How much information should the saints expect from their pastor? - Page 17

Coonskinner · #**161** 10-11-2007, 10:26 PM

Brad, nothing you quoted identifies saints as "members" in the same sense as ministers are.

They don't pay dues, and they aren't subject to judicial procedure.

We are really arguing a very fine semantical point here, and one that I am about done talking about.

There is definitely an associaton, but that is not the same as membership.

Praxeas · #**162** 10-11-2007, 10:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coonskinner

Brad, nothing you quoted identifies saints as "members" in the same sense as ministers are.

They don't pay dues, and they aren't subject to judicial procedure.

We are really arguing a very fine semantical point here, and one that I am about done talking about.

There is definitely an associaton, but that is not the same as membership.

That doesn't prove they aren't members. It proves they aren't in the same class of membership. I have memberships in certain things that I don't have to pay for, but if I were to become a paid member I would get more perks.

From what was quoted it seems the UPC as a rule recognizes everyone as members of this fellowship.

An analogy can be made in many ways. We are members of the United States and we have certain rights and can even vote, but we can't vote in congress....only a congressman can. We can't vote in the Senate, only a Senator can. So there are different levels of membership

Coonskinner · #**163** 10-11-2007, 10:45 PM

Whatever...you guys enjoy yourselves.

anapko · #**164** 10-11-2007, 10:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

Well that would be up to that local group, and from past experiences church families really don't care what another congregation, fellowship, or community is doing. As far as they are concerned what ever their minister is focusing on is all that matters with them. A congregation wants to know what their minister has on his mind and what anyone else is doing really does not effect them.

Listen anyone here has heard time and time again from their ministers when they would go to a fellowship another church or group that they may see or hear things that are not taught in their local congregation. So those Brothers and Sisters are told that they should handle themselves in a proper manner and not take things the wrong way. Always to keep in mind of the standards that are taught in their perticular congregation.

Same thing with those who choose to stay with the UPCI they will still preach as they always have and teach their people how they always taught them. Time proves all things and we will have to wait and see how everything jells out over the years.

My question is what if he doesn't, does that change anything for the local congregation, I mean if they are not even informed of who the General Superintendent is, then why worry about the other issues?

The Elder is not sidestepping anything, and why bring up an issue that everyone will be looking at him and saying "and.....?" Brother leave it be, I think there is no issue, the Elder has been preaching and teaching and the people are made to feel they are part of the Body of Christ and not Hazelwood.

I cannot see why you all would continue to carry on with this argument with Elder CS.

In Jesus name

Brother Benincasa

www.OnTimeJournal.com

And Coonskinner should be glad to have a spokesperson such as yourself. Brother, the original post asked a simple question, it has veered from answering this question to what I preach or don't preach from the pulpit. As shown by other posts, you, the ministry, don't have to tell the people anything. But if they hear "rumors" supporting an approved resolution, and the pastor doesn't inform his people, then, yes, I would say he's withholding something from them.

anapko · #**165** 10-11-2007, 10:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

My question is what if he doesn't, does that change anything for the local congregation, I mean if they are not even informed of who the General Superintendent is, then why worry about the other issues?

In Jesus name

Brother Benincasa

www.OnTimeJournal.com

Then why have an organization to start with. All the GC's, Music Conferences, Bible Colleges, etc. are meaningless if the pastor will not share what he learns form "fellowship"!

Coonskinner · #**166** 10-11-2007, 11:01 PM

We have a token subscription to the Herald.

We give in offerings to SFC.

Missionaries come by.

I don't care one way or another whether our people can recite all the General Officals or not. It just doesn't matter to me at all.

When I spend time with them, I have better things to talk about than divisive issues that preachers fuss about among themselves, the outcome of which is not going to change their local church any.

I don't see how that could be considered edifying in any way.

If that makes me bad in the eyes of some of you folks, I guess you will just have to pray for me.

If people have been properly taught, they aren't going to be much interested in the in-fighting of politics in religious organizations.

I am very, very thankful that I don't have to pastor some of the attitudes I encounter on this forum.

Some of you might have sweeter spirits if you had something on the brain besides all the upscuttle running through the UPC.

#**167** 10-11-2007, 11:36 PM

Amen. The early Apostolic Church had some divisive issues. Peter and Paul had issues. Paul and Barnabas went seperate ways. There were issues that threatened to tear apart the body of Christ. Some serious doctrinal issues for that time.
But Paul determined not to communicate that as his basis for spreading the gospel. He determined, when he was behind the pulpit (so to speak), the he would preach Christ and Him crucified: ONLY.
Political infighting is not for the pulpit, for the body of christ, for the new babes(killing the milk drinkers with so called meat). If it has Any place, it would be a business meeting (which is also what the voting part of the G.C. is to my knowledge).
Render unto Caesar what is Caesar's, and unto what God what is God's.

#**168** 10-12-2007, 12:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coonskinner

We have a token subscription to the Herald.

We give in offerings to SFC.

Missionaries come by.

I don't care one way or another whether our people can recite all the General Officals or not. It just doesn't matter to me at all.

When I spend time with them, I have better things to talk about than divisive issues that preachers fuss about among themselves, the outcome of which is not going to change their local church any.

I don't see how that could be considered edifying in any way.

If that makes me bad in the eyes of some of you folks, I guess you will just have to pray for me.

If people have been properly taught, they aren't going to be much interested in the in-fighting of politics in religious organizations.

I am very, very thankful that I don't have to pastor some of the attitudes I encounter on this forum.

Some of you might have sweeter spirits if you had something on the brain besides all the upscuttle running through the UPC.

Coonskinner,

why do you even stay lisensed with the UPC, if you do not like them?

#**169** 10-12-2007, 12:29 AM

Ministerial alliances serve the ministry in ways the local congregations serve the saints.
lol.....Why do saints gather together anyway?

Heb 10:22-25
22 Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water.
23 Let us hold fast the profession of our faith without wavering; (for he is faithful that promised
24 And let us consider one another to provoke unto love and to good works:
25 Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching.
(KJV)

Coonskinner · #**170** 10-12-2007, 07:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UltraLib

Coonskinner,

why do you even stay lisensed with the UPC, if you do not like them?

I do not dislike the UPC.

I am not very happy about some of the stuff that has been sifting through the organization lately.

I don't like the fact that this extremely divisive tv resolution was allowed to keep coming back by the resolution committee year after year in a crass abuse of our electoral process, fomenting division and unrest.

I am very much an admirer and supporter of our foreign missions efforts.

I have served in sectional and district offices.

But I don't pastor the church as if it were a daughter work of WEC.

That doesn't mean I don't like the UPC; it just means I try not to let the sometimes fickle meanderings of a minister's fellowship have overwhelming sway in the congregation I am privileged to lead.

Edited to add:

I am very blessed with great leadership locally. My presbyter is one of the finest men I have ever known, and my DS is also a great man. I support them 100%, and they are the main reasons I still remain licensed.