Apostolic Friends Forum - Isaiah 3 and jewelry...

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Re: Isaiah 3 and jewelry...

<-- Continued from last post, sorry.

Quote:

Ezekiel 23:

1 The word of the LORD came again unto me, saying,

2 Son of man, there were two women, the daughters of one mother:

3 And they committed whoredoms in Egypt; they committed whoredoms in their youth: there were their breasts pressed, and there they bruised the teats of their virginity.

4 And the names of them were Aholah the elder, and Aholibah her sister: and they were mine, and they bare sons and daughters. Thus were their names; Samaria is Aholah, and Jerusalem Aholibah.

36 The LORD said moreover unto me; Son of man, wilt thou judge Aholah and Aholibah? yea, declare unto them their abominations;

37 That they have committed adultery, and blood is in their hands, and with their idols have they committed adultery, and have also caused their sons, whom they bare unto me, to pass for them through the fire, to devour them.

40 And furthermore, that ye have sent for men to come from far, unto whom a messenger was sent; and, lo, they came: for whom thou didst wash thyself, paintedst thy eyes, and deckedst thyself with ornaments,

41 And satest upon a stately bed, and a table prepared before it, whereupon thou hast set mine incense and mine oil.

48 Thus will I cause lewdness to cease out of the land, that all women may be taught not to do after your lewdness.

49 And they shall recompense your lewdness upon you, and ye shall bear the sins of your idols: and ye shall know that I am the Lord GOD.

Samaria (Aholah) was the capital city of the northern kingdom (Israel).

Jerusalem (Aholibah) was the capital city of the southern kingdom (Judah).

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Hosea 2:

13 And I will visit upon her the days of Baalim, wherein she burned incense to them, and she decked herself with her earrings and her jewels, and she went after her lovers, and forgat me, saith the LORD.

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Revelation 17:

1 And there came one of the seven angels which had the seven vials, and talked with me, saying unto me, Come hither; I will shew unto thee the judgment of the great whore that sitteth upon many waters:

2 With whom the kings of the earth have committed fornication, and the inhabitants of the earth have been made drunk with the wine of her fornication.

3 So he carried me away in the spirit into the wilderness: and I saw a woman sit upon a scarlet coloured beast, full of names of blasphemy, having seven heads and ten horns.

4 And the woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet colour, and decked with gold and precious stones and pearls, having a golden cup in her hand full of abominations and filthiness of her fornication:

5 And upon her forehead was a name written, MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH.

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1Kings 21:

25 But there was none like unto Ahab, which did sell himself to work wickedness in the sight of the LORD, whom Jezebel his wife stirred up.

2Kings 9:

7 And thou shalt smite the house of Ahab thy master, that I may avenge the blood of my servants the prophets, and the blood of all the servants of the LORD, at the hand of Jezebel.

30 And when Jehu was come to Jezreel, Jezebel heard of it; and she painted her face, and tired her head, and looked out at a window.

33 And he said, Throw her down. So they threw her down: and some of her blood was sprinkled on the wall, and on the horses: and he trode her under foot.

36 Wherefore they came again, and told him. And he said, This is the word of the LORD, which he spake by his servant Elijah the Tishbite, saying, In the portion of Jezreel shall dogs eat the flesh of Jezebel:

37 And the carcase of Jezebel shall be as dung upon the face of the field in the portion of Jezreel; so that they shall not say, This is Jezebel.

Tire: archaic : to adorn (the hair) with an ornament" (Webster's Collegiate Dictionary 2003)

Jezebel's last act was to haughtily adorn herself.

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Zephaniah 1:

8 And it shall come to pass in the day of the LORD's sacrifice, that I will punish the princes, and the king's children, and all such as are clothed with strange apparel.

God proclaims that he will punish "all such as are clothed with strange apparel".

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Matthew 6: Words of Jesus:

25 Therefore I say unto you, Take no thought for your life, what ye shall eat, or what ye shall drink; nor yet for your body, what ye shall put on. Is not the life more than meat, and the body than raiment?

28 And why take ye thought for raiment? Consider the lilies of the field, how they grow; they toil not, neither do they spin:

29 And yet I say unto you, That even Solomon in all his glory was not arrayed like one of these.

31 Therefore take no thought, saying, What shall we eat? or, What shall we drink? or, Wherewithal shall we be clothed?

32 (For after all these things do the Gentiles seek:) for your heavenly Father knoweth that ye have need of all these things.

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1Timothy 2:

9 In like manner also, that women adorn themselves in modest apparel, with shamefacedness and sobriety; not with broided hair, or gold, or pearls, or costly array;

10 But (which becometh women professing godliness) with good works.

1Peter 3:

3 Whose adorning let it not be that outward adorning of plaiting the hair, and of wearing of gold, or of putting on of apparel;

4 But let it be the hidden man of the heart, in that which is not corruptible, even the ornament of a meek and quiet spirit, which is in the sight of God of great price.

5 For after this manner in the old time the holy women also, who trusted in God, adorned themselves, being in subjection unto their own husbands:

Christians dress modestly and are arrayed only with inner, spiritual adornments.

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1Samuel 16:

7 But the LORD said unto Samuel, Look not on his countenance, or on the height of his stature; because I have refused him: for the LORD seeth not as man seeth; for man looketh on the outward appearance, but the LORD looketh on the heart.

God looks at the heart.

This does not mean that external manifestations are insignificant.

External manifestations typically reveal the internal state.

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Deuteronomy 22:

5 The woman shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man, neither shall a man put on a woman's garment: for all that do so are abomination unto the LORD thy God.

God requires a clear distinction between mens' and womens' clothing.

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Proverbs 1:

8 My son, hear the instruction of thy father, and forsake not the law of thy mother:

9 For they shall be an ornament of grace unto thy head, and chains about thy neck.

Proverbs 3:

21 My son, let not them depart from thine eyes: keep sound wisdom and discretion:

22 So shall they be life unto thy soul, and grace to thy neck.

Proverbs 25:

11 A word fitly spoken is like apples of gold in pictures of silver.

12 As an earring of gold, and an ornament of fine gold, so is a wise reprover upon an obedient ear.

Does the Bible condone/praise jewelry?

I really do not believe so, how does jewelry edify God? What does jewelry do for Christianity? What are the benefits of jewelry? Why do people adorn themselves? Keep up with the latestest style? To feel good? To look good? To be noticed? To keep up with the Jones? Seems to me jewelry is strictly a personal thing of attraction. Men as well as women follow these idealogies, do they not? Who in church wears the best, or most expensive, latest, suit or dress, fanciest hats, it is about attraction!

Look at Roman Churchs, alters of gold, gold crosses, chalices, miters, staves/staffs all decked in gold and jewels. Why? Attraction!

It is my opinion these verses use a literary analogy that compares items of great spiritual value with physical adornments, commonly considered of great worth and beauty, but infinitely inferior to Christ like character.

It is my opinion physical ornaments are associated with idolatry, pride, and apostasy.

Please do not be upset with me over my opinion.

Re: Isaiah 3 and jewelry...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scott Hutchinson (Post 818646)

What 1 Tim.2:9 and 1 Peter 3:3 are really saying is that a woman's true beauty does not come from external adornment but what really makes her beautiful is her gentle and quiet spirit.
These verse are not prohibitions agains't wearing of gold or fine clothes or elaborate hairstyles on women as such,but these verses are saying that is not where a person's true beauty lies.

I feel though alot of people go overboard on the jewelry deal,but aren't alot of clothes worn to a general conference costly array ?

What about the dos the sisters wear in their hair ?
What many of these dos be considered plaited or broided ?
I believe holiness will manifest itself in modesty,and women should look like women and men should look like men,but we must read these verses in proper context.

Also according to what I read in 1 Peter 3:3 a unbelieving husband could be won to God through a believing wife because of her purity and reverence by having a gentle spirit.

If a women has hair touching the ground,and a dress that hits the floor and she is bossified,is she adorned with a meek and gentle spirit ?

Doesn't matter. She's still holy!!

Seriously though, excellent post above. It's been stated so many times but the clearness of the passage still isn't seen by some.

Re: Isaiah 3 and jewelry...

I wear a wedding band and a watch and occasionaly a lapel pin or a simple pair of cuff links every once in a while and my wife wears a wedding band and a watch.

But what exactly does this mean ?
A word fitly spoken is like apples of gold in pictures of silver.
As an earring of gold,and an ornament of fine gold,so is a wise reprover upon an obedient ear. Proverbs 25:11,12

Re: Isaiah 3 and jewelry...

DerechHashem I can handle your view because you don't show a mean or harsh spirit,I appreciate you and your honesty.

Re: Isaiah 3 and jewelry...

I don't read my bible with an agenda nor do I promote or try to get people to wear jewelry of any kind,I feel if people are led by the Holy Ghost it will lead them into true Holiness of body and spirit.

Re: Isaiah 3 and jewelry...

Derech, thanks for the posts you have apparently worked hard on.

But let me ask a question or three.

Do you wear a watch or wedding band?

Do you wear neckties?

I don't believe Peter was saying that outward ornamentation should be shunned, but that we shouldn't be known by what we wear, whether it's jewelry, clothing, or how we fix our hair. It doesn't mean we shouldn't wear jewelry, clothing, or fix our hair, does it?

Nowhere in scripture is jewelry prohibited. In fact, God adorned His people several times with jewelry.

You mentioned a verse above in Revelation that speaks about a woman dressed in purple and scarlet wearing jewelry and holding a golden cup. Why do we focus on the jewelry but not her wearing purple and scarlet?

In Ezekiel 7, the people were stripped of even their clothing and made to put on sackcloth. Yet we don't preach that wearing clothing is a sin, right?

God punished people for their attitudes, not what they were wearing. However, He took their possessions, even their clothing and jewels, as part of their punishment. He didn't take them because they were being worn at all.

In the Bible, jewelry was a sign of beauty. Solomon wrote several times about it, in addition to other writers. God even states how He adorned His people with jewels. When God took that away, He took their beauty away. Their possessions made them vain, and their attitudes were haughty. THAT is the issue. I cannot find any scripture where anyone was punished merely because they were wearing jewelry. Even in the context of the scriptures you post above, it was attitudes that cost the people their possessions, not having them at all.

But I do like how you laid it out, even if I disagree. And some points I happen to agree with.

Re: Isaiah 3 and jewelry...

HO our new friend is studied,and I appreciate that,the posts from him or her seem to be in a good spirit and I admire that.

Re: Isaiah 3 and jewelry...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scott Hutchinson (Post 818677)

HO our new friend is studied,and I appreciate that,the posts from him or her seem to be in a good spirit and I admire that.

As do I. And I'm sure that this discussion will be one that both sides enjoy and can learn from, even if we disagree in the end. I like those kinds of discussions.

Re: Isaiah 3 and jewelry...

I hate the discussions where somebody says well you are backslidden or you are a just a hardnosed legalist,because sometimes we need to rexamine things in the word because we can overlook somethings at least I have often I come away with new insight while stopping to consider what a brother or sister has to share.

Re: Isaiah 3 and jewelry...

Quote:

Originally Posted by HeavenlyOne (Post 818672)

I have a pocket watch, and the only necklace is my medical alert necklace, that is the only jewelry I wear, I did have a wedding ring at my wedding but the wife and I have them in resin and they sit upon her desk.

At work when I am in the field I must wear a necktie, it is regulation if I wish to retain my Job (scope of employment) I am a federal Officer. At work I do not wear one, they wish I did, but it is not required, and the union protects that right.

In Revelation I focused on jewelry because this is the theme of the thread, at the end of my thread you will notice I did mention clothing. I did not want to sway away from the topic.

And thank you for your post, and the warm fuzzies, fuzzies are cool. :thumbsup