will you know your loved ones in heaven

[Jito463]

Originally Posted by Livelystone

People who are already in heaven are there in spirit form only. Hard to say how one would recognize a person's spirit just by appearance

John though he was looking at Christ in the Book of Revelation before finding out it was one of his fellow wrkers who was already with the Lord.

Revelation 19:10 And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See thou do it not: I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.

Except, John was only given a revelation of what's to come, and a glimpse of Heaven. He wasn't actually in Heaven.

[Livelystone]

Originally Posted by Jito463

Except, John was only given a revelation of what's to come, and a glimpse of Heaven. He wasn't actually in Heaven.

Heaven is not a location and is why Jesus said it is within us. Heaven is a realm of the spirit in righteousness, and what John saw was 'signified' through a representation shown in the natural to reveal what was (and would soon be) going on in the spirit realm.

The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and [B]he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:[/B]

Jesus said he was in heaven while He was standing on earth and the Apostles implied the same thing with their phrase "our conversation is in heaven" that identified their citizenship as individuals being from heaven but were ministering to people on earth.

John 3: 13 And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.

[Jito463]

Okay, then let me rephrase, John was still in his physical form, his body wasn't transformed as ours will be when we're raptured.

[Livelystone]

Originally Posted by Jito463

Okay, then let me rephrase, John was still in his physical form, his body wasn't transformed as ours will be when we're raptured.

I understand this is what you have been taught,

However,

John went there "in the spirit" and the teaching of a physical rapture of persons in the church being taken off of the earth is one of Satan's most successful coups ever pulled on the church.

Seven times the Bible says........"Sit thou at my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool."

It does not say "except for when I send you part way back to get all of our chosen off of the earth" just before I make your enemies your footstool"

The reason why the church does not see miracles anymore is the result of all of the false doctrines coming from the pulpits about God, His Son, His plan for man, and then going into the hearts and minds of the church.

[shazeep]

amen.

[Jito463]

*sigh*

Fine, whatever you say. I still believe what I posted. Unless you can give me Scripture to the contrary, I'll just stick with what I already said.

[shazeep]

well, rapture doctrine is not new; if you will accept it, Ezekiel spoke against it, @ "pillows." It also opposes other Scriptural doctrine that strongly suggests, even directs that it is believers who are to overcome.

King James Bible
Wherefore thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I am against your pillows, wherewith ye there hunt the souls to make them fly, and I will tear them from your arms, and will let the souls go, even the souls that ye hunt to make them fly.

however--like every other verse in Scripture, i guess--the interpretation here is disputed; and i think even those averse to rapture doctrine per se must admit that there is something going on there in 2 Thess et al.

personally, i think you should stick with whatever belief produces fruit for you, and judge by the fruit; and when the fruit of rapture doctrine becomes "I don't have to do anything, because Jesus is going to take me away from all this," recognize.

[Livelystone]

Originally Posted by Jito463

*sigh*

Fine, whatever you say. I still believe what I posted. Unless you can give me Scripture to the contrary, I'll just stick with what I already said.

What about the seven verses I referenced is not sufficient for you?

God is not a man that He can lie.................. if the rapture doctrine as taught is true then those seven verses are a lie.

However, and as a bonus for us who seek higher than the current status quo worship, the last time God says these Words he adds a twist for our benefit

Heb.10;12 But this man, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God;

13 From henceforth expecting till his enemies be made his footstool.

For two thousand years Jesus has been waiting for us to show up from where the veil used to keep the children of God away from................ unfortunately for the last couple of centuries the majority of God's children have been praying for Jesus to leave Heaven and come rescue them from earth when the truth is the way into the presence of God on the Throne and gaining the mind of Christ in this life has already been given to us.

Some persons, such as the apostles are an example of have already done this even though because in their life it was not yet the right time " they had not yet apprehended who had apprehended them," they still lived their lives as if they had already apprehended perfection seen behind the veil while in the presence of God on the Throne.

It is shown in prophecy through the designs for the construction of Tabernacle in the wilderness and the words of OT, NT prophets and apostles that the church would fall away from the truth soon after the last apostle was removed from the earth. This brought in a time of imperfection in the worship of God that would last 2000 years but is now coming to a close. Therefore, more is being demanded of us today if we want to return unto through faith (knowledge of the truth and walking it out) having access to the grace from above that saves and heals of us of all our infirmities and sicknesses

There was a man back in the 50's ahead of his time who set off at a great loss on his own from the Pentecostal denomination with a teaching about the 42nd generation. Bill Britton did not get it all right by any means, but for those still stuck in a rapture ready church that particular writing, and the one about "Eagle Saints" is a good place for anyone still hung up on rapture ready doctrines to start the journey from Babylon (captivity to false worship as taught in the local church) and into the presence of the Glory of God.

Next, I suggest you read my book (that I give away for free to those who send me an e-mail address). More than one Pastor preaches both my book and myself deserve to be burned, but for those who get it they too understand what it is like for when Paul said to be "born out of due time" that the translation of means to be born before the time when the majority of other like-minded believers will finally come forth ON EARTH as prophesied of throughout the Bible.

Blessings to you and to yours

Doug

[shazeep]

"eagle saints"

[good samaritan]

Originally Posted by Livelystone

Heaven is not a location and is why Jesus said it is within us. Heaven is a realm of the spirit in righteousness, and what John saw was 'signified' through a representation shown in the natural to reveal what was (and would soon be) going on in the spirit realm.

The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and [B]he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:[/B]

Jesus said he was in heaven while He was standing on earth and the Apostles implied the same thing with their phrase "our conversation is in heaven" that identified their citizenship as individuals being from heaven but were ministering to people on earth.

John 3: 13 And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.

Where is the scripture to support this?