my friend, "MIssion Accomplised" was the correct asessment of what those particular sailors did who were returning after that phase was over.
GWB on the deck of that Carrier STATED that the WAR was NOT over and we had a long road ahead.
this thing that you are repeating is quite a diservice to the men and women who fought so valiantly during those early days in Iraq.
Ferd as a military brat, I'm going to nip that last statement in the bud. I know from the first hand stories of my father, the frustrations of Vietnam. Most of my frustration is with the disregard for those who have fought valiantly (in freaking unarmored jeeps or walking down the street playing soccer with kids so as not to appear like an occupying force...so that they get a nice little blurb on the evening news). I'm sick of seeing kids born in the '80's having funeral services ...for what?
__________________
There are no weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, Chuck Norris lives in Houston.
Either the United States will destroy ignorance, or ignorance will destroy the United States. – W.E.B. DuBois
Dt. that region is a powder keg. Most American have no concept of tribalism and sectarian feelings. If you think that Iraq is a nation of one people who are going to rise up together and forget about that whole little Sunni Shiite thing because we come bearing democracy, you are just as misled as some of our policy makers.
We have upset the apple cart and we were banking on national patriotism overriding the centuries of sectarian history. A "new" country like America that was founded as a republic and thinks along those lines will never understand this. What works for us and countries like us, work because it matches well with how our society was structured from the beginning.
This whole concept that we will give them the opportunity to "rise up" and become like us is what is naive. We are dealing with issues that are ten times as old as our nation.
tstew i dotn want them to be like us my man, and i know about the sectarianism in iraq, i am not talking about the ethnic divides i am talking about the terrorist and foreigners there from iran and other countries that foment the conflict killin all that get in there way for there own political agendas, they are the ones the iraqi people should rise against, dt
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A product of a pentecostal raisin, I am a hard man, just ask my children
Dt. that region is a powder keg. Most American have no concept of tribalism and sectarian feelings. If you think that Iraq is a nation of one people who are going to rise up together and forget about that whole little Sunni Shiite thing because we come bearing democracy, you are just as misled as some of our policy makers.
We have upset the apple cart and we were banking on national patriotism overriding the centuries of sectarian history. A "new" country like America that was founded as a republic and thinks along those lines will never understand this. What works for us and countries like us, work because it matches well with how our society was structured from the beginning.
This whole concept that we will give them the opportunity to "rise up" and become like us is what is naive. We are dealing with issues that are ten times as old as our nation.
i think we are banking on the ideals of freedom and democracy. NOT nationalism.
I do agree that part of the neo-conserivitive view ie "rise up" thing was off. that doesnt mean we just cut and run. we leave and the whole area destablizes and Iran controls everything.
not a solid option.
__________________ If I do something stupid blame the Lortab!
We live in sad times. It's so hard to watch America going down the toilet- heartbreaking. And to see so many people,
especially God's people decieved in these last and evil days
Ferd as a military brat, I'm going to nip that last statement in the bud. I know from the first hand stories of my father, the frustrations of Vietnam. Most of my frustration is with the disregard for those who have fought valiantly (in freaking unarmored jeeps or walking down the street playing soccer with kids so as not to appear like an occupying force...so that they get a nice little blurb on the evening news). I'm sick of seeing kids born in the '80's having funeral services ...for what?
Well, speaking as a Military man who fought in Desert Storm, and as a man who has 2 uncles who fought in Vietnam.... and who majored in history in college, I disagree.
__________________ If I do something stupid blame the Lortab!
tstew i dotn want them to be like us my man, and i know about the sectarianism in iraq, i am not talking about the ethnic divides i am talking about the terrorist and foreigners there from iran and other countries that foment the conflict killin all that get in there way for there own political agendas, they are the ones the iraqi people should rise against, dt
Yes, but due to the teaching of their society and religion, there will always be those who see us as the "terrorist and foreigners there from iran and other countries that foment the conflict killin all that get in there way for there own political agendas".
And you're still saying what the "Iraqi people" should do. Once again a republic centered view of them. The reality is that you have people who are Sunni or Shiite first and Iraqi a very distant second.
__________________
There are no weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, Chuck Norris lives in Houston.
Either the United States will destroy ignorance, or ignorance will destroy the United States. – W.E.B. DuBois
Ferd as a military brat, I'm going to nip that last statement in the bud. I know from the first hand stories of my father, the frustrations of Vietnam. Most of my frustration is with the disregard for those who have fought valiantly (in freaking unarmored jeeps or walking down the street playing soccer with kids so as not to appear like an occupying force...so that they get a nice little blurb on the evening news). I'm sick of seeing kids born in the '80's having funeral services ...for what?
As the parent of a United States Marine who served two tours in Iraq in the most dangerous places at the time (Fallujah and then Ramadi) I agree 100% with Ferd.
Those of you who claim us opposing Obama are just repeating what the "talking heads" say should take your own advice.
As Ferd said GWB made it clear in that speech on that carrier that the war was far from over and that difficult times lay ahead.
The lib media who hates GWB chooses to ignore all of that and focus on the banner congratulating the men and women of that ship on THEIR mission being done.
Well, speaking as a Military man who fought in Desert Storm, and as a man who has 2 uncles who fought in Vietnam.... and who majored in history in college, I disagree.
Disagree with what?
__________________
There are no weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, Chuck Norris lives in Houston.
Either the United States will destroy ignorance, or ignorance will destroy the United States. – W.E.B. DuBois
We live in sad times. It's so hard to watch America going done the toilet- heartbreaking. And to see so many people,
especially God's people decieved in these last and evil days
It's ok Mark. We will continue to pray for tstew!!!
As the parent of a United States Marine who served two tours in Iraq in the most dangerous places at the time (Fallujah and then Ramadi) I agree 100% with Ferd.
Those of you who claim us opposing Obama are just repeating what the "talking heads" say should take your own advice.
As Ferd said GWB made it clear in that speech on that carrier that the war was far from over and that difficult times lay ahead.
The lib media who hates GWB chooses to ignore all of that and focus on the banner congratulating the men and women of that ship on THEIR mission being done.
Everyone recognizes the the White House was greviously off in their estimate of the time, money, lives, and resources that it was going to take to "win" this war. My point is that people who understand the world and that part of the world were saying what I'm saying from the beginning.
__________________
There are no weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, Chuck Norris lives in Houston.
Either the United States will destroy ignorance, or ignorance will destroy the United States. – W.E.B. DuBois
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