Apostolic but not Oneness?

[FlamingZword]

Originally Posted by Jito463

Since the term Apostolic means one who practices the teachings of the apostles - and being one who believes the apostles did not teach a trinity, but one true God as all Jewish people believe - I would have to say no. Pentecostal perhaps, but not Apostolic.

Perhaps a few titles you can look into, would be

Ancient Champions of Oneness - William B. Chalfant
Oneness and Trinity: a.d. 100-300 - David Bernard
The Trinitarian Controversy in the Fourth Century - David Bernard
A Handbook of Basic Doctrines - David Bernard
(I love this one personally, as it's nothing but scripture references, no exposition)

Then there's the 'History of Christian Doctrine' volumes 1-3, also by David Bernard (what can I say, he writes a lot of books, so it's not uncommon I'd reference him a lot). Volume 1 is predominantly about the old church, post-Apostolic. Volume 2 covers the ground between, leading up to current times. Volume 3 is about modern day, starting around the beginning of the 20th century and the revival of the Pentecostal movement that began in the book of Acts.

I agree

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Jito463

Thanks for that link, Praxeas. I'm always up for finding more sources to read. I'll check it out later when I have some more time. As an aside, I forgot another good book (albeit a short one, and not without some flaws). 'Is Jesus in the Godhead or is the Godhead in Jesus' by Gordon Magee. I think there's even a free PDF version of it available online, but I could be mistaken. I'll have to look for it again.

Personally, I would not recommend that. It's more Apologetic than Academic.

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Patrick Harris

Honestly, not much.
I don't make decisions quickly and without a lot of prayer and study.
I've never considered the trinity a "hill to die on" so I'm a little more open to changing my mind on the subject.

The pastor and I have actually had several conversations on it.

Did you get my link?

[Patrick Harris]

Originally Posted by Originalist

Who are any of us to say? You do not believe in three Gods (and probably never did as most Trinitarians do not). Though I've never heard you explain your idea of the Godhead, I would not doubt that it would pass the "Oneness litmus test" of some on here. It seems you are trying to be a "Strict Constructionist" (hint hint) at least.

Yep, got it.

[Patrick Harris]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

Did you get my link?

I did thanks.

[Patrick Harris]

Originally Posted by Pliny

What questions do you have?

Actually none. Through my pastor and some great reference books I've been given, I have had most of the concerns answered.
It's a matter of some prayer and decision making.

[Esaias]

Brother, read Isaiah 9:6. The Son who is to be given is to be known as both the Mighty God and the Everlasting Father. The apostles believed in one God whom they called Father, who according to Jesus is a Spirit. Those apostles also believed and taught that the man, Jesus Christ, is also somehow the manifestation in flesh of the God whom they believed in. Oneness is a modern term for believing Jesus is both the One and only God and yet also the human manifestation or "incarnation" of that God. Both man... and God.

As Martin Luther once said "in heaven the only God you will ever see is Jesus Christ".

In tthehuman Son of God we perceive the heavenly Father and God of all creation. And He sends his Holy Ghost into our hearts who is none other than Christ dwelling in us.

Trinitarianism and binitarianism and unfortunately even some versions of "oneness" I've heard are just intellectual attempts to explain God in the language of Hellenic philosophy and metaphysics. ie the "wisdom of the world" by which man FAILED TO KNOW GOD.

[Jason B]

Source for Martin Luther quote?

[Michael The Disciple]

Originally Posted by Jason Badejo

Source for Martin Luther quote?

Yea.

I have met a few Trins that said the same thing. That's my kind of Trinity! Jesus Only!

[Lafon]

I cannot say that I ever truly believed in a Trinity, i.e., a “triune” God, per se, albeit prior to my coming to an understanding of the Oneness of God I did hold to the belief about the godhead which many call “binitarianism,” that is, two separate, distinctly different persons in “one” essence.

Even after receiving the baptism of the Holy Ghost and being water baptized “in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ,” I continued to struggle for several months with the “Oneness” question, that is, until I chanced to meet a complete stranger (who since became and has been one of my dearest friends for 27 years), at which time we engaged in a discussion of the matter.

When he opened his Bible to show me how our Lord’s response to Peter’s “revelation” of His identity (Matthew 16:17, KJV) actually corroborated those spoken by the Lord as found recorded in Matthew 11:27 (KJV), suddenly it all seemed to be so clear ... Christ Jesus (the Son of man) was, and is, the One True God (the Father, who is Spirit), and it is He that "reveals" both the identity of Himself as a "man" in whom the Spirit (Father) dwelt without measure.

Seeing that Christ Jesus (the Son of man) is the one who reveals the true identity of the Father (the Spirit), according to the words of Matthew 11:27, and that Christ Jesus (the Son of man) told Peter that it was the Father (the Spirit) who reveals the true identity of whom He (the Son of man) was, according to the words of Matthew 16:17, then it must be true, simply stated, that Christ Jesus (the Son of man) is the visible manifestation of the Father (who is Spirit)!