Do You Believe In Women Preachers?

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Lost and Found

The qualifications of an elder (one in the five-fold ministry) can only be defined through the Bible’s narrative. Both 1 Timothy 3:2-7 and Titus 1:6-9 list the criteria for apostolic conformity to this call (See 1 Timothy 3:2-7; Titus 1:6-9).

In both these writings we find Paul specifying that an elder must be the “husband of one wife.” These same writings also contain Paul’s guidelines for the behavior of an elder’s wife and children. Therefore, compliance with these would require one to be a male, which means the calling of an elder could only be fulfilled by men, and never by women. But beyond this clear textual evidence is the fact that nowhere in the Bible do we find women operating in the role of a New Covenant Church Elder. This fact alone should settle this apostolic principle.

I realize that the Bible says that there are neither male nor female in Christ (Galatians 3:28). But when one reads Galatians 3 in context, they find that Paul is speaking about all people - Jew and Greek, bond and free, male and female – who put on Christ, have equal access to God’s promise. This same theme is mentioned in many of Paul’s epistles (See Galatians 5:6; Romans 1:16, 2:9-10, 3:29-30, 4:11-12, 9:24, 10:12-15; 1Corinthians 7:19; 12:13; Ephesians 3:5-10; Colossians 3:11).

To make this lone passage in Galatians 3 the standard for biblical eldership, one would have to take its wording out of context and ignore numerous passages, which define a man and woman’s role in ministry differently than does Galatians 3:28. Such measures always lead to error and false doctrine.

A woman’s ‘ministry’ is to compliment her husband’s. A man’s ministry may not be the one shining forth in a relationship, but that does not mean the Lord does not desire such a situation to change. This, again, is why both the man and the woman need training from the elders.

Does God use women in the Church? Of course He does. But just as there is a proper headship in the home (See Ephesians 5:23-24; 1 Corinthians 11:3), there is also a proper headship in the Church (see Hebrews 13:17; 1 Thessalonians 5:12-13; 1 Timothy 5:17).

The Bible describes matured women of approved character and piety, ministering to other women (See Titus 2:3-5).

A woman’s service is regarded as very important to the Kingdom of God. Paul mentions such labor in his epistle to the church at Philippi. “And I entreat thee also, true yokefellow, help those women which labored with me in the gospel, with Clement also, and with other my fellow laborers, whose names are in the book of life” (Philippians 4:3). Other biblical examples where women served in the Kingdom of God include:
• The Shunamite women ministered to Elisha. (2 Kings 4)
• Martha served the Lord and His Disciples. (Luke 10:38-42; John 12:2, 26)
• Peter’s wife’s mother was healed and then ministered to Jesus. (Matthew 8:14-15; Mark 1:31)
• Certain women ministered to Jesus, including: Mary Magdalene, Mary the mother of James and Joses, and the mother of Zebedee’s children. (Matthew 27:55-56)
• Joanna, the wife of Herod’s stewards, and Susanna and many others also ministered to Jesus. (Luke 8:1-3)
• Dorcas ministered to the needs of the poor. (Acts 9:36-40)
• Paul asked the Church at Rome to help Phebe in whatever she was doing. She was a servant at the Church at Cenchrea. (Romans 16:1-2)

These examples describe women serving in the Church, but nowhere do we find an example of a woman functioning in the five-fold ministry.

what about prophets? Isn't that one of the five fold ministries?

[TK Burk]

Originally Posted by nahkoe

What do you think then of women who have been called? There comes a point after running and avoiding and ignoring that a person has to answer the call of God. Or do something. What if that woman has no husband to minister with/under/alongside?

Originally Posted by nahkoe

I'm starting to feel like I kill threads. lol None of these questions are asked to be antagonizing. I really am curious what you (anyone) feels about this. If you feel it's unscriptural for a woman to preach at all, what are your thoughts regarding women who are called to preach? Especially if you're a man who has felt that calling, you have to know what it would be to deny that.

Like I said, there are examples describing women serving in the Church, but nowhere do we find an example of a woman functioning in the five-fold ministry.

Where does it say that one's calling is JUST to pastor or evangelize? Such restriction is due mostly to those ‘callings’ being all that's recognized in the average church. But Paul said otherwise; he said that the five-fold's job is to mature the SAINTS so THEY can work in the MINISTRY.... What is "ministry"? Most would say, "Pulpit time," but that is NOT the case at all. 'Ministry' is simply ministering to another's need in Jesus' name. All Born Again men and women are called to this. Paul showed that a preachers calling is to focus on maturing the saints and then to help facilitate their callings. This is how Jesus and His early church defined ministry, and is also how they performed it. Later generations are the ones who altered the definition down to it only occurring behind a pulpit. Too bad, since most of those needing to hear the gospel will never be on the hearing side of a pulpit. This is exactly why apostolic 'ministry' was never to be so narrowly defined.

[TK Burk]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

what about prophets? Isn't that one of the five fold ministries?

Prophets? Yes, absolutely. Here is what Paul said:

(Eph 4:11) And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;

But ‘prophets’ is masculine, not feminine. Look at what Thayer’s said about this:

Προφήτης prophētēs
Thayer Definition:
1) in Greek writings, an interpreter of oracles or of other hidden things
2) one who, moved by the Spirit of God and hence his organ or spokesman, solemnly declares to men what he has received by inspiration, especially concerning future events, and in particular such as relate to the cause and kingdom of God and to human salvation
2a) the OT prophets, having foretold the kingdom, deeds and death, of Jesus the Messiah.
2b) of John the Baptist, the herald of Jesus the Messiah
2c) of the illustrious prophet, the Jews expected before the advent of the Messiah
2d) the Messiah
2e) of men filled with the Spirit of God, who by God’s authority and command in words of weight pleads the cause of God and urges salvation of men
2f) of prophets that appeared in the apostolic age among Christians
2f1) they are associated with the apostles
2f2) they discerned and did what is best for the Christian cause, foretelling certain future events. (Act_11:27)
2f3) in the religious assemblies of the Christians, they were moved by the Holy Spirit to speak, having power to instruct, comfort, encourage, rebuke, convict, and stimulate, their hearers
3) a poet (because poets were believed to sing under divine inspiration)
3a) of Epimenides (Tit_1:12)
Part of Speech: noun masculine
A Related Word by Thayer’s/Strong’s Number: from a compound of G4253 and G5346
Citing in TDNT: 6:781, 952

Again, the Bible speaks of men in these roles, and never of women.

Isn't pretty much the entire bible masculine except when referring to a specific person of the female sex? I thought that was the way language worked...

[TK Burk]

Originally Posted by Sheltiedad

Isn't pretty much the entire bible masculine except when referring to a specific person of the female sex? I thought that was the way language worked...

Yes, but in this case we have scriptures that declare one being the husband of one wife and in how one treats their wife and children. Also, as I showed with the Greek for 'prophet,' it can be very gender specific, which is used this way for a purpose.

[nahkoe]

But there are several prophetesses mentioned in the Bible as well, both Old and New Testament. I don't know how Greek or Hebrew work, but in Spanish if both genders are referenced, the masculine is used. Is that the same for Greek and Hebrew?

Originally Posted by Lost and Found

Prophets? Yes, absolutely. Here is what Paul said:



But ‘prophets’ is masculine, not feminine. Look at what Thayer’s said about this:



Again, the Bible speaks of men in these roles, and never of women.

[nahkoe]

Originally Posted by nahkoe

But there are several prophetesses mentioned in the Bible as well, both Old and New Testament. I don't know how Greek or Hebrew work, but in Spanish if both genders are referenced, the masculine is used. Is that the same for Greek and Hebrew?

It does look as if Hebrew may work this way, sort of. Masculine and feminine words exist but in documents the masculine is generally used (this is regarding current Hebrew rules of gender usage..no clue how that relates to rules in place at the time the books of the Bible were written) and intended to mean both males and females.

I can't find anything in a quick google regarding Greek.

[nahkoe]

Thanks for the answer. I'm not ignoring it, just very, very tired tonight and having trouble putting words to my thoughts.

Originally Posted by Lost and Found

Like I said, there are examples describing women serving in the Church, but nowhere do we find an example of a woman functioning in the five-fold ministry.

Where does it say that one's calling is JUST to pastor or evangelize? Such restriction is due mostly to those ‘callings’ being all that's recognized in the average church. But Paul said otherwise; he said that the five-fold's job is to mature the SAINTS so THEY can work in the MINISTRY.... What is "ministry"? Most would say, "Pulpit time," but that is NOT the case at all. 'Ministry' is simply ministering to another's need in Jesus' name. All Born Again men and women are called to this. Paul showed that a preachers calling is to focus on maturing the saints and then to help facilitate their callings. This is how Jesus and His early church defined ministry, and is also how they performed it. Later generations are the ones who altered the definition down to it only occurring behind a pulpit. Too bad, since most of those needing to hear the gospel will never be on the hearing side of a pulpit. This is exactly why apostolic 'ministry' was never to be so narrowly defined.

I think we are just lucky that there were not separate pronouns based on ethnicity in the bible... or we would be in even worse trouble.

[nahkoe]

Originally Posted by Sheltiedad

I think we are just lucky that there were not separate pronouns based on ethnicity in the bible... or we would be in even worse trouble.

I don't even want to think of what "could be" in that situation. The Bible gets used to justify plenty of hate without adding more to the mix.