Whoa! Polygamist solution is frightening...

[Newman]

Originally Posted by Nina

YES!

What else could they do?

I stand by my charge of "government haters"

Time will soon tell a lot.

Government Haters? Why on earth would that be (if true)?

A song created for the children on a web blog that also takes issue with the government over-reaching.

"I'll never forget that sad April day
When the Baptists brought buses and
Cops hauled us away
From our home on the ranch
Where the kids used to play
And sing "Ki Yi Yippe Ki Yay"

I'll never forget how all we knelt and prayed
While men with machine guns
Filed in like a parade
By the hundreds, an army
Swarmed God's holy place
Singing "Ki Yi Yippe Ki Yay"

I'll never forget hearing Judge Walther say
That my parents' beliefs were
Abusive per se
And I needed protection
From them and their faith
She sang "Ki Yi Yippe Ki Yay"

So they brought in more buses and swept me away
Into foster care, now the Judge
Says I am safe
But I don't feel that way
All alone and afraid
Singing "Ki Yi Yippe Ki Yay Ki Yay"
Singing "Ki Yi Yippe Ki Yay""

Posted by Gritsforbreakfast

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by Newman

Government Haters? Why on earth would that be (if true)?

A song created for the children on a web blog that also takes issue with the government over-reaching.

"I'll never forget that sad April day
When the Baptists brought buses and
Cops hauled us away
From our home on the ranch
Where the kids used to play
And sing "Ki Yi Yippe Ki Yay"

I'll never forget how all we knelt and prayed
While men with machine guns
Filed in like a parade
By the hundreds, an army
Swarmed God's holy place
Singing "Ki Yi Yippe Ki Yay"

I'll never forget hearing Judge Walther say
That my parents' beliefs were
Abusive per se
And I needed protection
From them and their faith
She sang "Ki Yi Yippe Ki Yay"

So they brought in more buses and swept me away
Into foster care, now the Judge
Says I am safe
But I don't feel that way
All alone and afraid
Singing "Ki Yi Yippe Ki Yay Ki Yay"
Singing "Ki Yi Yippe Ki Yay""

Posted by Gritsforbreakfast

God's Holy Place?

[Newman]

Pressing On- I must say that it is quite interesting that I am on this side of the table having been refered to many times on these forums as a feminist.

I see this as an attack on the family structure as many non-polygamous Christians practice marriage. I just don't think the Christian Baptists leading the charge in Texas realize who they are actually in cahoots with.

Did you know the judge originally was going to deny mothers the opportunity to nurse their babies because many women go back to work in 6 weeks? How low can we go?

[Cindy]

[Newman]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

God's Holy Place?

The temple to them was somewhat like a church altar to us (only more so); or at least it was before law enforcement desecrated it even as the men wept and prayed.

[ChristopherHall]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

LOL! You are probably right. I am sorry that children are involved and the mothers. I'm sorry for the crack babies and children of sexual and verbal abuse. I'm sorry for all children.

Amen.

The fact is they are a polygamous group and it is against the law here and so are the underage marriages.

Polygamy is against the law...but technically this isn't polygamy as far as legality goes. Each man was only "legally married" to one woman...the other wives were "spiritual wives". So technically you have a couple who is legally married allowing multiple women to co-habitate with them. So as long as they are adults the law typically looks the other way and allows them to live the lifestyle they choose. This is also why the "spiritual wives" in this group qualify for welfare, legally they're not married. No marriage license or papers were issued.

I don't consider what they have as "religious" freedom. What they practice is against the word of God and the laws of our state.

Many religious practices are both against the Word of God and legal. I do see how this is against the laws of your "state". Legally speaking, they are going to have to determine if the statute of the state supersedes their First Amendment rights according to the Constitution of the United States. So most likely this will go to the Supreme Court and the SCOTUS will have to determine if a state statute can challenge religious liberty. I personally believe that the SCOTUS will rule in favor of the state, citing how the state statute is set to protect minors. But with as crazy as America has gotten....there's no telling. I think the SCOTUS will rule in favor of the plantifs who can prove that they didn't have relations with anyone under age. They can argue that their religious and privacy rights were violated when they were rounded up without having broken the law.

Perhaps after a time in court they will allow the polygamy and then people can also start marrying their pets. Where does it stop?

LOL

You might find it interesting to note that Abraham Lincoln never had a marriage license. Early America didn't see "marriage" as an institution governed or defined by the state. It was regarded as a private social contract. Most of the time all that was needed for a couple to be recognized as being married was a public affirmation of being married. State Supreme Courts recognized cohabitation as being the only evidence needed to legally define a couple as being married. The first marriage license in the US was issued in 1920's when 38 states prohibited whites from marrying blacks, mulattos, Japanese, Chinese, Indians, Mongolians, Malays or Filipinos without a state approved license. In short, the marriage license wasn't designed for moral reasons or definitions, it was institutionalized racism. However, I don't think the government will get out of the marriage business...it's become too politically popular to use it as a weapon in politics and it generates revenues as people pay for their licenses.

We have to challenge some things and not waive every thing as "freedom".

True...but how far do we go with using "government" to control others? I can personally see using government to protect children....but as sinful as a relationship might be I believe that adults have the right to determine the relationships they choose to have.

We are loosing our freedom by our freedom.

Not sure how this is so. It could be argued that marriage was something considered of greater value before the government got involved. Marriage may have actually suffered as a result of the government's attempting to define what constitutes a marriage and what does not. One could say that perhaps private families, individuals, and faith traditions should be left to define marriage for their members, notarize the unions and file them within the community and the individuals involved. But again...I don't see us going back to that much freedom. The government has too much at stake.

[Cindy]

Originally Posted by Newman

The temple to them was somewhat like a church altar to us (only more so); or at least it was before law enforcement desecrated it even as the men wept and prayed.

Yep, they probably thought they were busted. Some criminals cry and pray a little then...........

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by Newman

The temple to them was somewhat like a church altar to us (only more so); or at least it was before law enforcement desecrated it even as the men wept and prayed.

They cried because they couldn't have a child for a wife? Is that what they were crying about?

[Nina]

Originally Posted by Newman

Government Haters? Why on earth would that be (if true)?

They hate the government because it won't let them marry as they believe they should.

Read some of their leaders writings.

Or do we distance them from their leaders?

Nina

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by Newman

Pressing On- I must say that it is quite interesting that I am on this side of the table having been refered to many times on these forums as a feminist.

I see this as an attack on the family structure as many non-polygamous Christians practice marriage. I just don't think the Christian Baptists leading the charge in Texas realize who they are actually in cahoots with.

Did you know the judge originally was going to deny mothers the opportunity to nurse their babies because many women go back to work in 6 weeks? How low can we go?

I cannot identify this group with a sound family structure. Sorry. The men are the ones in charge of this thing. Men - marrying very young girls. They should be castrated and an end put to that junk.

I know they married younger women in times past because they could bear more children and their life spans were shorter. That is not so, today.

The men in this group have no excuse. They are selfish pigs.

Well, I'm on a rant. I should go to bed, probably. lol