Oftentimes it is just seeing it as it is meant to be seen.
Joh 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
Water & Spirit Baptism.
You said it yourself seeing how it was intended....not W/S. I agree with Baron it takes alot of baggage to get W/S out of this. Anyone that sees W/S out of this it is probably because that is what they were taught. Like I said they hear the voice of the pastor or another preacher talking about this. I am serious if a person can read this without the OP rosey glasses they will see it is plainly not talking W/S.
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"If we don't learn to live together we're gonna die alone"
Jack Shephard.
That's how I see it. Plainly. But the arguments that I only am seeing what I want to see, or what I've been taught, don't describe me.
There are too many other scriptures.
If someone throws out W/S solely because they see John 3:3 a little differently than before, they aren't reading the same Bible I have.
__________________ Mrs. LPW
Psalm 19:14
Let the words of my mouth, and the meditation of my heart, be acceptable in thy sight, O LORD, my strength, and my redeemer.
Is being born again the same as getting saved? If so take note of the way the Apostles preached for men to be saved.
See if you can find water and spirit in these places where SALVATION is preached.
38: Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. Acts 2:38
14: Now when the apostles which were at Jerusalem heard that Samaria had received the word of God, they sent unto them Peter and John:
15: Who, when they were come down, prayed for them, that they might receive the Holy Ghost:
16: (For as yet he was fallen upon none of them: only they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.)
17: Then laid they their hands on them, and they received the Holy Ghost. Acts 8:14-17
44: While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.
45: And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.
46: For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter,
47: Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?
48: And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days. Acts 10:10:44-48
4: Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.
5: When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.
6: And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied. Acts 19:4-6
The Apostles always seem to mention water and spirit when preaching how to get saved. And it always points us to them being baptized in water and receiving the spirit.
I have never embraced the outward standards. The standard that Oneness teaches I do embrace is Repentance, water baptism, the Holy Spirit baptism is the new birth.
Go Sox!!!! We agree on more than one thing!
__________________ Mrs. LPW
Psalm 19:14
Let the words of my mouth, and the meditation of my heart, be acceptable in thy sight, O LORD, my strength, and my redeemer.
Oftentimes it is just seeing it as it is meant to be seen.
Joh 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
Water & Spirit Baptism.
Yes, in the context of several other verses, one sentence by itself can rarely be understood. Isolating a verse and reading into it your own preconceived ideas is called Isogesis.
Is being born again the same as getting saved? If so take note of the way the Apostles preached for men to be saved.
See if you can find water and spirit in these places where SALVATION is preached.
38: Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. Acts 2:38
14: Now when the apostles which were at Jerusalem heard that Samaria had received the word of God, they sent unto them Peter and John:
15: Who, when they were come down, prayed for them, that they might receive the Holy Ghost:
16: (For as yet he was fallen upon none of them: only they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.)
17: Then laid they their hands on them, and they received the Holy Ghost. Acts 8:14-17
44: While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.
45: And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.
46: For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter,
47: Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?
48: And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days. Acts 10:10:44-48
4: Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.
5: When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.
6: And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied. Acts 19:4-6
The Apostles always seem to mention water and spirit when preaching how to get saved. And it always points us to them being baptized in water and receiving the spirit.
I have never embraced the outward standards. The standard that Oneness teaches I do embrace is Repentance, water baptism, the Holy Spirit baptism is the new birth.
And yet Peter's very next sermon is ignored.
Acts 3:19 Repent therefore and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, so that times of refreshing may come from the presence of the Lord,
That's how I see it. Plainly. But the arguments that I only am seeing what I want to see, or what I've been taught, don't describe me.
There are too many other scriptures.
If someone throws out W/S solely because they see John 3:3 a little differently than before, they aren't reading the same Bible I have.
It does seem to describe you based on your rebuttles. I do not know you personally, but I am just giving my opinion. You say there are other W/S verses give me some that actually say that. I know most of what OP' use and most of them are not accurate. Michael gave some, but what I gather from reading these are that the response to the gospel was baptism and many received the HG, but there is no inferrence that W/S was salvation.
__________________
"If we don't learn to live together we're gonna die alone"
Jack Shephard.
That's how I see it. Plainly. But the arguments that I only am seeing what I want to see, or what I've been taught, don't describe me.
There are too many other scriptures.
If someone throws out W/S solely because they see John 3:3 a little differently than before, they aren't reading the same Bible I have.
Thing that most of these guys on here don't realize is this, I never take any ones word on Scripture-alone.
I search it out.
However, to see that in the context of this Scripture and say unless you are alive and get Spirit born--doesn't make sense, just for that scripture alone.
If that is what God intended, then he would have just said, "unless you are born of the Spirit."
Yes, in the context of several other verses, one sentence by itself can rarely be understood. Isolating a verse and reading into it your own preconceived ideas is called Isogesis.
good words Baron
__________________
"If we don't learn to live together we're gonna die alone"
Jack Shephard.
Thing that most of these guys on here don't realize is this, I never take any ones word on Scripture-alone.
I search it out.
However, to see that in the context of this Scripture and say unless you are alive and get Spirit born--doesn't make sense, just for that scripture alone.
If that is what God intended, then he would have just said, "unless you are born of the Spirit."
Not true. Jesus said you must be born AGAIN. Nick asked how and Jesus told him. First you have to be naturally born and then spiritually born. By the way no mention of tongues here either.
__________________
"If we don't learn to live together we're gonna die alone"
Jack Shephard.
Yes, in the context of several other verses, one sentence by itself can rarely be understood. Isolating a verse and reading into it your own preconceived ideas is called Isogesis.
Taking verses and twisting them into something else as a lot of those who try to dispute W/S Doctrine is called wresting the scriptures.
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