Official Stance of UPC?

[acerrak]

Originally Posted by Pendragon

This is what I meant by 'accusation'.

majority of 3 steppers will not have fellowship to the point of calling a 1 stepper brother or sister.


There is no socialization with anyother churches outside there 3 step views. cause the 3 steppers consider them lost and carnal minded.

Just like david bernard talking to dr white in a debate.

Since dr white. was no baptized in Jesus name and has no spoken in tounges. Dr bernard said basically your not saved yet, God is trying to lead you on a path.

There are many preachers starting to change views. Jeff arnold very vocal about it.

He testified of this miracle that happened to a boy when His momma prayed for him. (this at General Conference awhile back) stated this woman was never baptized, never spoke in tounges. Yet she prayed for her Son and God instantly healed her child.

He said infact the miracle was undenyable cause it was a physical defect that was healed.

He stated by our definition o fslavation, that woman was nothing but a carnal minded person. But then turned around and said but Obviously she must be right in the sight of God, cuase we know God doesnt listen to sinners.

he is probably one the bigger names i Know that has grown socially exceptable with others outside the 3 stepper movement.

so it really isnt a accusation its actually how it is. Though some are starting to change that view.

[Sam]

Originally Posted by acerrak

...There are many preachers starting to change views. Jeff arnold very vocal about it.

He testified of this miracle that happened to a boy when His momma prayed for him. (this at General Conference awhile back) stated this woman was never baptized, never spoke in tounges. Yet she prayed for her Son and God instantly healed her child.

He said infact the miracle was undenyable cause it was a physical defect that was healed.

He stated by our definition of slavation, that woman was nothing but a carnal minded person. But then turned around and said but Obviously she must be right in the sight of God, cuase we know God doesnt listen to sinners.

he is probably one the bigger names i Know that has grown socially exceptable with others outside the 3 stepper movement.

so it really isnt a accusation its actually how it is. Though some are starting to change that view.

WOW! Something like that was actually said at a UPC conference and the speaker was not challenged, shouted down, or dragged from the stage? I wonder if he received private censure later?

[acerrak]

Originally Posted by Sam

WOW! Something like that was actually said at a UPC conference and the speaker was not challenged, shouted down, or dragged from the stage? I wonder if he received private censure later?

i actually have the Mp3 of it. he makes a remark to the crowd about that as well. sorta daring them to state that.

Jeff arnold is awsome i love to hear him preach

[Godsdrummer]

Originally Posted by Pendragon

Paul did exactly what you accuse 'three steppers' of doing (and make it sound like it's a bad thing). When Paul met the believers in Acts 19, he asked them if they had received the Holy Spirit when they believed, and also asked them how they had been baptized. They had not received the Holy Spirit, and they hadn't been baptized in Jesus' name, so he 'evangelized' them.

Coincidentally (or perhaps by design), Paul's teaching in Acts 19 lines up precisely with what Peter said in Acts 2:38: repent, be baptized in the name of Jesus, and you will receive the Holy Spirit.

I will certainly agree with you that there is a certain 'nose in the air' attitude in some parts of the UPC. But that doesn't mean the truth is not the truth. The un-Christlike attitude of some believers may make it easier for you to dismiss their words, but it doesn't mean what they say is not true.

Acctualy what you are saying Paul did is not what happened. The first thing Paul ask was not about baptism. It was whether they had received the Promise of the Holy Ghost. As this was what was promised down through OT. Upon finding they had not heard of the Holy Ghost then he ask "unto what then were you baptized?" Not who's name were you baptized. Mikvah (baptism) was not primarily done unto or into a name, it was unto a certain belief!!!. Johns baptism was not in the name of John, it was unto repentance. That the baptize was baptized because they repented. These diciples of John had not proclaimed faith in Christ by baptism as they had not so much as heard of him much less the Holy Ghost.

Futher Paul did not command them to be baptized, read the passage baptism was the natural action for them when they professed outwardly thier beleif in Christ. The spirit of God was then the natural thing to happen as it was the promise and fulfillement of OT prophecy. Their salvation was their initial beleif. Which caused them to follow through with the next steps of obediance. Any true child of God will continue on to complete what ever steps are shown them to be ligit. Much of the problem is our presentation.