Modesty? Yeah right.

[ReformedDave]

Originally Posted by MissBrattified

I'd love to respond flippantly, but I can't because I'm not sure whether you're joking or not....

Actually, for once, I'm serious.

[SDG]

Originally Posted by MissBrattified

Minus the curls, they just look gay.

OK ... MODESTY IS THIS ... MINUS THE FACIAL HAIR!!!

[MissBrattified]

Wow...so much to disagree with...where to start????

Originally Posted by AtlantaBishop

My advice (as if I were asked for it) is if you want to be used - obey the rules. Be careful - don't voice things like this too loudly or you will be labeled as a non-conformist and trouble maker.

If you voice disagreement too loudly, especially in a way that persuades others to your point of view in opposition to leadership, you are making trouble, e.g., sowing discord.

You will be limiting your ministry in said church or organization if you keep thinking this way or voicing your thoughts.

How? It isn't possible to minister effectively unless you agree with everyone around you?

There are people in every kind of church that push the envelope to see how far they can go.

Which means that many pastors will automatically see "pushing the envelope" as testing the boundaries, and not necessarily as a good thing!!!! Rightfully so, I think.

I had to come down hard on this past Sunday with a great crowd there - I had no other time to do it - but I had to lay down the law on the walking and talking and water fountain going and all the carrying on.

Got scripture for that?

Even when you are considered "liberal" people will push at the limitations so - if your happy in ministry where you are - obey the rules - keep a good spirit - stop worrying about what others do - you are NOT responsible for them - You are only responsible for YOU! God bless you - I feel your pain!

NOT so!!! If you are in ministry you are accountable to God for every person you influence and lead and minister to. JMHO!!!!! If you're going to be in ministry, shoulder the burden of extra accountability or do something else with your life!

[Kutless]

Originally Posted by MissBrattified

Wow...so much to disagree with...where to start????



If you voice disagreement too loudly, especially in a way that persuades others to your point of view in opposition to leadership, you are making trouble, e.g., sowing discord.



How? It isn't possible to minister effectively unless you agree with everyone around you?



Which means that many pastors will automatically see "pushing the envelope" as testing the boundaries, and not necessarily as a good thing!!!! Rightfully so, I think.



Got scripture for that?



NOT so!!! If you are in ministry you are accountable to God for every person you influence and lead and minister to. JMHO!!!!! If you're going to be in ministry, shoulder the burden of extra accountability or do something else with your life!

For the record........not sowing the discord. One person knows me personally on here. I was just airing some stuff out.

[MissBrattified]

Originally Posted by ReformedDave

Actually, for once, I'm serious.

Well, in that case...cool! You should have it done on one of those Discovery channel Health shows...that way the cost is probably covered, and we can all observe the surgery.

Okay, maybe that would be a little too much exposure....even for a liberal.

Seriously...it is rather discouraging when you lose weight and your skin doesn't pop right back to where it should.

[SDG]

Originally Posted by MissBrattified

Wow...so much to disagree with...where to start????

I'm going to call Ms. Brattified ... Annie Oakley from now on ... this girl can shoot with the best of them

Originally Posted by Kutless

Went to a wonderful fellowship last night. Lots of food and lots of laughs. One of the things that makes serving the Lord so awesome.

I began to look around at "us" and recall how we are quite the braggerts when it comes to separation. At times it almost becomes a prejudice as we look down on people who cannot afford the more "in style" modest dress.

I then began to look at those that held position at church and began to realize how foolish my thinking is. The bottum line is modesty and we must make a clear evaluation of what that is.

One gentlemen had on some stone washed jeans so tight I said a quiet prayer for his nether region. OUCH! His shirt sleeves were tight as to show tattoos of wizards, past relationships, etc. etc.

Another, in the middle of a casual setting, sported his expensive high fashion dress shoes, very gaudy and decrative. Name brand shirt and slacks very evident.

Then we look at the female examples of modesty. We had two or three playing ball in the yard with very revealing form fitting t-shirts. We had some young teenagers with skirts climbing monkey bars, sliding down slides,etc.

The most appalling of the evening was the youth pastors wife. Her clothes could not have been any tighter. Form fitting jean skirt barely covered the knees. My wife told me later that evening she helped her get some things in the kitchen and when she bent over her shirt crawled up her back halfway. I don't know if there were any men present at the time or not.

Then I think of how there is a no shorts rule on the men for our softball team. I think of the guilt that consumes me when I wish to wear shorts to mow the yard. How I feel the necessity to remain secretive in sending my 3yr old to school in shorts for outside play. Pants in the winter.

Preacher man, don't you think for a second that your so-called dress codes are anymore modest than the things I refrain from. Refrain from not because I believe them but because I want to be used.

I feel a lot of times I am amoungst hipocrites.

When and where did modesty in dress become a sign someone was saved or right with God? To many have bought into this lie, if God on the inside it show on the outside, a dress sign. If God is in someone it will show from within and on the outward person, but has nothing to do with outward dress, Gods love, Jesus, that the true sign, not some dress line of standards.

[Nahum]

Originally Posted by AtlantaBishop

True Dan - I was told so many times - Its Cold and Dark out there and everybody I know that left us - they wish they were back here with us!

My advice (as if I were asked for it) is if you want to be used - obey the rules. Be careful - don't voice things like this too loudly or you will be labeled as a non-conformist and trouble maker. You will be limiting your ministry in said church or organization if you keep thinking this way or voicing your thoughts.
There are hypocrites in everything and every church there is. Conservative - liberal, progressive, middle of the road, hard line - in EVERY kind - so don't think this is exclusive with your group. There are people in every kind of church that push the envelope to see how far they can go.
I had to come down hard on this past Sunday with a great crowd there - I had no other time to do it - but I had to lay down the law on the walking and talking and water fountain going and all the carrying on. Even when you are considered "liberal" people will push at the limitations so - if your happy in ministry where you are - obey the rules - keep a good spirit - stop worrying about what others do - you are NOT responsible for them - You are only responsible for YOU! God bless you - I feel your pain!

POTD

[Kutless]

Originally Posted by Pastor Poster

POTD

What does that mean?

[MissBrattified]

Originally Posted by Kutless

For the record........not sowing the discord. One person knows me personally on here. I was just airing some stuff out.

I didn't think you were, Kutless. I was disagreeing with AB, not you. He has a rather short fuse, you know. ...fun to observe....

Truthfully, we've probably all observed the same inconsistencies and either wondered about them or voiced our observations privately...

In reality, though, we probably all have inconsistencies, if we were viewed through a microscope. I know I don't have it all figured out. Just this past week, my husband allowed my daughter to buy a pair of gauchos...and while I could say all day long that there's not technically anything wrong with wearing gauchos, especially to play or for PE...when she put them on, I found them to be offensive and demanded that she wear something else, and the only reason I could come up with was that they didn't look very feminine, and she's looking at me as if I've grown two heads since they were very loose, and looked no different from the culottes I sewed for her at the beginning of the year!????

So I think many of us have contradictions that are convictions and traditions and preferences and habits all mixed up together, and sometimes its hard to separate them and decipher one from the other.