In a lot of ways, I don't expect many of you to understand why a remark like that would raise eyebrows. It is fine if the intent was not of malicious nature, however, I ask that folks not make comments like that if they don't want it to be received the way it sounds. Try to edit your thoughts so they don't sound racist and stereotypical.
Sometimes people say things not realizing how it sounds but have no malicious intent and some just out right racist. I've heard a white preacher say something at a funeral that could easily offend the black attendees, almost all were black. He was trying to make a point he wasn't prejudice but said something that could be taken prejudice. "I grew up on wrong side of tracks too" was statement. Well, not all blacks are poor on other side of tracks.
The pastor has a black asst. One blacks started attending some whites didn't like it, the pastor in front of church told church if they got a problem with blacks coming here there is the door.
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Today pull up the little weeds,
The sinful thoughts subdue,
Or they will take the reins themselves
And someday master you. --Anon.
The most deadly sins do not leap upon us, they creep up on us.
Okay I guess I have to interject
When I read the original statement by Austin, my first reaction was O_O. I almost said something but actually decided it wasn't worth it. IMO The compliment could have and should have read "She was a beautiful woman with a beautiful clear voice"...period.
I agree.
Quote:
Perhaps it is my blackness that makes me raise an eyebrow, but I don't think so. I certainly do not wear my blackness on my sleeve. However what is "She was a beautiful woman with a beautiful clear voice for a black lady" supposed to mean? Which part of "beautiful clear" is an anomaly for black women singers? Is it the "beautiful" or the "clear"? The style of music that Whitney sang was the soulful "black" sound she learned in predominately black churches. I know plenty who sing that way. She is a natural soprano who is black. There are not going to be many raspy sopranos of any race.
True, and now my own misperceptions are showing. I do think of most black singers in the terms of soul, blues, jazz and the tones that go with those genres. Probably because that's nearly all I listen to, other than black gospel. IMO, Whitney was way more pop than soul, but she had her soulful moments for sure.
Quote:
I'm not assuming that Austin meant something derogatory (which is why I didn't initially respond). However, it is a curious choice of words.
Curious...I would say "unfortunate" or just plain "bad." Hopefully he will clarify at some point and I can wrench myself out of this unplanned role as the devil's advocate.
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"God, send me anywhere, only go with me. Lay any burden on me, only sustain me. And sever any tie in my heart except the tie that binds my heart to Yours."
--David Livingstone
"To see no being, not God’s or any, but you also go thither,
To see no possession but you may possess it—enjoying all without labor or purchase—
abstracting the feast, yet not abstracting one particle of it;…."
--Walt Whitman, Leaves of Grass, Song of the Open Road
...just trying to give Austin the benefit of the doubt until he showed up to explain himself. Which he didn't...yet.
For a little clarity, some definitions:
Stereotyping (of which most of us are guilty from time to time), prejudices and even ignorance do not necessarily = racism. I have my own prejudices and perceptions, which have evolved over time as I've matured, been educated and experienced more of the world and the people around me. Even if I think something that turns out to be inaccurate, that doesn't make me a "racist." That word gets bandied about too freely, much the same as the word "abuse."
Gentle correction is better, and let's reserve the accusation of racism for people who truly exhibit it.
I don't really need definitions to know how I feel about a comment that says she has a clear voice for a "BLACK LADY". It is what it is. He may not have intended for it to sound the way that it did, however the comment sounds both racist and stereotypical.
As a white woman, I can't imagine you would understand the true meaning of "Racist" anyway. As you have stated, "That word gets bandied about too freely, much the same as the word abuse." Additionaly, I simply asked for clarification. After receiving none, I still gave him the benefit of the doubt and saying that if you didn't mean it that way, just be careful about statements like that because they are easily read in such a way that sends the message of "RACISM and STEREOTYPING".
I don't really need definitions to know how I feel about a comment that says she has a clear voice for a "BLACK LADY". It is what it is. He may not have intended for it to sound the way that it did, however the comment sounds both racist and stereotypical.
As a white woman, I can't imagine you would understand the true meaning of "Racist" anyway. As you have stated, "That word gets bandied about too freely, much the same as the word abuse." Additionaly, I simply asked for clarification. After receiving none, I still gave him the benefit of the doubt and saying that if you didn't mean it that way, just be careful about statements like that because they are easily read in such a way that sends the message of "RACISM and STEREOTYPING".
warrior, with all due respect, you're not the only person on this thread talking about Austin's post, and since I didn't quote you, you shouldn't assume I provided definitions *just* for you.
P.S.:
Quote:
Originally Posted by warrior
As a white woman, I can't imagine you would understand the true meaning of "Racist" anyway.
Touche.
__________________
"God, send me anywhere, only go with me. Lay any burden on me, only sustain me. And sever any tie in my heart except the tie that binds my heart to Yours."
--David Livingstone
"To see no being, not God’s or any, but you also go thither,
To see no possession but you may possess it—enjoying all without labor or purchase—
abstracting the feast, yet not abstracting one particle of it;…."
--Walt Whitman, Leaves of Grass, Song of the Open Road
For the record, Austin has been posting on other threads since I made my initial comment to his post. Apparently, he has made the choice not to comment on his words.
I'm just saying that among other things, the statement didn't even make sense to me. I have never heard Whitney sing and think "she sounds like she is of another race". Her style and tone are more "black" influenced than any other race. For every person of another race who can emulate Whitney, you can find 50 black church singers. It's just the genre that she came out of.
If I were complimenting someone of another race and said "He or she is a great person with certain great characteristics for someone of that race", I would anticipate the need to further clarify myself...particularly if the characteristics I'm talking about are not inherently uncommon to that race.
I'm not accusing him of racism, but the comment was questionable enough that it raised my eyebrow when I read it days ago. I only commented when I saw the conversation where people were not seeing how it could legitimately race eyebrows.
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There are no weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, Chuck Norris lives in Houston.
Either the United States will destroy ignorance, or ignorance will destroy the United States. – W.E.B. DuBois
Isn't it sad that we have this kind of discussion? But, I guess this will haunt us while we are on this Earth. Since most white people have never had the kind of treatment that black people have, we can't really understand why some remarks are so damaging. Even if we try to be careful not to offend, it is inherent of the issue.
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If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.
2 Chronicles 7:14 KJV
He hath shewed thee, O man, what is good; and what doth the LORD require of thee, but to do justly, and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with thy God? Micah 6:8 KJV
Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is. 1 John 3:2 KJV
Isn't it sad that we have this kind of discussion? But, I guess this will haunt us while we are on this Earth. Since most white people have never had the kind of treatment that black people have, we can't really understand why some remarks are so damaging. Even if we try to be careful not to offend, it is inherent of the issue.
True, Cindy. Wise words. I'm obviously limited in my own ability to make statements without being offensive.
__________________
"God, send me anywhere, only go with me. Lay any burden on me, only sustain me. And sever any tie in my heart except the tie that binds my heart to Yours."
--David Livingstone
"To see no being, not God’s or any, but you also go thither,
To see no possession but you may possess it—enjoying all without labor or purchase—
abstracting the feast, yet not abstracting one particle of it;…."
--Walt Whitman, Leaves of Grass, Song of the Open Road
I do think of most black singers in the terms of soul, blues, jazz and the tones that go with those genres. Probably because that's nearly all I listen to, other than black gospel. IMO, Whitney was way more pop than soul, but she had her soulful moments for sure. 
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