revenge or a migraine or some other NATURAL health issue, it's because they were already so spiritually infirm it was EASY for such a spirit to take hold of them and give them a good trouncing?

Let's be honest here. If Holy Spirit-filled, truth-believing and preaching saints of God are so easily whipped by a devil, how Holy Spirit-filled, truth-believing and preaching are they, as saints? Tred on serpents and scorpions? Bruise Satan's head under your feet? Cast out, devils? Anyone?

And why couldn't they recognize the attack for what it was, and rebuff it in the name of Jesus? Why did they need to make a phone call to someone who knows how to "pray deliverance"? Why don't they know how? BOTT is for ministers of the Gospel, right? But they can't kick the devil in the teeth when he comes smiling in their faces?

See, it's always blaming someone or something else for your personal weaknesses. It's not me, it was BOTT. It's not me, it's the depressed sister who takes meds who got a handclap. It's not me, it's R. Kelly's silly song being sung. It's never me, it's a spirit. It's not me. Not me, not me, not me. Sounds like Adam's finger-pointing at God and Eve, to me.

Grow up and take some responsibility for your own current level of spirituality, already.

Brother, I’m going say something on behalf of Armpit, I know him personally. Ill be preaching for him on Sunday night.

He received a call from an evangelist the Sunday after BOTT about 1 in the morning. Both the man and his wife are sick, sick enough to call his PASTOR and ask him to pray for them. The evangelist says he believes its a spirit of Infirmity, they pray. The next day he gets a call form a Pastor from another state and asks him to pray, the Pastor tells him I just got back from BOTT and know I’m headed to the hospital, because I’m not sure what’s going on!

To some they may throw that off as coincidence, to others it doesn’t fit their methodology of how God has to work, and we wonder why we cant see the supernatural? The Bible tells us we have to come to him as a child, not a biblical scholar!

The two men do not know each other, and the one doesn’t know the other. But yet Armpit gets a call from both of them with the same elements, one day apart, and the common denominator is BOTT! Not only that, yet while at the BOTT conference a Pastors wife confesses that she has been on Depression medication.... She proclaims I prayed, fasted, had others pray for me and it didn’t work. She was encouraging others with the same problem to do as she did!

You ask, “why didn’t they pray?” Thats a great question, how can they pray against something they dont believe exists? Oh sure they of course believe in Satan, go to 90% of the Pentecostal/Apostolic church’s and its Satan this and Satan that. Satan is attacking them while “he” is attacking another saint half way across the world. How can Satan do that, if he is just one? He’s not God, God is omnipotent, not Satan!

The problem is we dont believe in the spirit realm! You can tell me you do, when you believe 90% of your problems is just physical ailments you dont believe in the spirit realm. It’s amazing to me, we quote the scripture “weapons of our WARFARE are not carnal, but are mighty through God pulling down of STRONGHOLDS” yet we dont live it. Ask someone to name the spirits the Bible calls out, and they’ll look at you like you have a third eye!

Do you believe a spirit can be released on what we say? The Bible say to speak life, death and life are in the power of the tongue. As you praise God you’ll feel God, you’ll say their is victory in Jesus, and you’ll feel the excitement, why because your speaking life! Now, what if I start talking about how Horror, fear etc your going to feels a presence why, because your speaking about it. When that Pastors wife proclaimed what she did, you dont have to believe it, but she also spoke a spirit into that place. I pray God would open our eyes to see beyond the natural, and if we would allow him to lead us into a place of the spirit we have not been.

It’s not the “not me”, Brother these souls, I’m talking about preachers as well they have no clue about the spirit realm. Do you know how to pray for deliverance fro someone? Do you understand what you’ll feel with certain spirits? Not every spirit is the same, call me a kook, I’ve been called worse! This is real, more real than you want to believe.

That song she sang is worldly. He’s not blaming the song he just used that to show what was going on at the conference. You may think nothing of it, “I believe I can fly” sounds good, use it to sing about the rapture. But you would have a problem if she sang Hells Bells from AC/DC, why??? Hells Bells was created from satanic worshippers, we cant have that right? While I believe I can fly was created by a child rapist....

[Esaias]

We'll be praying this afternoon for the meeting in Detroit.

[Barb]

"That song she sang is worldly. He’s not blaming the song he just used that to show what was going on at the conference. You may think nothing of it, “I believe I can fly” sounds good, use it to sing about the rapture. But you would have a problem if she sang Hells Bells from AC/DC, why??? Hells Bells was created from satanic worshippers, we cant have that right? While I believe I can fly was created by a child rapist...."


Brother Nic, I understand your point here, but may I add my thoughts to this? I have been thinking long and hard about it…

First of all, we would all have a problem with AC/DC, so that is rather far fetched in my opinion.

Secondly, you wrote that he used the song to show what was going on at the conference… what was going on that was so out there that it must be discussed here, casting aspersions on a conference I am told was outstanding in Word and Spirit?

I don’t know Sister Mangun from Adam’s house cat, but from what I know of her I cannot imagine she would do something so blatantly 'worldly' as to sing I Believe I Can Fly for any other reason than she felt it right to do so. Bringing worldliness into the conference goes beyond the pale for her, again, as far as I can tell from my house.

The fact that the song was written by a supposed rapist… well, we sing a LOT of songs written by a host of folks with less than stellar characters. We sing Going Up Yonder; Hallelujah, Praise the Lamb; Thank You For Giving To the Lord, and more which were written by men with great sin attached to their lives and reputations. We have not stopped, as far as I know, to question their flaws or abominable sins.

I simply do not believe that singing that song ushered in a spiritual attack. I was in a church service one time, and the sister sang Wind Beneath My Wings, with gospel lyrics… it was wonderful. That song as even been sung at funerals…

This is not directed at you personally, but at us all… if we have concerns or questions about the song why not go to the source? Ask Sister Mickey Mangun where her heart and intentions were. I’m sure she will answer us…

[Barb]

Originally Posted by Esaias

We'll be praying this afternoon for the meeting in Detroit.

What meeting is in Detroit?

[Nicodemus1968]

Originally Posted by Barb

"That song she sang is worldly. He’s not blaming the song he just used that to show what was going on at the conference. You may think nothing of it, “I believe I can fly” sounds good, use it to sing about the rapture. But you would have a problem if she sang Hells Bells from AC/DC, why??? Hells Bells was created from satanic worshippers, we cant have that right? While I believe I can fly was created by a child rapist...."


Brother Nic, I understand your point here, but may I add my thoughts to this? I have been thinking long and hard about it…

First of all, we would all have a problem with AC/DC, so that is rather far fetched in my opinion.

Secondly, you wrote that he used the song to show what was going on at the conference… what was going on that was so out there that it must be discussed here, casting aspersions on a conference I am told was outstanding in Word and Spirit?

I don’t know Sister Mangun from Adam’s house cat, but from what I know of her I cannot imagine she would do something so blatantly 'worldly' as to sing I Believe I Can Fly for any other reason than she felt it right to do so. Bringing worldliness into the conference goes beyond the pale for her, again, as far as I can tell from my house.

The fact that the song was written by a supposed rapist… well, we sing a LOT of songs written by a host of folks with less than stellar characters. We sing Going Up Yonder; Hallelujah, Praise the Lamb; Thank You For Giving To the Lord, and more which were written by men with great sin attached to their lives and reputations. We have not stopped, as far as I know, to question their flaws or abominable sins.

I simply do not believe that singing that song ushered in a spiritual attack. I was in a church service one time, and the sister sang Wind Beneath My Wings, with gospel lyrics… it was wonderful. That song as even been sung at funerals…

This is not directed at you personally, but at us all… if we have concerns or questions about the song why not go to the source? Ask Sister Mickey Mangun where her heart and intentions were. I’m sure she will answer us…

When I mentioned “he mentioned that to show us what was going on in the conference.” I didn’t mean that song ushered in a spiritual attack. She may be ignorant of what that song means, and who it was sung by. Sis. Mangun signing that song is low on the pole for me.

I understand a lot of the songs we sign are not from Apostolics. Yet, the Bible says let everything that have breathe praise the Lord. And I know the example I gave is probably far fetched, I use that to illustrate that there times we look for the obvious, while they're are a lot of things that are not that obvious.

[Barb]

Originally Posted by Nicodemus1968

When I mentioned “he mentioned that to show us what was going on in the conference.” I didn’t mean that song ushered in a spiritual attack. She may be ignorant of what that song means, and who it was sung by. Sis. Mangun signing that song is low on the pole for me.

I understand a lot of the songs we sign are not from Apostolics. Yet, the Bible says let everything that have breathe praise the Lord. And I know the example I gave is probably far fetched, I use that to illustrate that there times we look for the obvious, while they're are a lot of things that are not that obvious.

I know, and i respect you and your opinion.