For those who want to know...RULES at my church!

Originally Posted by Sarge

However, some do get mad at God. People process what's happened in different ways. Those who feel this way need to realize that God is not the one that harmed them.

This is where there are some who have great difficulty. Some blame God, some cannot fully separate the false version of God they received from who God really is, and some walk away entirely from Christianity (though some also return to God). Unfortunately, what sometimes happens is that in the process of being involved in an unhealthy church, the person becomes wrapped up in the system and messes up their relationship with God and things get really distorted. And sometimes if one is raised in an unhealthy church and that is all they ever knew, they may not even have ever developed a real relationship with God.

I believe it was Michlow that mentioned she may not have walked away from God, but rather the twisted version of God that developed in her mind.

Here is where the most harm from spiritual abuse comes in- is if the person does not ever go forward to developing a genuine relationship with God. When an unhealthy church produces such as this, it is very, very sad. The place where people should be able to come to learn about God and develop a personal walk with Him instead can produce people who reject Him.

I do realize everyone has their own experience, I was just being thankful that I didn't ......it breaks my heart that some never make it back...those are the ones that someone is going to have to answer for...they will be accountable one day...I appreciate so much your input and wisdom in this area...you have done so much for so many...

[Michlow]

Originally Posted by Sarge

I believe it was Michlow that mentioned she may not have walked away from God, but rather the twisted version of God that developed in her mind.

Here is where the most harm from spiritual abuse comes in- is if the person does not ever go forward to developing a genuine relationship with God. When an unhealthy church produces such as this, it is very, very sad. The place where people should be able to come to learn about God and develop a personal walk with Him instead can produce people who reject Him.

I feel I must mention here, that though I haven't given up completely, neither would I saw that I have developed a clear and accurate picture of God either. The truth is that I don't trust the tools that were used to give me an inaccurate picture in the first place (church, Bible, others...etc.), but neither do I trust myself (that accepted such a distorted picture in the first place).

Which basically means that progress can't even be measured in baby steps, but more like fractions of an inch. But I am ok with that.

Originally Posted by Michlow

I feel I must mention here, that though I haven't given up completely, neither would I saw that I have developed a clear and accurate picture of God either. The truth is that I don't trust the tools that were used to give me an inaccurate picture in the first place (church, Bible, others...etc.), but neither do I trust myself (that accepted such a distorted picture in the first place).

What you have described is common- not trusting yourself and trouble trusting the Bible again.

Here's some thoughts on this. Yes, you once accepted a distorted picture of God. Understanding how it happened is helpful. As I previously mentioned, it is usually a slow process where the person doesn't then realize how their perception is changing. Many can look back at how they were excited and joyful at first but later had changed. It's like Paul asked the Galatians what happened to their joy.

When a person has experienced an unhealthy church, and then educated themselves as to what happened and why, chances are they will not become involved in such a church again. They will notice warning signs much sooner. Though some go from one unhealthy church to another, these have not yet fully recognized what happened and educated themselves enough on the issue.

As to not trusting the Bible, we must understand that because the Bible was distorted and/or used against us in the past does not mean that there is fault with God's Word. The problem did not lie within the Bible, but in unhealthy leadership and possibly in ourselves as well.

This is why I recommend that people try another version of the Bible if they are having trouble reading the version that they used in the unhealthy church. Sometimes people need to do this until they can get past the triggers when they read passages that were misused in their former church. It doesn't mean they won't ever be able to go back to their other version. I have seen many, many people helped by doing this. Just understand the differences between the types of Bibles and that they each probably have strengths and weaknesses. If you switch to a paraphrase version, don't use that for studying as it is unreliable for this.

It may help if you can look at it in this way by comparing it to something else. There's many things in this world that are misused. A knife or gun may be used for good or bad purposes. If one misuses either for something wrong, it doesn't make the knife or gun untrustworthy in itself.

There have been teachers that have gone bad and misused textbooks. It doesn't mean those books are no longer trustworthy, but simply that the one who used them wrongly is not worthy of our trust.

Hopefully something I've shared may be able to help someone on the board. My offer to send a different version of the Bible to someone in this situation is yet open. Just send me a PM. The other three books previously offered have been taken.

[Michlow]

Originally Posted by Sarge

What you have described is common- not trusting yourself and trouble trusting the Bible again.

Here's some thoughts on this. Yes, you once accepted a distorted picture of God. Understanding how it happened is helpful. As I previously mentioned, it is usually a slow process where the person doesn't then realize how their perception is changing. Many can look back at how they were excited and joyful at first but later had changed. It's like Paul asked the Galatians what happened to their joy.

When a person has experienced an unhealthy church, and then educated themselves as to what happened and why, chances are they will not become involved in such a church again. They will notice warning signs much sooner. Though some go from one unhealthy church to another, these have not yet fully recognized what happened and educated themselves enough on the issue.

As to not trusting the Bible, we must understand that because the Bible was distorted and/or used against us in the past does not mean that there is fault with God's Word. The problem did not lie within the Bible, but in unhealthy leadership and possibly in ourselves as well.

This is why I recommend that people try another version of the Bible if they are having trouble reading the version that they used in the unhealthy church. Sometimes people need to do this until they can get past the triggers when they read passages that were misused in their former church. It doesn't mean they won't ever be able to go back to their other version. I have seen many, many people helped by doing this. Just understand the differences between the types of Bibles and that they each probably have strengths and weaknesses. If you switch to a paraphrase version, don't use that for studying as it is unreliable for this.

It may help if you can look at it in this way by comparing it to something else. There's many things in this world that are misused. A knife or gun may be used for good or bad purposes. If one misuses either for something wrong, it doesn't make the knife or gun untrustworthy in itself.

There have been teachers that have gone bad and misused textbooks. It doesn't mean those books are no longer trustworthy, but simply that the one who used them wrongly is not worthy of our trust.

Hopefully something I've shared may be able to help someone on the board. My offer to send a different version of the Bible to someone in this situation is yet open. Just send me a PM. The other three books previously offered have been taken.

I guess the simplest way to describe it is that I used to view the bible as an instruction manual or a rule book. I thought that it had all the answers, and that anything written in it was Truth with a capital T, and that all I needed to do was follow it perfectly and all would be well.

But the truth is, that it is filled with a mass of contradictions, that Christians cannot adequately explain away.

I have developed a different concept of the Bible. To me, it is a collection of writings, written down by various followers of God. The writings are their stories, their histories, their concepts of God.

It's not that it doesn't have validity, or that I don't take it seriously. But I don't necessarily take it literally either.

That might not make much sense, but I figure I lost most people the minute I implied it wasn't a rule book...

[ILG]

Originally Posted by Michlow

I guess the simplest way to describe it is that I used to view the bible as an instruction manual or a rule book. I thought that it had all the answers, and that anything written in it was Truth with a capital T, and that all I needed to do was follow it perfectly and all would be well.

But the truth is, that it is filled with a mass of contradictions, that Christians cannot adequately explain away.

I have developed a different concept of the Bible. To me, it is a collection of writings, written down by various followers of God. The writings are their stories, their histories, their concepts of God.

It's not that it doesn't have validity, or that I don't take it seriously. But I don't necessarily take it literally either.

That might not make much sense, but I figure I lost most people the minute I implied it wasn't a rule book...

I have questions about some of those things myself, Michlow.

Originally Posted by Michlow

But the truth is, that it is filled with a mass of contradictions, that Christians cannot adequately explain away.

Hmmm. Well, if you are not sure you can trust your judgment now, how can you make a statement such as the above??? It wasn't stated as an opinion, but as a fact.

Something to think about.....

Well, it appears this discussion has died down. I joined in order to participate in this thread and will most likely be quiet now. However, if anyone would like to communicate further, I have the links posted where you may find me. It would be best to contact me through my site from this point on instead of via PMs on AFF as I don't know how much I will check here.

It's my hope that anyone who has been reading here that has been hurt would move forward in their walk with God, be able to lay aside any false ideas about God they picked up, and allow themselves to be completed healed. It is all about your personal one on one relationship with your Creator.

It was my pleasure to be able to communicate with you and hopefully share something that would be of help to the members.

[freedom]

RUN for your life!

[PASTOR'S WIFE]

Sounds like Truth Seeker's ex church pastor is related to Jim Jones. That is making themselves lord over God's heritage. I haven't read all the posts as I don't sign in very often but this one was just so far out. It also reminds me of the people who were in the news about a year ago (later day saints who believe in multi-marriages) NOT THAT TRUTH SEEKERS CHURCH DID - but the form of dictatorship. There is a church near my sister who had a pastor like that (not UPC or ALJC) - i don't know their denomination but they were holiness. They could not marry without the pastor's approval. If he moved, they had to move and etc. My brother-in-law's niece married a guy in the church whom the pastor said to and after they were married, she found out he was gay. The marriage was annulled as there was no comsumation. It just about devasted the young lady.
THANK GOD TRUTH SEEKER YOU ARE NO LONGER INVOLVED IN THIS TYPE OF CHURCH. HE WOULD HAVE YOU DRINKING COOL-AID NEXT!!!

[Sister Alvear]

Originally Posted by Sister Truth Seeker

This is not about bashing...please don't to go there...this is just what my church was like and my Pastor wanted it....we didn't think it was necessary so we left! I love them, and I hope nothing but the best for them, I just think fear rules them and to me that is soooooo sad!

Rules...
1. No talking on the phone for more than 10 minutes
2. No friends outside of church, not even family (it was discouraged strongly)
3. No more than three families at a time in your home and not too often, if you had a gathering you are suppose to ask everyone in the church so no one gets offended.
4. No home bible studies without the ministry being there
5. You must attend all fellowships
6. So lunch dates, or shopping with friends even the ones in church...
7. No important decisions made without consulting the pastor...like, buying a car(new, used, how much you can spend)...same with a home or property.
8. You were not allowed to move, unless you had his OK.

Being we are older we did not attend parenting classes or marriage classes so we missed out on a lot of the rules...but over time we learned. This is not everything, but for the moment its enough...I might add more as I think of them.....

So there ya go Thad....

Is this true?