Heretics and Politics by Thomas A. Fudge - Page 16

Reader · #**151** 06-14-2014, 03:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RunningOnFaith

Thank you for this.

Glad to be able to share something helpful.

Disciple4life · #**152** 06-14-2014, 03:10 PM

Oh, thanks for explaining. It would have bothered me all night.

Reader · #**153** 06-14-2014, 03:13 PM

That will be $30.

Disciple4life · #**154** 06-14-2014, 03:26 PM

First you have to write a book about the UPCI and then I will gladly give you $30!

Reader · #**155** 06-14-2014, 03:37 PM

LOL I was hoping to pay for my copy of Heretics by charging you the $30!

Roxanne Murphy · #**156** 06-14-2014, 04:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sabby

Jerry got himself into trouble with Phil Dugas my freshman year. He was the advisor for the senior class. The school had an outing and each class had a skit to do. The senior class did a parody of the bus ministry and the some of the methods that had been used to get kids on the S.S. bus. At the time, PD had four buses and the largest (UPC) bus ministry in PDX. During the senior's skit one of the choruses they sang went something like, "Numbers, numbers, numbers is the name of the game. Just keep them coming through the doors no matter why they came". Bubble gum Sunday took a hit! It didn't matter why they got on the bus, just as long as they GOT on the bus. Coincidentally, there were times that kids were offered things like bubble gum, etc, to attend PD's Sunday school. I think Phil had good motives. He wanted as many kids to learn about Jesus as possible. I think Jerry Dillon had good motives. He was striking out at the obsession with numbers that comes at the expense of true evangelism and discipleship.
Needless to say, PD was furious and personally told me that he considered it an attack on him and his church.
My best friend was a member of the senior class and attending Evangel (Phil Dugas') church. He began to teach home bible studies in his home. He had about 4 months to go to graduate. One of the requirements students of the school had with the Portland area pastors was that they had to select a single church in which they would attend during the school year (usually had a couple of weeks at the beginning of the year to decide which one) and they were forbidden to church hop. It created some problems for those who disagreed with the style or methods or personality of church...they would just have to tough it out for the rest of the year, and they were considered "church members" where they attended. It was actually just free S.S. staffing.
Back to my friend's situation. He was called in to Phil's office and told that he was to cease and desist teaching any more home bible studies. If he continued, Phil threatened to kick him out of the church and he would be unable to graduate as a result. My friend told me that if he wanted to graduate (which he did want to do) he had no choice but to discontinue teaching home bible studies. Phil knew that my friend was a senior and that Jerry Dillon was his advisor. I'm sure that what transpired was in some way connected to Phil's antipathy towards Jerry and secondarily the school

This was Phil Dugas? It sounds more like something His brother Paul would do. I grew up in, and still live in, the Oregon District. Joe Dinwiddie was my first pastor. I was only 5 years old in 1977 but I remember attending Oregon District Camp meeting and a Brother Johnson preaching the camp meeting. I was too young to be aware of any strife back then, but later I came to see Paul Dugas as incredibly critical and rather 'holier-than-thou' persona while on the platform during district meetings that he was 'gracious' enough to attend. Phil Dugas I knew later as one of my instructors at CLC (1991-1993), and then a few years later as pastor of the St. John's church here on the Portland Metro area. Phil seemed much more kind than Paul did.

Steve Epley · #**157** 06-14-2014, 05:26 PM

This may shock some of y'all I was never a member of the UPC as a minister and never attended a UPC church as a saint.

Roxanne Murphy · #**158** 06-14-2014, 05:34 PM

Elder Epley, you are far too conservative to ever be part of the UPC. But your more conservative group has its own terrible moral failing stories, most recently, the man who took over Westberg's church in Kansas. Might we blame those on the strict 'holiness' preaching these men have done? That would be about as fair as blaming Don Fisher's moral failings on his doctrinal positions.

Steve Epley · #**159** 06-14-2014, 07:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roxanne Murphy

Elder Epley, you are far too conservative to ever be part of the UPC. But your more conservative group has its own terrible moral failing stories, most recently, the man who took over Westberg's church in Kansas. Might we blame those on the strict 'holiness' preaching these men have done? That would be about as fair as blaming Don Fisher's moral failings on his doctrinal positions.

Did I say that? Now if I was quoting EY like he was a saint and scholar you would have a point! These folks are fawning over DF like he is a star. Both DF & EY are a reproach to the gospel not someone to be adoring.

Sabby · #**160** 06-14-2014, 07:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roxanne Murphy

This was Phil Dugas? It sounds more like something His brother Paul would do. I grew up in, and still live in, the Oregon District. Joe Dinwiddie was my first pastor. I was only 5 years old in 1977 but I remember attending Oregon District Camp meeting and a Brother Johnson preaching the camp meeting. I was too young to be aware of any strife back then, but later I came to see Paul Dugas as incredibly critical and rather 'holier-than-thou' persona while on the platform during district meetings that he was 'gracious' enough to attend. Phil Dugas I knew later as one of my instructors at CLC (1991-1993), and then a few years later as pastor of the St. John's church here on the Portland Metro area. Phil seemed much more kind than Paul did.

Yes, this was Phil. This is in the context of the Culture of the times.
A question was asked earlier on this thread if the acrimony between the district and the school existed before Don Fisher arrived. Yes, there absolutely was.
If I am not mistaken CLC has its own church(?). CBC didn't have that luxury, although in '78 or '79 (can't remember the year) the school made a proposal to the Portland area pastors to allow any students attending their churches to be able to prioritize school functions OVER local church functions. The PDX area pastors by this time were claiming ownership ( which included staffing of S.S. and financial $upport) of students in their churches. The pastors rejected the proposal OUTRIGHT. These things happened with Gary Geason in Oregon City, Bill Davies in McMinnville, B.A. King in Beaverton, Langley in Hillsboro, Barlow in St Helens, Phil in the church at Killingsworth and Paul in St John's just off Lombard Street. I don't know if they rejected the proposal over doctrinal "purity", needing control, or both.
It only weakened the structural integrity of the school and exascerbated the bad vibe between the school and local area pastors. It seemed that the pastors opposed any promotional activity of the school UNLESS it directly benefited their church.