Grace Verse Legalism

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by Sherri

That's exactly what we thought of when we read those verses. Holiness and the way you look were one and the same in my mind.

Its really ridiculous, isn't it?

"Be ye holy, for I am holy." Okay, how do you dress, God?

[Rhoni]

Originally Posted by mfblume

Its really ridiculous, isn't it?

"Be ye holy, for I am holy." Okay, how do you dress, God?

[mfblume]

Someone needs to make a little cartoon of that and put it in the bulletin.

[stmatthew]

I think one issue that needs to be addressed here is that Grace is not Lawlessness. Grace is only in effect in ones life as they yield to the Spirit and allow the Law of the Spirit to work its work in their heart. And we cannot take away the importance of the hearing of the Word of God either. God has placed leaders over the flock to use the Word of God to preach sound doctrine, reprove, bring correction, and instruct the saint in the ways of righteousness. The balance to this discussion is that Grace without the Word of God is not Grace at all. Grace instructs the receiver to separate themselves from worldliness and unrighteousness, and live righteous and sober. Those that continue to love this present world with its "things" do not possess Grace.

[Scott Hutchinson]

Grace teaches us to deny ungodliness,so we if abide in grace,our lifestyle will refelect the Holiness Of God,because grace is a Holy gift of God.
A result of true regeneration is sanctification.

[mfblume]

Something is very interesting in the thought of grace versus legalism. Galatians 5 is in the midst of Paul's rebuttal against the Galatian believers' desire to incorporate Judaic Law into the Christianity. Paul said that following Law does not deal with the flesh and its inclinations towards wrong. The Galatians were soon biting one another, and were in danger of Devouring one another! This is a commonality amongst legalists. Fussing and fighting. This is much like the dilemma of trying to do good by law-keeping, but finding oneself doing evil instead, in Romans 7.

The same goals that law tried to achieve in man are accomplished through grace! If we are led by the Spirit, through reliance upon the Spirit and not reliance upon self effort, we shall not fulfill the lusts of the flesh! And we will not see flesh rise up and damage each other, which is so common amongst legalists.

No law is against the fruit of the Spirit which Spirit-leading provides. Spirit leading is the walk of grace. If people claim to be Spirit-led and living in grace, but sin and smite others they are liars.

BY THEIR FRUITS YOU SHALL KNOW THEM.

[meBNme]

Originally Posted by Rhoni

Ron, Last time I checked...Pastors were people/sheep and they are also 'dumb' as you call it. Jesus is the Sheperd and not the Pastor. The pastor's job is to feed the sheep not kill them.

You have to let new converts observe and learn you should allow the spirit of God to convict. God does not need a saints help to address modesty with new converts...unless they ask. If you address it before God does then they are not going to own the conviction they will be assimilating into Apostolic culture...and it won't last.

Blessings, Rhoni

This is one I certainly agree with.
I also strongly believe that the Bible requires a standard in our lives, and it is sin not to follow it.

[meBNme]

Originally Posted by mfblume

Also, legalists usually do not know what legalism is. Grace is where God empowers us to change and legalism is where we do it through human energy without dependence upon God's power whatsoever.

Agreed, but the fine line many people don't (or won't) see, is that while changing through human energy without dependence on Gods power is a recipe for failure, it does not eliminate the absolute necessity for change.

Some folks think that "Since I shouldn't be a certain way simply because of mans teachings, that means I don't have to pay heed to any of it at all."
Regardless of the fact that sometimes, some of the teachings are purely biblical.
No, not all maybe, but those that are only teachings do not discount the ones that have biblical basis.

[meBNme]

Originally Posted by jaamez

Amen. The attitude is "God's grace isn't really enough, we'll have to restrain them by giving them a code of conduct or rule book." The rule book is the Bible, and the tutor is the Holy Ghost.

But what if.... what if some of those codes of conduct, some of those rules, really ARE reflections of what the bible teaches is the will of God in our lives?

What then?

[meBNme]

Originally Posted by Steve Epley

As much as it displeases the graceless crowd that sees the preacher as the main hindrance to spiritual growth allow me to SHARE what the scriptures teach:

1. "faith cometh by hearing" Rom. 10:17......
a. man is justified by faith Rom. 5:1......
b. we are children of God by faith Gal.3:26......
c. without faith it is impossible to please God.. Heb. 11:6......
d. we overcome by faith 1Jn. 5:4 Now go and weep "HOW SHALL THEY HEAR WITHOUT A PREACHER?" Rom. 10:14The ULTIMATE grace preacher said "... it PLEASED GOD(it doesn't please renegades and rebels) by the foolishness of PREACHING to SAVE them that believe." 1Cor. 1:21 Not theraptists-arm chair referees-educators-attorneys-you get the picture. PREACHING preached by PREACHERS gives faith to be saved and equips saints to continue to be saved.

By the way:

It is NT doctrine about ladies hair 1Cor. 11:1-16

It is NT doctrine that teaches modesty in dress 1Tim. 2:9

It is NT doctrine that teaches against wearing gold 1Tim. 2:9

It is NT doctrine It is NT doctrine that teaches separation from the world 2Cor. 6:19

It is NT doctrine that teaches ministerial authority Heb. 13: 7, 17, 21

Genuine BIBLICAL grace teaches AGAINST doing certain things and do do certain things Titus 2:11-13

Galatians is speaking about circumcission, animal sacrifices, holidays, the ceremonial law. Grace gives NO one liberty to commit adultery-fornication-steal-murder-etc.
See Gal. 5:18-23.

Very good, thank you for that.