Apostolic Friends Forum
Tab Menu 1
Go Back   Apostolic Friends Forum > The Fellowship Hall > Fellowship Hall
Facebook

Notices

Fellowship Hall The place to go for Fellowship & Fun!


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #181  
Old 06-19-2018, 10:31 AM
Amanah's Avatar
Amanah Amanah is offline
Covenant Apostolic


 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Sebastian, FL
Posts: 8,886
Re: A Handmaids Tale

found an interesting article on it:

The Jesuit Theonomy

This recent Evangelical-Roman Catholic Accord is just one more step in a long line of dialogue and betrayal. The amount of ecumenical activity today is absolutely staggering. The drive to unite "Christendom" (really Popedom) has been greatly accelerated in the past few years.

However when one examines the participants closely he will see that the unity aimed at is NOT the unity of John 17 but the unity of Revelation 17. The great blasphemies and errors of the Papacy have all been tied into Mystery Babylon the Great by almost every biblical commentator who has ever lived.

Certainly the Reformers viewed the Papacy as Antichrist and IT WAS THIS VERY VIEW WHICH LED THEM, and those who followed them, in their REVOLT from Rome. As we have pointed out, in more detail, in our other study Antichrist and Optimism, THERE COULD HAVE BEEN NO REFORMATION AT ALL if the Reformers had accepted the novel ideas of the modern Reconstructionists.

In fact the Reformers could not have been reconstructionists in their theology for they set about to DELIBERATELY WRECK the papal theocracy of the Middle Ages, the very ideal of modern theonomists both Jesuit and Reformed.

If they had not been at least, partially successful in deliberately shattering the evil theocracy of the Papacy, WE
WOULD ALL BE IN THE DARK AGES STILL! Why can otherwise intelligent men not see this truth today?

The papacy pretends to be the great defender of human rights and democracy in the world today but is in fact, still the great enemy of the truth that it has been for centuries. We know that a lynch mob is a democracy in action, but we also recognize that the constitution of the United States is one of the best documents which man has produced.

Rome of course does not agree. Reconstructionists do not agree either. The Reconstructionists, like Pat Robertson and others, want to set up a theonomy in the United States. Rome's idea of the church ruling in the middle ages, is very similar to Pat Roberston's desire now to have the church ruling in the United States.


We believe that man is a depraved sinner so no theonomy can be achieved. The Constitution of the United States while not being perfect nevertheless has checks and balances built in to it, which is about the best that man can hope for before the return of Christ. Certainly, the Constitution of the United States should NEVER be bartered away for a Jesuit-sponsored theonomy.

Rome hates the Constitution of the United States and has shown that, in various attacks on it, both open and subtle. Certainly the most open one which we have read was in the Jesuit Magazine, "America."

An Irish Roman Catholic priest said:

The honest fact is that I just don't understand the reverence, not to say adoration, which every body here seems to pay to the "Americun Constitooshun." I want to hear some American get up and shout: "Give us justice. Give us decency. And to hell with the American Constitution. 1

The bald faced deception of Rome is indeed a marvel to behold. Here was a priest pretending to care about decency and justice and he had just come from a country whose own constitution set up the Roman Catholic Church in a place of privilege and treated all Protestants as second class citizens.

This is always the problem with any kind of theonomy. Who determines the meaning of decency and justice and even more importantly; the meaning of truth? Malachi Martin shows us who he thinks can determine the truth for us. He says of Pope John Paul II:

It sets them apart (all those who believe in democratic principles) from the Holy Father, because democratic principles cannot take precedence over divine revelation... it is axiomatic for John Paul that no one has the right — democratic or otherwise -- to a moral wrong; and no religion based on divine
revelation has a moral right to teach such a moral wrong or abide by it. 2

This is the same position the reconstructionists also take today. Rushdoony claims error has no rights. The only
trouble with such a position is: who determines who is right and who is in error?


The very pope who teaches that no one has a democratic right to a moral wrong certainly believes that he has a papal, and autocratic right, to a moral wrong which is just as bad or EVEN WORSE than a democratic right! He practices Mariolatry and idolatry which are heinous moral wrongs to Bible-believing Protestants. His "church" not only teaches these morals wrongs, but also teaches officially under an archbishop's Imprimatur, that those who oppose these moral wrongs are blasphemers!

http://seawaves.us/na/web4/theonomy.html#chap_6

Last edited by Amanah; 06-19-2018 at 10:43 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #182  
Old 06-19-2018, 10:54 AM
Amanah's Avatar
Amanah Amanah is offline
Covenant Apostolic


 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Sebastian, FL
Posts: 8,886
Re: A Handmaids Tale

There is a movement about that is casting a long shadow for its size. It is known by different handles such as reconstructionism, kingdom theology, theonomy, and dominion theology, and it is a curious blend of Reformed/Calvinist theology and Charismatic influence. While there are relatively few who would call themselves reconstructionists, a number of the movement’s ideas have infiltrated the thinking and actions of many believers, often without them knowing it. The movement is led by such theologians as Rousas J. Rusdoony; Gary North; Ray Sutton; Greg Bahnsen; David Chiltion, and by Charismatic leaders such as Earl Paulk. But their ideas are often reflected by non-reconstructionists such as Pat Robertson, John Whitehead, Franky Schaeffer, and even Jerry Falwell.


http://apprising.org/2011/01/31/dominion-theology/
Reply With Quote
  #183  
Old 06-19-2018, 11:08 AM
Aquila Aquila is offline
Banned


 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 31,124
Re: A Handmaids Tale

Quote:
Originally Posted by Amanah View Post
There is a movement about that is casting a long shadow for its size. It is known by different handles such as reconstructionism, kingdom theology, theonomy, and dominion theology, and it is a curious blend of Reformed/Calvinist theology and Charismatic influence. While there are relatively few who would call themselves reconstructionists, a number of the movement’s ideas have infiltrated the thinking and actions of many believers, often without them knowing it. The movement is led by such theologians as Rousas J. Rusdoony; Gary North; Ray Sutton; Greg Bahnsen; David Chiltion, and by Charismatic leaders such as Earl Paulk. But their ideas are often reflected by non-reconstructionists such as Pat Robertson, John Whitehead, Franky Schaeffer, and even Jerry Falwell.


http://apprising.org/2011/01/31/dominion-theology/
The desire for power is the mother of all heresies.
Reply With Quote
  #184  
Old 06-19-2018, 11:10 AM
Aquila Aquila is offline
Banned


 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 31,124
Re: A Handmaids Tale

An example of Theonomy in early America...
History of the Salem Witch Trials
http://historyofmassachusetts.org/th...-witch-trials/
Reply With Quote
  #185  
Old 06-19-2018, 01:00 PM
aegsm76 aegsm76 is offline
Registered Member


 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 5,121
Re: A Handmaids Tale

A - are you saying that there was no demonic influence in Salem?
__________________
If we ever forget that we're One Nation Under God, then we will be a nation gone under - Ronald Reagan
Reply With Quote
  #186  
Old 06-19-2018, 01:34 PM
Aquila Aquila is offline
Banned


 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 31,124
Re: A Handmaids Tale

Quote:
Originally Posted by aegsm76 View Post
A - are you saying that there was no demonic influence in Salem?
I wasn't there, so I can't say either way. I do know that this is an excellent example of Theonomy. They had their "witnesses", and they had their law...
Exodus 22:18 (KJV)
18 Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live.
After the hysteria, over 20 people were killed.
Reply With Quote
  #187  
Old 06-19-2018, 03:17 PM
Evang.Benincasa's Avatar
Evang.Benincasa Evang.Benincasa is offline
Unvaxxed Pureblood too


 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 39,328
Re: A Handmaids Tale

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aquila View Post
I wasn't there, so I can't say either way. I do know that this is an excellent example of Theonomy. They had their "witnesses", and they had their law...
Exodus 22:18 (KJV)
18 Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live.
After the hysteria, over 20 people were killed.
Funny, you post you can't say either way, but then you say anyway.
__________________
“Burn the Boats!!!” — Hernan Cortes
Reply With Quote
  #188  
Old 06-19-2018, 03:27 PM
Esaias's Avatar
Esaias Esaias is offline
Unvaxxed Pureblood


 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Zion aka TEXAS
Posts: 26,174
Re: A Handmaids Tale

I think I already addressed the issue about imperfect people attempting to govern theonomically. In short, those who say imperfect people cannot be trusted to govern theonomically are in fact being hypocritical (though they are likely not aware of it). If people cannot be trusted to govern theonomically, then they cannot be trusted to govern period.

If we say society should not seek to follow God's Word because bad people will do bad things with it, then why do we think people should seek to follow man's philosophy, as if they will do better?

Upon what basis can it ever be reasonable that bad people will govern better when following man's philosophy than when seeking to follow God's Word? If the objection were valid, then no church and no family should seek to follow God's Word as the ruling standard by which to make decisions.
__________________
Visit the Apostolic House Church YouTube Channel!


Biblical Worship - free pdf http://www.pdf-archive.com/2016/02/21/biblicalworship4/

Conditional immortality proven - https://ia800502.us.archive.org/3/it...surrection.pdf

Reply With Quote
  #189  
Old 06-19-2018, 08:23 PM
Esaias's Avatar
Esaias Esaias is offline
Unvaxxed Pureblood


 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Zion aka TEXAS
Posts: 26,174
Re: A Handmaids Tale

Quote:
Originally Posted by Amanah View Post
found an interesting article on it:

The Jesuit Theonomy

In fact the Reformers could not have been reconstructionists in their theology for they set about to DELIBERATELY WRECK the papal theocracy of the Middle Ages, the very ideal of modern theonomists both Jesuit and Reformed.

If they had not been at least, partially successful in deliberately shattering the evil theocracy of the Papacy, WE
WOULD ALL BE IN THE DARK AGES STILL! Why can otherwise intelligent men not see this truth today?
The article is wrong. Roman Catholicism is not and never has been theonomic. The doctrines of Magisterium and Holy tradition preclude theonomy. According to the article, the Reformers were not theonomists, yet the detractors of theonomy also claim the Reformers set up a theonomy in Geneva, and that the Puritans (highly Reformed) also set up theonomies (such as in Salem, Massachusetts). Simply put, one cannot have their cake and eat it too. One cannot claim the Reformers were theonomists, and yet simultaneously opposed to theonomy.

In any event, it doesn't matter one whit whether the Reformers were or were not theonomists. It only matters "What does the BIBLE say?"

The RCC was not theonomic. Their doctrine and practices were and are not based strictly upon the Bible, they did not demand that nations submit to the Bible as the final authority in legislation or jurisprudence, etc. They instead claimed THEY were the final authority on everything. The Roman Catholic system is the height of humanism. Just as Pharisaism was. Just as modern "secular humanism" is. None of them are theonomic.

There will be law. The question is and always has been WHOSE LAW? God's? Or man's?
__________________
Visit the Apostolic House Church YouTube Channel!


Biblical Worship - free pdf http://www.pdf-archive.com/2016/02/21/biblicalworship4/

Conditional immortality proven - https://ia800502.us.archive.org/3/it...surrection.pdf

Reply With Quote
  #190  
Old 06-19-2018, 08:25 PM
Esaias's Avatar
Esaias Esaias is offline
Unvaxxed Pureblood


 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Zion aka TEXAS
Posts: 26,174
Re: A Handmaids Tale

Exodus 22:2-4
(2) If a thief be found breaking up, and be smitten that he die, there shall no blood be shed for him.
(3) If the sun be risen upon him, there shall be blood shed for him; for he should make full restitution; if he have nothing, then he shall be sold for his theft.
(4) If the theft be certainly found in his hand alive, whether it be ox, or ass, or sheep; he shall restore double.

Upon what basis can this be opposed? Will man have a "better idea"? Fines and prison sentences? How's that working out?
__________________
Visit the Apostolic House Church YouTube Channel!


Biblical Worship - free pdf http://www.pdf-archive.com/2016/02/21/biblicalworship4/

Conditional immortality proven - https://ia800502.us.archive.org/3/it...surrection.pdf

Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
An Alien tale FlamingZword Fellowship Hall 29 03-30-2017 04:17 PM
a tale of redemption Ferd Fellowship Hall 33 03-02-2013 08:11 PM
The Tale of the Tares Falla39 Fellowship Hall 0 02-08-2008 03:28 PM
A Tale of Two Saints deacon blues Fellowship Hall 5 12-10-2007 11:24 AM

 
User Infomation
Your Avatar

Latest Threads
- by Amanah

Help Support AFF!

Advertisement




All times are GMT -6. The time now is 05:58 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.