What If My Works Are Not Perfect?

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

Are we instructed by Paul to be perfect?

2 Cor 13:11

11Finally, brethren, farewell. Be perfect, be of good comfort, be of one mind, live in peace; and the God of love and peace shall be with you.

Another consequence to not being perfect. The God of love and peace will not be with us.

Be "perfect"... spiritually mature. That's all it means.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by houston

That doesn’t even make sense.

I think it's perfect. It has to be. Michael is.

[Amanah]

I think we can be perfect in that we can be a mature Christian with moral integrity and biblical standards. But yet at times failing in aspects of self control, patient endurance, brotherly affection, and love for everyone.

If we are walking in the Spirit, when we err in our treatment of others, God will convict us so we can repent and make our relationships with God and others right.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Amanah

I think we can be perfect in that we can be a mature Christian with moral integrity and biblical standards. But yet at times failing in aspects of self control, patient endurance, brotherly affection, and love for everyone.

If we are walking in the Spirit, when we err in our treatment of others, God will convict us so we can repent and make our relationships with God and others right.

I understand what you're saying. But the doctrine of sinless perfection would say that a believer who fails in aspects of self-control, patience, brotherly affection, and love for everyone hasn't attained perfection and will perish should the Lord return today.

When they say "perfection", they mean being sinless and righteous in perfection even as Christ Himself was sinlessly righteous.

[Michael The Disciple]

Originally Posted by Aquila

Michael, you're not perfect.

Romans 1:28-31 King James Version (KJV)
28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;
29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,
30 Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,
31 Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:

2 Corinthians 12:20
For I fear, lest, when I come, I shall not find you such as I would, and that I shall be found unto you such as ye would not: lest there be debates, envyings, wraths, strifes, backbitings, whisperings, swellings, tumults:

If you were sinlessly perfect, Michael, you'd not be debating with us. You'd also not stir up debate, strife, or division. You'd find an Apostolic forum of soul sleepers to "fellowship" with.

If you want to "debate" this point... feel free... but... you'll only prove how imperfect you are if you do.

Aquila,

I am not debating with anyone. My purpose is to teach the gospel. That I may perhaps assist in the ministry of presenting every man perfect in Christ. I believe Jude said to CONTEND FOR THE FAITH ONCE DELIVERED TO THE SAINTS.

[Michael The Disciple]

Todays modern Christian sees God's commandments and instructions as "legalistic". Something to be avoided. Something to be replaced with their own traditions.

In their haste to promise liberty to each other they cast off Jesus teaching.

1 John 5:

2By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments. 3For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

The commands of Christ are esteemed as SO GRIEVOUS that men are considered insane if they can can them more than a day. And yet.....they talk about how powerful the baptism of the Holy Ghost is!

They say with God all things are possible since we have his Spirit. They made Denominations out of the truth of how we are "endued with power"!

And yet when it comes to sin, their confession is WE ARE SLAVES TO SIN.

To this doctrine the Holy Ghost cant keep them from sinning even for one second, according to their interpretation of 1 John 1:8.

Now personally I think there are a good number of Christians who right now have no sin in their lives. God sees them as perfect as pertaining to overcoming sin. Problem is the Pentecostal Christian movement is laced with false doctrine confusing the saints. They have been bewitched into thinking they must confess they are "not perfect just forgiven".

Jesus was quite straight forward about what he was looking for in a people. None of this mish mash of philosophy we hear today. In the sermon on the mount he gives men commands and admonitions. Then he says:

Be you therefore perfect even as your Father which is is Heaven is perfect. Matt 5:48

This is the real Jesus.

Same one that is coming for WHAT KIND OF CHURCH?

Eph. 5:27

27That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish.

If that does not describe our lives today, we should realize we will not be raptured.