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01-02-2014, 04:41 PM
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Go Dodgers!
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 45,787
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Re: Need Scripture about transfer
Quote:
Originally Posted by missourimary
It is or was part of the UPC manual. So it is the rules. just not all preachers play by them.
There is nothing in the Bible that says 'grow where you're planted' or 'this is where you were born, so this is where you stay'. There are scriptures the UPC uses to say we should stay in one local church. But do thos passages talk about the church as being only one local group that meets in a specific building under one man?
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Do you have a copy of that manual to show this?
__________________
Let it be understood that Apostolic Friends Forum is an Apostolic Forum.
Apostolic is defined on AFF as:
- There is One God. This one God reveals Himself distinctly as Father, Son and Holy Ghost.
- The Son is God himself in a human form or "God manifested in the flesh" (1Tim 3:16)
- Every sinner must repent of their sins.
- That Jesus name baptism is the only biblical mode of water baptism.
- That the Holy Ghost is for today and is received by faith with the initial evidence of speaking in tongues.
- The saint will go on to strive to live a holy life, pleasing to God.
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01-02-2014, 04:43 PM
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Go Dodgers!
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 45,787
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Re: Need Scripture about transfer
Quote:
Originally Posted by n david
Source Link
Found this link to the 2012 UPC Manual on Google.
Page 127/128 - under "Obligations" for Membership of local assembly, Article II, Section 2:
Section 3:
In my 30+ years with the UPC and work with several UPC churches, I've never heard of a UPC Pastor following this requirement. The quotes above are direct from the Manual. While other requirements above and below these have scriptures accompanying, these about the letter of membership do not have any.
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Thanks. Wow...me either. And it seems rather insincere to demand that when technically we aren't MEMBERS of the UPCI unless we are ordained ministers.
__________________
Let it be understood that Apostolic Friends Forum is an Apostolic Forum.
Apostolic is defined on AFF as:
- There is One God. This one God reveals Himself distinctly as Father, Son and Holy Ghost.
- The Son is God himself in a human form or "God manifested in the flesh" (1Tim 3:16)
- Every sinner must repent of their sins.
- That Jesus name baptism is the only biblical mode of water baptism.
- That the Holy Ghost is for today and is received by faith with the initial evidence of speaking in tongues.
- The saint will go on to strive to live a holy life, pleasing to God.
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01-02-2014, 04:49 PM
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Registered Member
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Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 11,467
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Re: Need Scripture about transfer
It's one of those control freaky sicknesses that's in the UPC. But before we pastored, it was drilled into us to do this.
__________________
Those who say it cannot be done should not interrupt the people doing it. ~Chinese Proverb
When I was young and clever, I wanted to change the world. Now that I am older and wiser, I strive to change myself. ~
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01-02-2014, 05:04 PM
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Go Dodgers!
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 45,787
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Re: Need Scripture about transfer
Quote:
Originally Posted by ILG
It's one of those control freaky sicknesses that's in the UPC. But before we pastored, it was drilled into us to do this.
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To be fair, we don't know that. This may be a relic of years gone by when a saint left a church and moved to another area and said "Hey, Im one of you. I want to join your church" to some new church/Pastor.
That church and Pastor have no idea if this person really did come from another UPC. They don't know under what circumstances he left and if he was in good standing.
I can see it as a safety precaution for other churches in a day and age when not everyone had a Telephone or we didn't have everyone's number
__________________
Let it be understood that Apostolic Friends Forum is an Apostolic Forum.
Apostolic is defined on AFF as:
- There is One God. This one God reveals Himself distinctly as Father, Son and Holy Ghost.
- The Son is God himself in a human form or "God manifested in the flesh" (1Tim 3:16)
- Every sinner must repent of their sins.
- That Jesus name baptism is the only biblical mode of water baptism.
- That the Holy Ghost is for today and is received by faith with the initial evidence of speaking in tongues.
- The saint will go on to strive to live a holy life, pleasing to God.
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01-02-2014, 05:57 PM
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mary
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Midwest
Posts: 3,002
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Re: Need Scripture about transfer
Quote:
Originally Posted by Praxeas
To be fair, we don't know that. This may be a relic of years gone by when a saint left a church and moved to another area and said "Hey, Im one of you. I want to join your church" to some new church/Pastor.
That church and Pastor have no idea if this person really did come from another UPC. They don't know under what circumstances he left and if he was in good standing.
I can see it as a safety precaution for other churches in a day and age when not everyone had a Telephone or we didn't have everyone's number
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You're right, Prax. We don't know why it started. Has anyone ever tried to change it in the manual? If it only has historic significance surely it would be easier to reword in the manual than issues like video...
How does one pastor determine if a member of another church is in good standing with God, with or without a letter of transfer from a pastor?
__________________
What we make of the Bible will never be as great a thing as what the Bible will - if we let it - make of us.~Rich Mullins
I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use.~Galileo Galilei
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01-02-2014, 06:07 PM
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Go Dodgers!
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 45,787
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Re: Need Scripture about transfer
Quote:
Originally Posted by missourimary
You're right, Prax. We don't know why it started. Has anyone ever tried to change it in the manual? If it only has historic significance surely it would be easier to reword in the manual than issues like video...
How does one pastor determine if a member of another church is in good standing with God, with or without a letter of transfer from a pastor?
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UPC should be renamed UTC.
Unable To Change.
The UPC is slow to change...EVERYTHING. I believe the reason has to do with the legalistic people that ran the org that feared any kind of change as a compromise.
It took forever for them to modernize the Herald. We are dead last to take advantage of the Internet and TV.
Our Tracts, until recently, appeared as though they were from the 1950s.
And most of them have not been re-written. The WAP bibles they sell with the doctrinal inserts are ALL KJV only.
Supposedly they "outlawed" beards and mustaches because of the hippie movement that died in the 70s.
Change is painfully slow in the UPC
__________________
Let it be understood that Apostolic Friends Forum is an Apostolic Forum.
Apostolic is defined on AFF as:
- There is One God. This one God reveals Himself distinctly as Father, Son and Holy Ghost.
- The Son is God himself in a human form or "God manifested in the flesh" (1Tim 3:16)
- Every sinner must repent of their sins.
- That Jesus name baptism is the only biblical mode of water baptism.
- That the Holy Ghost is for today and is received by faith with the initial evidence of speaking in tongues.
- The saint will go on to strive to live a holy life, pleasing to God.
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01-02-2014, 06:37 PM
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mary
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Midwest
Posts: 3,002
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Re: Need Scripture about transfer
duplicate post-sorry!
__________________
What we make of the Bible will never be as great a thing as what the Bible will - if we let it - make of us.~Rich Mullins
I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use.~Galileo Galilei
Last edited by missourimary; 01-02-2014 at 06:55 PM.
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01-02-2014, 06:39 PM
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Go Dodgers!
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 45,787
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Re: Need Scripture about transfer
The problem with the letter deal is, it can be abused by Pastors that don't want a saint to leave
__________________
Let it be understood that Apostolic Friends Forum is an Apostolic Forum.
Apostolic is defined on AFF as:
- There is One God. This one God reveals Himself distinctly as Father, Son and Holy Ghost.
- The Son is God himself in a human form or "God manifested in the flesh" (1Tim 3:16)
- Every sinner must repent of their sins.
- That Jesus name baptism is the only biblical mode of water baptism.
- That the Holy Ghost is for today and is received by faith with the initial evidence of speaking in tongues.
- The saint will go on to strive to live a holy life, pleasing to God.
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01-02-2014, 06:52 PM
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mary
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Midwest
Posts: 3,002
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Re: Need Scripture about transfer
Yep. Sorry for the duplicate post-I'm on very limited internet tonight.
I'm sure it might be difficult to let someone transfer if they were good friends, useful in service, good tithe payers, popular (might take others with them), or suspicious of wrongdoing.
__________________
What we make of the Bible will never be as great a thing as what the Bible will - if we let it - make of us.~Rich Mullins
I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use.~Galileo Galilei
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01-02-2014, 07:01 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: chasin Grace
Posts: 9,594
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Re: Need Scripture about transfer
Wasn't Paul told not to be a 'preacher of the letters?'
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