If You Sin Are You Lost Until You Repent?

[1ofthechosen]

Originally Posted by Costeon

My question has to do with that period of time between someone falling short of the glory of God and recognizing it and turning back to God in confession and repentance. Are they lost during that time?

Ok so this was the real question? If so, its not what was stated originally.

But my only question would be is what do you mean by they didn't recognize it? Are you talking about sins of Commission? While that's not in the Bible, but is that what you mean?

[Costeon]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

Yes he is cut off from fellowship with God but retains his salvation while the Lord works his chastening in their life. Whenever it seems right to the sovereign God to blot the person out he will.

I think this sounds right. It seems consistent with the Father-Child metaphor so prominent in the NT that is used of our relationship with God. Does a father simply boot the child from the home any time the child fails, or does he discipline him because he is a beloved member of the family?

As you say, when a person is blotted out is only according to the sovereign decision of God and not something we could know definitively.

As to how they will know I'm not sure. Maybe they will know it or maybe they will be turned over to the delusion they are still saved.

I'm not sure either, but I guess I have tended to think it would be that they had no sense of or desire for being in relationship with God anymore. They would no longer feel a desire to repent and be right with God. That is, they would have a reprobate mind and a seared conscience.

[Costeon]

Originally Posted by 1ofthechosen

Ok so this was the real question? If so, its not what was stated originally.

But my only question would be is what do you mean by they didn't recognize it? Are you talking about sins of Commission? While that's not in the Bible, but is that what you mean?

I originally said, "When I first got into church, I was taught that when believers sin they are lost until they ask for forgiveness and "get back under the blood."

My question was about this "until" period. I have tried to state several times that I am asking if a believer is lost from the time they have committed a sin until they have sought God for forgiveness.

I don't want to complicate things. I'm talking about anything God says is sin, sins of commission or omission, whatever. Are we lost at the moment we have committed any sin and do we remain so until we have sought God for forgiveness?

I am talking about believers who truly desire to walk with God and obey him, not those that just flagrantly disregard him and couldn't care less about his word.

[1ofthechosen]

Originally Posted by Costeon

I originally said, "When I first got into church, I was taught that when believers sin they are lost until they ask for forgiveness and "get back under the blood."

My question was about this "until" period. I have tried to state several times that I am asking if a believer is lost from the time they have committed a sin until they have sought God for forgiveness.

I don't want to complicate things. I'm talking about anything God says is sin, sins of commission or omission, whatever. Are we lost at the moment we have committed any sin and do we remain so until we have sought God for forgiveness?

I am talking about believers who truly desire to walk with God and obey him, not those that just flagrantly disregard him and couldn't care less about his word.

But it doesn't explain they sinned and didn't recognize it. You have become very casual in your approach to the things of God when you sin and no longer notice it. I believe we all know when we sin, and at those times we need to confess before God.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Costeon

Well said, Aquila. Very good.
"Love is the key to all." Yes indeed. And who is perfected in love now? Not me. But I'm trying.

Trying to learn how to surrender and crucify self is the greatest of challenges in a world so focused on "performance".

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by 1ofthechosen

They went from thou shalt not in the OT to If you love me you shall keep my commandments in the NT. Anything that doesn't please God if we love Him we shouldnt do it. We can't make a list but if you become a student of the Word they will be easy to decipher.

I believe that in context, Ezekiel was referencing the Law of Moses. Now, we can extrapolate that into how God would now desire the church to obey the Law of Christ, as Israel was admonished to keep the statutes of the Law of Moses. Because of the difference in covenant, many often take these passages and march believers out from the shadow of the cross to a place of keeping selected Mosaic laws. Which will ultimately cause them to lose their souls.

Galatians 5:4
Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.

[1ofthechosen]

Originally Posted by Aquila

I believe that in context, Ezekiel was referencing the Law of Moses. Now, we can extrapolate that into how God would now desire the church to obey the Law of Christ, as Israel was admonished to keep the statutes of the Law of Moses. Because of the difference in covenant, many often take these passages and march believers out from the shadow of the cross to a place of keeping selected Mosaic laws. Which will ultimately cause them to lose their souls.

Galatians 5:4
Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.

We all have to follow the moral law forever. But no you don't have to sacrifice animals, or not cut your beard or have one for that matter. Some of that was the civil law, and some the ceremonial law. In that we don't have to follow it. Bur you have to follow the moral law forever, and that falls under desiring to please God above all else. There is still statutes we have to follow.

[Costeon]

Originally Posted by 1ofthechosen

But it doesn't explain they sinned and didn't recognize it. You have become very casual in your approach to the things of God when you sin and no longer notice it. I believe we all know when we sin, and at those times we need to confess before God.

Perhaps not for you, but I'm sure there are many times when it takes a while for the Spirit to fully lead someone to realize that they have, for example, not loved their enemies or have violated God's will in some other way. So my question is, From the time a sin has been committed and someone has sought God for forgiveness, are they lost?

[Costeon]

Originally Posted by Aquila

Trying to learn how to surrender and crucify self is the greatest of challenges in a world so focused on "performance".

Indeed.

And so my question has been, In our struggle to surrender to God and to crucify self--something I apparently have found much more difficult than many others have--when we fail to do so and thus sin, are we lost at that moment and do we remain so until we have sought God for forgiveness?

[1ofthechosen]

Originally Posted by Costeon

Perhaps not for you, but I'm sure there are many times when it takes a while for the Spirit to fully lead someone to realize that they have, for example, not loved their enemies or have violated God's will in some other way. So my question is, From the time a sin has been committed and someone has sought God for forgiveness, are they lost?

They are severed from having fellowship with God. We know that hell is a complete absence and separation from God, so with that said it's a step in that direction. They are definitely on the way to being lost. If they died beforehand they made it right, they would be lost yes.