The poor in America

[Socialite]

Originally Posted by Truthseeker

If I came across a guy beat up on the side of the road I would indeed help. Not sure how this would apply to "poor in america" discussion.

He that has ears, let him ear.

No wonder Jesus said that with his parables.

[Socialite]

Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength and with all your mind’[a]; and, ‘Love your neighbor as yourself

Who is my neighbor?

Jesus tells a story to answer his question (defining who our neighbor is)

“Which of these three do you think was a neighbor to the man who fell into the hands of robbers?”

37 The expert in the law replied, “The one who had mercy on him.”

Jesus told him, “Go and do likewise.”

Your neighbors are all around you, and they are wounded, beat up, oppressed, depressed, rejected, afflicted, addicted, bound --- and all the while, not too much different than you or I, and image bearers of Creator God.

So while you're looking to break up fights, don't miss the forest for the trees.

[Truthseeker]

Originally Posted by Socialite

Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength and with all your mind’[a]; and, ‘Love your neighbor as yourself

Who is my neighbor?

Jesus tells a story to answer his question (defining who our neighbor is)

“Which of these three do you think was a neighbor to the man who fell into the hands of robbers?”

37 The expert in the law replied, “The one who had mercy on him.”

Jesus told him, “Go and do likewise.”

Your neighbors are all around you, and they are wounded, beat up, oppressed, depressed, rejected, afflicted, addicted, bound --- and all the while, not too much different than you or I, and image bearers of Creator God.

So while you're looking to break up fights, don't miss the forest for the trees.

Understand but how are you applying this to the discussion? Are you using these scriptures to support gov welfare program? free cell phone service? etc..

[Socialite]

Originally Posted by Truthseeker

Understand but how are you applying this to the discussion? Are you using these scriptures to support gov welfare program? free cell phone service? etc..

No. Just the attitudes and logic used.

And I think it to be completely fair if a brother sees the government having a welfare role, supporting its people in unique circumstances. Doesn't mean I have to agree in what that looks like (Fed, State, Local, Private Charity/Family, etc), but it's a legitimate discussion.

I'm more concerned with the presented perspectives here on poverty and poor people.

[Truthseeker]

Originally Posted by Socialite

No. Just the attitudes and logic used.

And I think it to be completely fair if a brother sees the government having a welfare role, supporting its people in unique circumstances. Doesn't mean I have to agree in what that looks like (Fed, State, Local, Private Charity/Family, etc), but it's a legitimate discussion.

I'm more concerned with the presented perspectives here on poverty and poor people.

Goctha, as far as "poor in america" it's not complicated, IMO.

[Cindy]

I think many are poor in America that receive no real help. Even some with jobs cannot afford the essentials.

[coadie]

Originally Posted by aegsm76

This is a little old, (2007), but I could not find anything newer.

•Forty-six percent of all poor households actually own their own homes. The average home owned by persons classified as poor by the Census Bureau is a three bedroom house with one and a half baths, a garage, and a porch or patio.
•Seventy-six percent of poor households have air conditioning. By contrast, 30 years ago, only 36 percent of the entire U.S. population enjoyed air conditioning.
•Only 6 percent of poor households are overcrowded. More than two thirds have more than two rooms per person.
•The average poor American has more living space than the average individual living in Paris, London, Vienna, Athens, and other cities throughout Europe. (These comparisons are to the average citizens in foreign countries, not to those classified as poor.)
•Nearly three quarters of poor households own a car; 30 percent own two or more cars.
•Ninety-seven percent of poor households have a color television; over half own two or more color televisions.
•Seventy-eight percent have a VCR or DVD player; 62 percent have cable or satellite TV reception.
•Seventy-three percent own microwave ovens, more than half have a stereo, and a third have an automatic dishwasher.

http://www.heritage.org/Research/Rep...rty-in-America

I live here on less than a dollar a month," he said.

George Obama in Kenya.

Barry's half bro.

[aegsm76]

Let me tell you a story about being poor.
I was married, going to college and working two part-time jobs.
My wife was pregnant with our first son.
We were going to have the delivery done at the "cheap" hospital in town.
We had no insurance, so it was all cash out of our pockets.
Someone talked me into going to the hospital and talking to a counselor about the government helping pick up the bill.
Now remember, I am going to school for 15 credit hours and working two part time jobs which were about 60-70 hours per week.
I would leave one job about 5 in the morning, after working 8 hours and drive to my other job to work for 4-8 hours.
Many mornings I fell asleep driving to work.
Anyway, they gave us a list of paperwork to take to the meeting.
We go to the meeting, there is a room of 20-30 desks and everyone of the desks is full of people applying for government assistance.
We showed them all of the paperwork, which was basically what our income was and what our bills were.
They put this into their calculations and come back and say that we are NOT eligible for any assistance, because our income is too high.
At this point I was a little upset, especially after looking around the room and seeing people who I could tell had not worked a day in their life.
So, I asked them that if I had only worked one part time job and not two, what would they have done.
They said they would have picked up the FULL bill.
That told me all I ever needed to know about government assistance.
I've never tried for it since.
Ironically, son number two was born,(with insurance), at the "high-class" hospital in town.
His full bill, (not just the small amount I paid), was HALF of what the bills came to at the "cheap" hospital.
Why?
Government assistance to the "cheap" hospital.
We were still paying for son #1, after son #2 was fully paid for.

[Truthseeker]

Originally Posted by aegsm76

Let me tell you a story about being poor.
I was married, going to college and working two part-time jobs.
My wife was pregnant with our first son.
We were going to have the delivery done at the "cheap" hospital in town.
We had no insurance, so it was all cash out of our pockets.
Someone talked me into going to the hospital and talking to a counselor about the government helping pick up the bill.
Now remember, I am going to school for 15 credit hours and working two part time jobs which were about 60-70 hours per week.
I would leave one job about 5 in the morning, after working 8 hours and drive to my other job to work for 4-8 hours.
Many mornings I fell asleep driving to work.
Anyway, they gave us a list of paperwork to take to the meeting.
We go to the meeting, there is a room of 20-30 desks and everyone of the desks is full of people applying for government assistance.
We showed them all of the paperwork, which was basically what our income was and what our bills were.
They put this into their calculations and come back and say that we are NOT eligible for any assistance, because our income is too high.
At this point I was a little upset, especially after looking around the room and seeing people who I could tell had not worked a day in their life.
So, I asked them that if I had only worked one part time job and not two, what would they have done.
They said they would have picked up the FULL bill.
That told me all I ever needed to know about government assistance.
I've never tried for it since.
Ironically, son number two was born,(with insurance), at the "high-class" hospital in town.
His full bill, (not just the small amount I paid), was HALF of what the bills came to at the "cheap" hospital.
Why?
Government assistance to the "cheap" hospital.
We were still paying for son #1, after son #2 was fully paid for.

it's a broken system that breeds a certain mentality.

[Socialite]

Originally Posted by aegsm76

Let me tell you a story about being poor.
I was married, going to college and working two part-time jobs.
My wife was pregnant with our first son.
We were going to have the delivery done at the "cheap" hospital in town.
We had no insurance, so it was all cash out of our pockets.
Someone talked me into going to the hospital and talking to a counselor about the government helping pick up the bill.
Now remember, I am going to school for 15 credit hours and working two part time jobs which were about 60-70 hours per week.
I would leave one job about 5 in the morning, after working 8 hours and drive to my other job to work for 4-8 hours.
Many mornings I fell asleep driving to work.
Anyway, they gave us a list of paperwork to take to the meeting.
We go to the meeting, there is a room of 20-30 desks and everyone of the desks is full of people applying for government assistance.
We showed them all of the paperwork, which was basically what our income was and what our bills were.
They put this into their calculations and come back and say that we are NOT eligible for any assistance, because our income is too high.
At this point I was a little upset, especially after looking around the room and seeing people who I could tell had not worked a day in their life.
So, I asked them that if I had only worked one part time job and not two, what would they have done.
They said they would have picked up the FULL bill.
That told me all I ever needed to know about government assistance.
I've never tried for it since.
Ironically, son number two was born,(with insurance), at the "high-class" hospital in town.
His full bill, (not just the small amount I paid), was HALF of what the bills came to at the "cheap" hospital.
Why?
Government assistance to the "cheap" hospital.
We were still paying for son #1, after son #2 was fully paid for.

Been on that end of things as well (scholarships, assistance in dire times, etc). Policies are imperfect, and you've exposed one of the flaws. Sometimes these situations, IMO, require case managers to do more than look at numbers and paperwork. Can I ask how much you were bringing in at the time with both jobs?

When you said you looked around the room and could tell "there were many who haven't worked a day in their life" it was a direct read into your emotions concerning this issue. Though, I'm not sure how you can determine that by a quick glance, and because not all of them were going to college and married, or could even see light at the end of their bleak tunnels.

The current system needs repair, for sure. And if more families helped provide for their own, more churches helped those in their community with need, etc we'd all be a lot further along. Of course, any of us who give today to someone, view it as an investment, and are looking for the ROI in a dividend of success that can point back to us and say "you saved me."

May God help us avoid being self-righteous, because we "did it ourselves" and "pulled ourselves up by our own bootstraps." It's those who, not seeing their lives as gifts from God, gracious blessings bestowed, project the same level of gracelessness.