Prominent Memphis Area Pastor Resigns

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by houston

I haven't noticed that. Carry on.

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

First of all please don't say "WE" as if you speak for all of us.

Second you are making a classical mistake called a sweeping generalization. It shows your process is not based on thoughtful objective reasoning but emotive subjective reaction

Lastly nothing in the above proves such failures are systemic of Conservatism or Legalism. The facts are they happen across the board in all areas of Christianity .

You get a double high five my Brothaaaa

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

what was the purpose in going to church, praying, standing behind the pulpit and preaching, singing songs, worshiping God, fellowshipping? Since it doesn't seem to stop the wandering eye or unmoral thoughts and actions!

[tv1a]

EB you weren't so kind before when liberal/charismatics were busted for moral failure. Did your opinion change since the moral failures seem to be making its rounds in the conservative movement? You made a great point but it wasn't consistent with comments you've made over the course of the years.

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

You caught that too?

Thanks you my friend.

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

Please quote me using Juvanile barbs to indicate the hurt is not real.

The only one casting barbs is you.,

Charnock is an Ultra Con?

Oh, I see, he (or she) see their behavior in others, and therefore lashes out at themselves.

OK, I feel a little better now.

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by tv1a

EB you weren't so kind before when liberal/charismatics were busted for moral failure. Did your opinion change since the moral failures seem to be making its rounds in the conservative movement? You made a great point but it wasn't consistent with comments you've made over the course of the years.

I think I'm pretty consistent, I see everyone on the same level, if you are in a position of leadership, and you hurt someone, then you have opened up yourself to a higher judgement than I could ever dish out. Everyone gets a turn at the wheel.

Correct?

[Enigmatically Ambiguous]

Originally Posted by Charnock

But that's not we've been told.

We've been told that lines and fences make a difference.

You cannot logically espouse both positions at the same time.

If standards are powerful, and keep us from sin, then it stands to reason that this sort of stuff would never happen - especially among the very men who've created the lines and fences.

We've all heard...

• When a church loses standards it loses the power and favor of God.
• People who don't follow standards are loose, and sinful.
• Obedience to a pastor's standards builds a hedge from sin.
• You can't be saved without holiness (read "standards").

This is a man who firmly believed Lee Stoneking's tripe about the power of a woman's long, uncut hair. His church embraced the doctrine.

The doctrine states that a man and a church are protected so long as the women of the church keep the scissors out of their hair.

Protected from what? At various times LS and Ruth Reider Harvey have posited that uncut hair guarantees protection from adultery, accidents and other calamities.

In the end we see the foolishness of standards preaching. It creates a false sense of security based upon what we do. Instead, we should distrust our own heart and lean on Jesus to protect and keep us from evil.

This all leads back to a distorted soteriological baseline. Measurements save instead of Jesus. We lean to our own understanding rather than trust Him to direct our paths.

In the end, we fail. Miserably. Repetitively.

I truly wish those of you who so vehemently state "it happens among all groups" now would remember this, going forward, as you preach and teach.

A friend asked a well connected minister in the UPC recently, "Brother ___________, are we right? I have a lot of friends leaving the organization. I just want to know, are we right?" The preacher said, "Yes, we are right. And I'm telling you, time will prove we are right. You watch these men leaving us. I've seen it before. There will be adultery, and divorce. There will be kids having babies before marriage and drug addiction. You just watch. In time these folks who left us will prove that we're right."

I wonder what both of these men thought about this conversation when they heard this news.

"Standards protect holiness" doctrine is a false doctrine. Holiness is holiness. It doesn't need protecting. Our God is holy. If you've got Jesus, you've got holiness. If you've got holiness, you have Jesus.

[AreYouReady?]

Originally Posted by Enigmatically Ambiguous

A friend asked a well connected minister in the UPC recently, "Brother ___________, are we right? I have a lot of friends leaving the organization. I just want to know, are we right?" The preacher said, "Yes, we are right. And I'm telling you, time will prove we are right. You watch these men leaving us. I've seen it before. There will be adultery, and divorce. There will be kids having babies before marriage and drug addiction. You just watch. In time these folks who left us will prove that we're right."

I wonder what both of these men thought about this conversation when they heard this news.

"Standards protect holiness" doctrine is a false doctrine. Holiness is holiness. It doesn't need protecting. Our God is holy. If you've got Jesus, you've got holiness. If you've got holiness, you have Jesus.

I've seen all of this happening for the past 30 years in my region. It depends upon who you are whether you get a reprimand or it gets swept under the rug.

[Charnock]

Originally Posted by Enigmatically Ambiguous

A friend asked a well connected minister in the UPC recently, "Brother ___________, are we right? I have a lot of friends leaving the organization. I just want to know, are we right?" The preacher said, "Yes, we are right. And I'm telling you, time will prove we are right. You watch these men leaving us. I've seen it before. There will be adultery, and divorce. There will be kids having babies before marriage and drug addiction. You just watch. In time these folks who left us will prove that we're right."

I wonder what both of these men thought about this conversation when they heard this news.

"Standards protect holiness" doctrine is a false doctrine. Holiness is holiness. It doesn't need protecting. Our God is holy. If you've got Jesus, you've got holiness. If you've got holiness, you have Jesus.

The irony is rich.

Here's how the Standards Keepers state their case:

1. Those who leave standards will eventually leave sound doctrine.
2. Hence, those who leave standards will become drunken adulterers.

I imagine the men you mentioned felt a mixture of loss and pity.

[lovingthelord]

If any of yall are wondering, My church doing good and we are pulling through (: here is a link to last weeks sunday service: http://tpcmemphis.org/archived.aspx?wme=20121007b and powerweekend :http://tpcmemphis.org/archived.aspx?wme=20120930a
Those two were byfar the best services out of this year in my opinio. AMAZING move of God. Please watch these two services(: