History of Tithes in the Church

[good samaritan]

Originally Posted by Esaias

Or is he just "gleaning"?

I think you are making the point he is doing the same thing as we have done with tithing? Tithing is not a NT command and so I am not trying to establish it as doctrine. My point throughout was only that there was no wrong to practice tithing monetarily.

[Tithesmeister]

From the Articles of Faith of the UPCI


“TITHING

We believe tithing is God’s financial plan to provide for His work, and has been since the days of Abraham. Tithing came with faith under Abraham, Moses’ law enjoined it, and Israel practiced it when she was right with God; Jesus indorsed it (Matt. 23:23); and Paul said to lay by in store as God has prospered you. Do not rob God of His portion, viz., tithes and offerings.”

This is from the official Articles of Faith of the UPCI. Since this article is about the history of tithes in the church, and since (it seems) that everyone has their own version of what to believe, I thought I’d go right to the source.

Please notice that the UPCI believes that tithing is God’s financial plan for the church. Ironically, a financial plan is exactly what the tithing plan was NOT! There was no tithing of money allowed.

The Good Samaritan is a pastor with the UPCI. I’m not sure about Brother Blume. The Good Samaritan has been good enough to share how he gets paid from the church, and I admire him for that.

Brother Blume says that giving is giving and it doesn’t matter what you call it, BUT I’m pretty sure he gets paid from tithes money. Which is an oxymoron in the Bible. Can you verify this Brother Blume? I certainly don’t want to misrepresent you.

Anyway, for the sake of the discussion and to get the skinny on the tithing doctrine of the UPCI in their own words, I thought it would be helpful to post this.

Now there is obviously an interface between the pastors or preachers that are members of the UPCI and the headquarters. I believe that they agree to tithe to the headquarters of the tithe they receive in the local church.

Good Samaritan, can you verify this or refute it?

[coksiw]

Originally Posted by Tithesmeister

The Good Samaritan is a pastor with the UPCI. I’m not sure about Brother Blume.

I believe Blume is independent. You can't be preterist of any kind (full, partial, in between) and be UPCI or WPF. IIRC, Blume is partial preterist.

[coksiw]

Originally Posted by good samaritan

I think you are making the point he is doing the same thing as we have done with tithing? Tithing is not a NT command and so I am not trying to establish it as doctrine. My point throughout was only that there was no wrong to practice tithing monetarily.

You can practice it yourself if you want, but God did not command you to do it. It becomes a problem for you when you invalidate God's actual commandments in order to fulfill your self-imposed tax. It also becomes a problem when you teach it to others as a commandment or even as a recommended amount.

In case you missed:

Originally Posted by coksiw

...except when the practice hinders God's commandments. Here is an example of man-made commandments that they also attempted to make it a Bible doctrine but ended up invalidating God's commandments.

Mar 7:9-13 NKJV - (9) He said to them, "[All too] well you reject the commandment of God, that you may keep your tradition. (10) "For Moses said, 'Honor your father and your mother'; and, 'He who curses father or mother, let him be put to death.' (11) "But you say, 'If a man says to his father or mother, "Whatever profit you might have received from me [is] Corban"--' (that is, a gift [to God]), (12) "then you no longer let him do anything for his father or his mother, (13) "making the word of God of no effect through your tradition which you have handed down. And many such things you do."

These are the commandments you invalidate with the false teaching of tithing:

* "Honor your father and your mother", some poor or low middle class families would need to decide whether to pay tithes or effectively support their needed parents (a family may have up to four parents to help). Yet, they may choose to do tithing because they believe incorrectly it is a commandment from God above all things as taught by the preacher.

* "But if anyone does not provide for his own, and especially for those of his household, he has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever." Some poor or low middle class families may incur into debt so they can keep paying their tithes, because, again, they believe is a commandment from God above all things, as the preacher told them.

* "(15) If a brother or sister is naked and destitute of daily food, (16) and one of you says to them, "Depart in peace, be warmed and filled," but you do not give them the things which are needed for the body, what [does it] profit?". You know, again, because they are being told by the preacher that the tithing goes above all things, so giving to ministry goes before giving to others in need. Low middle class and poor people can't afford to do both.

[Tithesmeister]

Originally Posted by good samaritan

I think you are making the point he is doing the same thing as we have done with tithing? Tithing is not a NT command and so I am not trying to establish it as doctrine. My point throughout was only that there was no wrong to practice tithing monetarily.

Brother,
Just fyi there is no distinction between teaching and doctrine. A teaching is a doctrine. You teach doctrine. You indoctrinate with teaching. There is no difference.

If you teach that people should tithe, you are teaching a tithe doctrine.

Albeit false.

[Tithesmeister]

noun
doc·​trine | \ ˈdäk-trən \
Definition
1a : a principle or position or the body of principles in a branch of knowledge or system of belief : DOGMA
//Catholic doctrine
b : a statement of fundamental government policy especially in international relations
//the Truman Doctrine
c law : a principle of law established through past decisions
d : a military principle or set of strategies
e : something that is taught
2 archaic : TEACHING, INSTRUCTION

[good samaritan]

Originally Posted by Tithesmeister

From the Articles of Faith of the UPCI


“TITHING

We believe tithing is God’s financial plan to provide for His work, and has been since the days of Abraham. Tithing came with faith under Abraham, Moses’ law enjoined it, and Israel practiced it when she was right with God; Jesus indorsed it (Matt. 23:23); and Paul said to lay by in store as God has prospered you. Do not rob God of His portion, viz., tithes and offerings.”

This is from the official Articles of Faith of the UPCI. Since this article is about the history of tithes in the church, and since (it seems) that everyone has their own version of what to believe, I thought I’d go right to the source.

Please notice that the UPCI believes that tithing is God’s financial plan for the church. Ironically, a financial plan is exactly what the tithing plan was NOT! There was no tithing of money allowed.

The Good Samaritan is a pastor with the UPCI. I’m not sure about Brother Blume. The Good Samaritan has been good enough to share how he gets paid from the church, and I admire him for that.

Brother Blume says that giving is giving and it doesn’t matter what you call it, BUT I’m pretty sure he gets paid from tithes money. Which is an oxymoron in the Bible. Can you verify this Brother Blume? I certainly don’t want to misrepresent you.

Anyway, for the sake of the discussion and to get the skinny on the tithing doctrine of the UPCI in their own words, I thought it would be helpful to post this.

Now there is obviously an interface between the pastors or preachers that are members of the UPCI and the headquarters. I believe that they agree to tithe to the headquarters of the tithe they receive in the local church.

Good Samaritan, can you verify this or refute it?

I am a UPCI pastor, and I haved tithed much longer then I have held licensure with the UPCI. I am not going to get on a big discussion upon what the UPCI believes, the UPC is a big organization and there are many different ministers that can explain for themselves their stance on tithing. My stance on tithing has changed in the last decade of ministry and I take in consideration all the information we have discussed. I may not always keep license with the UPCI, but I am not gonna contribute to any mud slinging vendetta anyone may have against it.

[good samaritan]

Originally Posted by coksiw

You can practice it yourself if you want, but God did not command you to do it. It becomes a problem for you when you invalidate God's actual commandments in order to fulfill your self-imposed tax. It also becomes a problem when you teach it to others as a commandment or even as a recommended amount.

In case you missed:

If tithing is preventing someone from providing for their family, then don’t. Easy solution. I have never even suggested to anyone to not provide for their families in order to tithe.

[coksiw]

Originally Posted by good samaritan

If tithing is preventing someone from providing for their family, then don’t. Easy solution. I have never even suggested to anyone to not provide for their families in order to tithe.

[Tithesmeister]

Originally Posted by good samaritan

I am a UPCI pastor, and I haved tithed much longer then I have held licensure with the UPCI. I am not going to get on a big discussion upon what the UPCI believes, the UPC is a big organization and there are many different ministers that can explain for themselves their stance on tithing. My stance on tithing has changed in the last decade of ministry and I take in consideration all the information we have discussed. I may not always keep license with the UPCI, but I am not gonna contribute to any mud slinging vendetta anyone may have against it.

Brother,
How is posting their own articles of faith regarding tithing mudslinging?I just copied and pasted. Their policy for their membership should not be mudslinging either if it is true.