Twitter-TF Tenney at Jentezn Franklin's 2morrow!

[Jeffrey]

Originally Posted by jfrog

I think there needs to be a major balance between being concerned of what others think and not caring. As a Christian you must care somewhat about your reputation if only for how it expresses Christ but as a person you can't be a people pleaser

And I really feel like the issue is less about others and more about the individual. Though, as you said, presenting Christ honorably, and with character and humility are certainly important, if nothing else, than for no one to see one's dishonesty or laziness as a stumbling block to what is likely a good message.

[Jack Shephard]

Originally Posted by Jeffrey

I'm done.

Seriously, I've seen you interact on posts in this past and thought you had a little more to you that this. It's not even agreement that I'm talking about.

I have a lot to me...if you knew you would love me...everyone does. If you are not talk about agreement they why in the name of heaven have you spent the better part of 2 days trying to convience me to change points of view and AGREE with you? Seriously bro. I have not seen you post much cause I have not paid that much attention to AFF in almost a year. But I expect that even though people disagree that you could still talk about something and debate with out hurting feelings....hope I haven't hurt any feelings cause that is not even close to what I have tried to do. IF so then forgive me.

[jfrog]

Originally Posted by JTULLOCK

Look bro, I never dropped the JF thing. You brought him up as being the accused all I am doing is saying that there is nothing wrong, in my eyes with using someone elses sermon every now and again. If someone accuses JF or any other minister of stealing based on 2 sermons they have heard from a person and that is their leg that their arguement is standing on then that is a shaky leg, IMO.

I agree. Two sermons of the 100ish a year really don't mean much except those sermons really inspired the preacher that is preaching them.

[Jeffrey]

Originally Posted by JTULLOCK

I have a lot to me...if you knew you would love me...everyone does. If you are not talk about agreement they why in the name of heaven have you spent the better part of 2 days trying to convience me to change points of view and AGREE with you? Seriously bro. I have not seen you post much cause I have not paid that much attention to AFF in almost a year. But I expect that even though people disagree that you could still talk about something and debate with out hurting feelings....hope I haven't hurt any feelings cause that is not even close to what I have tried to do. IF so then forgive me.

Because you've viewed our entire interaction with the hubris that it was all about your agreement, not about the subjection of "plagiarism in the pulpit" and so we've chased emotional rabbits. I enjoy good conversation about topics. We naturally went down the road... or we turned toward that road because we've never quite made that trek together. You insisted on staying put because you thought I was going to pull a fast one on you.

Hurt feelings? Did I miss something again? A little disingenuous are we?

[CC1]

Originally Posted by Hoovie

Soooo was this event online at all?

Yes. It was on streaming faith. I assume they will archive it. I tuned in so late I only got to watch Madonna close out the service with a song.

Very impressive audience size for a mid week service!

[Jeffrey]

Originally Posted by jfrog

I agree. Two sermons of the 100ish a year really don't mean much except those sermons really inspired the preacher that is preaching them.

Okay back to JF...

Who said it was two sermons? Allegations purport it was much more than that. Either way, if they are two sermons word-for-word, without referencing anything else, and misleading people as if they are your own inspired thoughts, that's unfortunate. Especially when you make the money guys like JF do for speaking.

If it's not true -- then great. I don't know if it is or not! But a larger issue surfaced on this thread: "is it right to plagiarize in the pulpit?"

[Jack Shephard]

Originally Posted by Jeffrey

I agree and we've asked this before on the thread.

"I don't think it's not important" doesn't really answer the question. Why is it not important? Why NOT cite? What are you afraid of?

Not afraid of anything. If I used something and thought it needed citing I would do it. Thing is if I use a sermon I heard somewhere I don't think it needs be cited UNLESS there is a point that there is no way I would came up with. But even then I don't it is a 'have to' thing but maybe an extra courtesy.

Originally Posted by Jeffrey

Seriously?? First you defend JF's plagiarism. Then you defend JF that he DIDN'T plagiarize. Am I missing something here?

I didn't defend plagiarism. I said I don't consider it plagairism to use a thought or something some one else came up with. I just don't. So far as I can see it if a person even uses word-for-word it is no deal. I would see it as it must have ministered to this person or they wouldn't be using it.

Originally Posted by jfrog

I think there needs to be a major balance between being concerned of what others think and not caring. As a Christian you must care somewhat about your reputation if only for how it expresses Christ but as a person you can't be a people pleaser

One thing that I have learned in life is that we Christians have a bad name mainly because of other Christians. However, there are people that will develop an opinion based on something very small and from then on that is their opinion. I am sure Jeffrey now has a certain opinion of me. That is cool. With me I try very hard to not develop a strong opinion, good or bad, on anyone cause we are human and we aren't perfect so why set lofted views of someone all the time. I see everyone for who they are, human.

[Jeffrey]

This guy was particularly offended recently. I felt this blog and the comments on it represent quite an overreaction to what was said in humor about JF's experiences at his local church growing up, and about specific people. I've heard worse in MANY conference speaker's sermons (in the UPC). But, this blog I am referencing due to the issue of plagiarism. The blog owner says he has "proof" in the form of preaching tapes/cds/mp3s, that when matched up are almost identical. Who knows...



http://ryanaustindean.wordpress.com/...little-secret/

[jfrog]

Originally Posted by Jeffrey

Okay back to JF...

Who said it was two sermons? Allegations purport it was much more than that. Either way, if they are two sermons word-for-word, without referencing anything else, and misleading people as if they are your own inspired thoughts, that's unfortunate. Especially when you make the money guys like JF do for speaking.

If it's not true -- then great. I don't know if it is or not! But a larger issue surfaced on this thread: "is it right to plagiarize in the pulpit?"

I know nothing about JF or anyone else mentioned on this thread. I was just making a general statement. Now if this JF did many more than 2 then he did wrong. If it wasn't many then my general statement covers his situation

[Jack Shephard]

Originally Posted by Jeffrey

Because you've viewed our entire interaction with the hubris that it was all about your agreement, not about the subjection of "plagiarism in the pulpit" and so we've chased emotional rabbits. I enjoy good conversation about topics. We naturally went down the road... or we turned toward that road because we've never quite made that trek together. You insisted on staying put because you thought I was going to pull a fast one on you.

Hurt feelings? Did I miss something again? A little disingenuous are we?

The topic of plagiarism in the pulpit is such a NON issue to me seriously.

Not disingenous here. I was making sure that nothing I said hurt any feeling. I guess I am trying to make sure I have a good reputation...wink wink