A Few Thoughts To Ponder

[Jacob's Ladder]

Have you ever wondered whether we will actually recognize and/or know each other in heaven? I remember the apostles had a difficult time recognizing Jesus after his resurrection. Seriously, there will be millions of saints there. How will we find each other? Will we remember each other? A few people have quoted 1Corinthians 13:12 to affirm that we will know each other, but have you really studied that scripture?

Another thought that popped into my mind while reading the following…….

1 Corinthians 15:42

42 So is it with the resurrection of the dead. What is sown is perishable; what is raised is imperishable.

1Corinthinas 15:50-54

50 I tell you this, brothers: flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable.
51 Behold! I tell you a mystery. We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
52 in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised imperishable, and we shall be changed.
53 For this perishable body must put on the imperishable, and this mortal body must put on immortality.
54 When the perishable puts on the imperishable, and the mortal puts on immortality, then shall come to pass the saying that is written:“Death is swallowed up in victory.”


Notice the bolded words. The imperishable can’t inherit the perishable, but at the sound of the trumpet, only then shall we become imperishable. After the trumpet sounds, the dead and living shall be transformed. The perishable must put on the imperishable and the mortal must put on immortality.

How can an individual after death inherit an imperishable heaven when they have not been changed into imperishable status? According to the bible, we are changed into imperishable status only after the trumpet sounds. Prior to the trumpet sounding, the bible reads that, “nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable,” which signifies that we are imperishable prior to the trumpet sounding.

Do the saints really go to heaven after their death……….hmm……..lol

[Michael The Disciple]

Originally Posted by Jacob's Ladder

Have you ever wondered whether we will actually recognize and/or know each other in heaven? I remember the apostles had a difficult time recognizing Jesus after his resurrection. Seriously, there will be millions of saints there. How will we find each other? Will we remember each other? A few people have quoted 1Corinthians 13:12 to affirm that we will know each other, but have you really studied that scripture?

Another thought that popped into my mind while reading the following…….

1 Corinthians 15:42

42 So is it with the resurrection of the dead. What is sown is perishable; what is raised is imperishable.

1Corinthinas 15:50-54

50 I tell you this, brothers: flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable.
51 Behold! I tell you a mystery. We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
52 in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised imperishable, and we shall be changed.
53 For this perishable body must put on the imperishable, and this mortal body must put on immortality.
54 When the perishable puts on the imperishable, and the mortal puts on immortality, then shall come to pass the saying that is written:“Death is swallowed up in victory.”


Notice the bolded words. The imperishable can’t inherit the perishable, but at the sound of the trumpet, only then shall we become imperishable. After the trumpet sounds, the dead and living shall be transformed. The perishable must put on the imperishable and the mortal must put on immortality.

How can an individual after death inherit an imperishable heaven when they have not been changed into imperishable status? According to the bible, we are changed into imperishable status only after the trumpet sounds. Prior to the trumpet sounding, the bible reads that, “nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable,” which signifies that we are imperishable prior to the trumpet sounding.

Do the saints really go to heaven after their death……….hmm……..lol

No they don't. They sleep the sleep of death until Jesus comes in the resurrection.

[CC1]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

No they don't. They sleep the sleep of death until Jesus comes in the resurrection.

Like pretty much everything else in the bible the idea of "soul sleep" is debatable with a lot of different views.

[ixoye_val69]

I think this is going to turn into an interesting debate. I am anxious to read the posts because I also have wondered about this very thing. Great question. I love this forum.

[Lafon]

Originally Posted by CC1

Like pretty much everything else in the bible the idea of "soul sleep" is debatable with a lot of different views.

Isn't that because most people fail to obey the commandment of Proverbs 3:5?

"Trust in the LORD with all thine heart; AND LEAN NOT UNTO THINE OWN UNDERSTANDING ?

Trusting in our (inherited) carnal mind for the understanding of the principles of God's written Word, instead of SEEKING, ASKING, & KNOCKING, as commanded by the Lord Jesus Christ (Matthew 7:7), will ALWAYS bring about "different views"!

[Sean]

Originally Posted by Jacob's Ladder

Have you ever wondered whether we will actually recognize and/or know each other in heaven? I remember the apostles had a difficult time recognizing Jesus after his resurrection. Seriously, there will be millions of saints there. How will we find each other? Will we remember each other? A few people have quoted 1Corinthians 13:12 to affirm that we will know each other, but have you really studied that scripture?

Another thought that popped into my mind while reading the following…….

1 Corinthians 15:42

42 So is it with the resurrection of the dead. What is sown is perishable; what is raised is imperishable.

1Corinthinas 15:50-54

50 I tell you this, brothers: flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable.
51 Behold! I tell you a mystery. We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
52 in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised imperishable, and we shall be changed.
53 For this perishable body must put on the imperishable, and this mortal body must put on immortality.
54 When the perishable puts on the imperishable, and the mortal puts on immortality, then shall come to pass the saying that is written:“Death is swallowed up in victory.”


Notice the bolded words. The imperishable can’t inherit the perishable, but at the sound of the trumpet, only then shall we become imperishable. After the trumpet sounds, the dead and living shall be transformed. The perishable must put on the imperishable and the mortal must put on immortality.

How can an individual after death inherit an imperishable heaven when they have not been changed into imperishable status? According to the bible, we are changed into imperishable status only after the trumpet sounds. Prior to the trumpet sounding, the bible reads that, “nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable,” which signifies that we are imperishable prior to the trumpet sounding.

Do the saints really go to heaven after their death……….hmm……..lol

Death is compared to sleep, even by Jesus concerning Lazarus His friend.

Before we receive our resurrected bodies, we are probably in a "sleep dream" state, while the wicked are in a "sleep nightmare" state. I have not studied this out in depth, but the Bible clearly says that all the dead are in some type of sleep. However, they are very aware of their surroundings.

[Steve Epley]

Peter, James, John knew Moses and Elijah on the Mountain?

[Carl]

Originally Posted by Steve Epley

Peter, James, John knew Moses and Elijah on the Mountain?

This is something I've always wondered about. How did they know who it was.
Well they had seen their pictures in a bible story book probably! Seriously, they were either told that is who it was or somehow they were able to recognize them. After all they had read everything Moses and Elijah had written.

[Lafon]

Originally Posted by Sean

Death is compared to sleep, even by Jesus concerning Lazarus His friend.

Before we receive our resurrected bodies, we are probably in a "sleep dream" state, while the wicked are in a "sleep nightmare" state. I have not studied this out in depth, but the Bible clearly says that all the dead are in some type of sleep. However, they are very aware of their surroundings.

Sean, aren't your statements "speculative," seeing you tender NO scriptural support for them? If one desires that others accept that which they state to be true, I've always found it best to provide a specific text, or two, to authenticate what I proclaim as truth, for in so doing it then becomes what "saith the word of the Lord" which convicts others to accept it, and not my word alone.

In stating this, I would challenge you to provide me even a single passage of scripture in support of your claim that the dead (wicked or righteous) "are very aware of their surroundings." I will agree with you, however, that the "dead are in some type of sleep," for the language of the Bible makes this fact rather indisputably clear.

Indeed, what does "the word of the Lord" reveal about the intermediate state of reality which the soul experiences following the death of the physical body in which it presently exists? The answer, I believe, is clearly stated in these words excerpted from Ecclesiastes 9:5-6 ...

"For the living know that they shall die: BUT THE DEAD KNOW NOT ANY THING, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten. Also their love, and their hatred, and their envy, is now perished; neither have they any more a portion for ever in any thing that is done under the sun."

Note of importance: the words "the memory of them is forgotten" does not imply/infer that those who knew the dead when they were alive and residing among them will FORGET them or fail to retain REMEMBRANCE of them after an individual dies, rather that the ability of the one that has died to remember things will cease to exist, for that soul KNOWS NOT ANY THING!

Minus quoting a multitude of scriptural passages which give authenticity to the claim that the soul of man continues its existence in what we might rightly call a "suspended state of animation, or liveliness" (aka, "sleep") following the death of the body in which they resided while "alive" and resident upon the earth (both wicked & righteous), nevertheless, there exists a "mystery" that surrounds this which it appears most people simply fail to understand, and this has resulted in much "speculative conclusions" which have led to much confusion about the matter. Paul attempted to address this "mystery" in these words found recorded in I Corinthians 15:51-52 ...

"Behold, I shew you a mystery; WE SHALL NOT ALL SLEEP, but we shall all be changed, in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed."

The "mystery" which Paul was endeavoring to reveal, was NOT that there would be some who would not experience what is commonly called "soul sleep" following the death of their body, as many, yes, the majority have believed and continue to publicly proclaim, rather he was stating, and this quite simply, that there were to be SOME to whom God would grant a "temporary suspension" (if I might use this phrase) from experiencing the common affect which death brings, that is, the "sleep of death" (see Psalm 13:3), however, this "temporary suspension" would only endure UNTIL that moment which immediately precedes the 2nd coming of the "Son of man" to the earth at the end of the present age.

There's much, much more to this "mystery" that could, and needs to be written, however, neither time nor space allows me to do that at this time. Suffice it to be said though, that much of what has been, and continues to be published as truth about this matter, is thoroughly saturated with numerous erroneous assumptions and conclusions, making the truth of the matter difficult to be explained.

[KeptByTheWord]

And, I've always wondered about those who were resurrected after the death of Jesus and were seen walking around.