Baptizing Minors...

[Margies3]

I was baptized as a 14 year old.

I had been raised in the Missionary Church where they only did baptismal services once a year. Months before that planned service I repented of my sins.

We had a lady attending the Missionary Church at that time who had come from First Apostolic. When she heard that a couple of us were asking to be baptized but that it wasn't going to happen for about 7 or 8 months, she offered to take us "to a place where we could be baptized immediately". No mention of the method. Just that it was by immersion, which the Missionary Church also teaches.

I went to my parents and talked to them about it. They objected because they didn't know enough about this other church. But they did allow me to attend there with Lois.

After I had gone for 3 weeks, Lois asked if I still wanted to be baptized. I said I did. She casually mentioned that they baptize in Jesus' Name instead of the titles like the Missionary Church does, but told me that it was basically the same thing. She then took me to Bro Stroup who asked if i understood what baptism was and that I was being baptized in Jesus' Name. I assured him that I did. He never asked if my parents knew or cared. I assume that if he would have known they objected, he would not have baptized me. Maybe because Lois brought me he assumed it was ok? I don't know. Anyhow he went ahead and did it.

My parents were FURIOUS when they found out. Of course, I was able to talk them out of their anger pretty quickly. But now looking back, I have to tell you: if that was my child I would be at the next service and people would remember that service for a VERY LONG TIME!!!

[missdkendall]

I think if the minor understand fully what it means there should be no problem. Unless of couse the parents do not want them to be baptized. I would think a parent would be proud that the child is taking that step!

[SDG]

Originally Posted by Baron1710

I must first say that this is not legal advice.

I kicked the question around the office and no one could come up with a legitimate reason for a parent to prevail in a lawsuit however that would not stop someone from filing a lawsuit and the church or the pastor having to pay to defend it.

It would be a advisable to receive WRITTEN parental consent prior to the baptism of a minor. Verbal consent becomes a battle of credibility. I would not reserve parental consent forms just for those whose parents are not involved in the church. From a legal standpoint that consent form helps cover your backside. It does not cover you if you hold the child under until they drown. Consent does not apply to negligent conduct.

I wonder what our other resident counselors, James Griffin and Newman, think of this matter.

[SDG]

I'd also pay to hear Bro. Epley's viewpoint on the matter especially if the parents refuse ...

I know he feels getting the baptism performed is a matter of spiritual life and death.

This post has stayed in embedded in my mind:

Originally Posted by Steve Epley

I took a tank to the home of a 84 year old stroke victim and we baptized him in Jesus name and he recieved the Holy Ghost and died that week. Where there is a will there is a way. It took 4 of us to baptize him but we got it done.

[TreyKerux]

Before I reply to some posts, my word usage for "kosher" is not in the jewish manner.... I use the term all the time in slang as to mean "proper or complete and with good taste" Don't read into more into that that. Look for your arguments elsewhere.

As some have said, the topic of this thread is NOT whether or not baptism is required for salvation, this teen obviously feels the need for it as the Bible teaches it that way.

I do not adhere to easy-believism. If you do, and would like to debate the please do so by all means, but you can take said debate to the 1-stepper vs 3-stepper thread or where ever else you would like.
I'm not here to debate, I'm here to ask if anyone has been in the situation and has any appropriate paperwork that would help this process and also try to help keep us out of any problematic situations.

Originally Posted by Sept5SavedTeen

I was baptized in secret at 15...

What can happen LEGALLY if a young person is baptized without parental consent?

GOD BLESS!
Bro. Alex

Two local church's have been sued over under-age baptisms, one received verbal consent, but the parent later changed their mind AFTER the baptism, the other church didn't bother asking at all.... Neither case ended up favorable of the parent, but each cost those churches a sizable amount of legal fees.... Point is, if the parents want to cause problems they will easily do so if they know you don't have written consent.

Originally Posted by jaxfam6

I still think something is wrong with the fact that the pastor did not give this person anything more than a vague reference to slips of paper and doing it right. Why is HE not involved in this? Why is HE not taking the lead and SHOWING or TEACHING this person what they should be doing in such a case? I personally have a problem with that. He is the pastor of the church for crying out loud, he should be taking the lead on this and talking with the family. That to me is a lack of care or concern and a lack of leadership.
Of course this is just all MY opinion.

This is a place where everyone has the right to have their opinion, but I don't remember reading in the rules that members have the right to attack Godly leadership.
A little background would help the understanding.... I've been around the church for over a decade, I know how most things are run as I have been involved with each department over the years.... My Pastor trusts me and my judgment and my experience....or else he and the assistant pastor would not have installed me as youth pastor.
I am the one who usually develops the permission slips for the various functions that include the youth. We have'nt had a working/active youth group with a youth pastor for a long time, the last one that we did have took the few form permission slips he made with him when he left, so I have to build everything in this youth group from scratch, and in doing so I have both my pastor and assistant pastor's full support.
Anyone who has met my pastor would tell you he has anything but a lack of caring.... this man cares about souls to a fault some times......And as far as his leadership, he trusts me to be able to to reshape this group and form a working and healthy youth department due to the leadership that he has shown over the years and put into me.....

Originally Posted by jaxfam6

I still want to know why the pastor is putting this all off onto the youth leaders and not taking an active role in getting permission and TEACHING the youth leaders how he feels it should be done. Doesn't seem that he even gave them paperwork just told him the need to get the parents permission and make sure all was in order. Why not take an active role in it since YOU ARE THE PASTOR?????? I am still wondering why that has not been a problem for anyone.

Again, please read the above. Its a trust issue between him and I. He trusts I can get the job done.
Maybe the other people understand its not the pastor's job to do EVERYTHING and they don't jump to conclusions? *shrug*

Originally Posted by Baron1710

I must first say that this is not legal advice.

I kicked the question around the office and no one could come up with a legitimate reason for a parent to prevail in a lawsuit however that would not stop someone from filing a lawsuit and the church or the pastor having to pay to defend it.

It would be a advisable to receive WRITTEN parental consent prior to the baptism of a minor. Verbal consent becomes a battle of credibility. I would not reserve parental consent forms just for those whose parents are not involved in the church. From a legal standpoint that consent form helps cover your backside. It does not cover you if you hold the child under until they drown. Consent does not apply to negligent conduct.

Exactly.

The main issue here is that we have always had the good pleasure to baptize youth of members of the church and those that are getting baptized at the same time or relied on verbal consent to those who where like me, having no parents in the church.... but after what has been going on with other local churches getting sued, we are becoming more conscience of the need to protect us while still doing everything we can to save the lost.

Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea

I'd also pay to hear Bro. Epley's viewpoint on the matter especially if the parents refuse ...

I know he feels getting the baptism performed is a matter of spiritual life and death.

This post has stayed in embedded in my mind:

Interestingly enough...I have another young person that wants to be baptized, but the mother and grandmother adamantly refuse to let her be baptized, thus "joining our non-Baptist church" BTW this is the only church that this girl has ever attended, and has been doing so for about 4 years or more..... The only thing I am told we are able to do is wait until she turns 18 (few years away) and pray that the family changes their mind before then.....but lately I've been wondering......



__________________
If you find any portion of this post offensive or disrespectful, I do apologize. I am told I have been abruptly blunt as of late and I do not mean to be rude.

[Pragmatist]

Originally Posted by Stephen Hoover

No I don't much care to - since the discussion would quickly get blurred by folks sharing personal anecdotes.

I am in favor of an adult believers baptism. Baptism of babies/small children - I am just not sure about. Many arguements used against infant baptism also apply to baptisim of three year olds.

I do know He is the source of all faith, and His grace is sufficient!

Start a new thread.

I was baptized at 6 and I think I was too young, didn't do it for the right reasons and I have pondered being baptized again many times.

[Timmy]

Originally Posted by S.Hart

When baptizing minors, make sure they are taller than the water or that they can swim. Otherwise don't leave them unattended

After he was dunked, my son actually did swim out of the baptistry. It was hilarious!

[HeavenlyOne]

I've seen the posts about parents should be proud of their children wanting to get baptised, or people who will speak to the parents about the importance of baptism in the hopes of educating them to allow their children to be baptised, but nobody has yet to address the beliefs of the parents that might see our baptism as a way of erasing what baptism they believe is correct.

For many, baptism is very important. While they may allow their children to attend SS, being 'saved' in that church might not be what they think is in their child's best interest. That's something to think about.

[Sam]

Originally Posted by HeavenlyOne

I've seen the posts about parents should be proud of their children wanting to get baptised, or people who will speak to the parents about the importance of baptism in the hopes of educating them to allow their children to be baptised, but nobody has yet to address the beliefs of the parents that might see our baptism as a way of erasing what baptism they believe is correct.

For many, baptism is very important. While they may allow their children to attend SS, being 'saved' in that church might not be what they think is in their child's best interest. That's something to think about.

Post no. 46 in this thread sorta spoke about dealing with parents whose child was baptized as an adult in a different church than the one in which she was raised.

My personal opinion is that parental approval should be obtained before a minor is baptized. What kind of lesson are we teaching children if we tell them to disobey their parents in something like this.

[SDG]

Here is a brochure one church gives its youth who are preparing to be bapized ... it also contains a parental consent form.

http://www.calvary-fellowship.org/highschool/documents/Baptismweb.pdf