One of the Biggest Mistakes

[Truthseeker]

Originally Posted by ILG

I think one of the biggest mistakes that the UPC makes is the emphasis on church, church, church rather than family. People are expected to come bare minimum of 3 services a week, just so they are not "forsaking the assembling" and then there are the bible studies, door knocking, bake sales, singing, etc. etc. etc. on top of it all. I have heard it said that some pastors emphasize a family night one night a week (mine did not). So, are the other 6 to be used for church?? There is little teaching on marriage, family, balance etc. Alsmot all the teaching, in my experience, is on Acts 2:38, going to church, winning the lost, giving and giving and giving to the church.

I don't think it has ever been God's will for people to spend so much time at church and doing church things. We need to focus on our families, our kids, our marriages, our work etc. This is the work of God. That should not be forgotten.

True, I heard about a jew who spoke about christians focus on performing in a building while they focus on home life. This was said after he asked why jews have a 90 something % of children staying while a majority of churches lose the youth.

[Truthseeker]

Originally Posted by Antipas

How did the first church advance so quickly without "organizations"? In my opinion, I think organizations are a bit worldly. They cost way too much money, take far too much precious time, hinder individual pastors from following the Holy Ghost in local issues facing their local assembly, and seek to perpetuate their existance for the sake of those making a living through the organization. I think it would do the church good to get back to Bible basics. Today's "services" are more like concerts followed by a religious self help seminar. The church in the Bible met in homes, prayed and studied the Scriptures in small groups, and served their neighbors. They spread like wild fire. I think modern "church" is more like a "show". Add in how families suffer from being "over churched" and the situation is toxic. Just my personal opinion.

Walk on through there!

[Sept5SavedTeen]

We were just discussing this ILG, that is about 10-15 of us over at the pastor's house this Sunday afternoon. I come from the old (please no age jokes, yes I am only 19, but I've been around, trust me)-school and I am used to, from my Free Methodist days, Sunday morning, Tuesday and Thursday night service, and once a month a Saturday night prayer meeting from 8PM-midnight... Anyways, my first apostolic assembly (UPC) met only on Sunday morning and Wednesday night, and I CRAVED Sunday night church and another meeting in the week. Then I started going to an indep assembly, where they also have Sunday morning and Wednesday night, and I was talking to my pastor about why we don't have more services. He then mentioned how he wants to replace Wednesday night with home-group meetings throughout the week, and just have Sunday morning service.

The truth of the matter is this, only so much can get taught, and stick at one time. I can't keep 3 or 4 messages in my head from week to week, and there's a likely chance it will get repetative. The message or two I hear a week, I talk about with my brothers and sisters, I don't forget it. People still talk about the Ephesians study my pastor did in 2003 and the 1 Cor study in 2004-2005. We know our Bible better than some others I have come across, and we meet in homes, have "circle church" and a ton of other ways to have the church experience without spending long hours sitting in an uncomfortable chair, staring at the back of someone's head, and dozing off to sleep every few minutes until the preacher yells next.

I am not diminishing others experience, and different things work in different places, but "more church" is not the answer to everything, it can burn people out, make people "out churched" (the worst symptom of that is when the brethren stop talking about the Scriptures and they talk about John Deer tractors or hunting, then you know you have out-churched a people, because they feel like their "church time" has been paid in full by 3-4 services a week, and so they don't want to talk Scripture anymore).

Also, I would be interested to find out the divorce rate among UPC ministers due to them not spending enough time with their families, and if you're out teaching Bible studies during the week too, to the lost, you don't need a service every week to tell you to reach the lost- you're doing it... Again, different places, merit different things. If I lived within a mile of all my brothers and sisters in my assembly, maybe we'd meet for service every day, we'd just walk over and praise the LORD together, but we don't, and packing kids into a minivan, and bringing them to service everyday is an impossibility. The church should meet daily, but most of that is at a dinner table.

And lastly, the Scriptures tell us that the apostles met in a public-like gathering on "the first day of the week", not Wednesday, Friday and Saturday night.

But do what works, you're not saved or lost by how many times you meet for public gatherings!

-Bro. Alex

[TRFrance]

Um...Bro Alex,

Paragraphs are a wonderful thing.

Paragraphs are your friend.
Really.

[steve p]

To paragraph or not to paragraph.

THAT is the question!

[Hoovie]

Originally Posted by ILG

I think one of the biggest mistakes that the UPC makes is the emphasis on church, church, church rather than family. People are expected to come bare minimum of 3 services a week, just so they are not "forsaking the assembling" and then there are the bible studies, door knocking, bake sales, singing, etc. etc. etc. on top of it all. I have heard it said that some pastors emphasize a family night one night a week (mine did not). So, are the other 6 to be used for church?? There is little teaching on marriage, family, balance etc. Alsmot all the teaching, in my experience, is on Acts 2:38, going to church, winning the lost, giving and giving and giving to the church.

I don't think it has ever been God's will for people to spend so much time at church and doing church things. We need to focus on our families, our kids, our marriages, our work etc. This is the work of God. That should not be forgotten.

I started reading with the intent to defend the UPC against an attack from an ex-er...

However I feel very much the same way, so there is little to say aside from "AMEN!".

I would of course say "in general" since there are many who do not fit (if it doesn't fit you must acquit)

[rgcraig]

Originally Posted by TRFrance

Um...Bro Alex,

Paragraphs are a wonderful thing.

Paragraphs are your friend.
Really.

I fixed it!

[Sept5SavedTeen]

Paragraphs are UNAPOSTOLIC jk

Thanks for fixing it rgcraig, sometimes I just get to typing, and then mum was callig me for dinner, and you know how it gets...

Anyways, I have a question now, for Bro. Hoover, you're another brother who travels far for services. May I ask, do you drive the hour to and from services in the middle of the week or do you all just go on Sunday's?

-Bro. Alex

[Hoovie]

Originally Posted by Sept5SavedTeen

Paragraphs are UNAPOSTOLIC jk

Thanks for fixing it rgcraig, sometimes I just get to typing, and then mum was callig me for dinner, and you know how it gets...

Anyways, I have a question now, for Bro. Hoover, you're another brother who travels far for services. May I ask, do you drive the hour to and from services in the middle of the week or do you all just go on Sunday's?

-Bro. Alex

Mostly Sundays. It is the exception that we go to midweek services and events.

[ILG]

Originally Posted by TRFrance

Maybe its just me... but I'll never understand why people who are no longer UPC feel the need to go on internet forums and tell us the things they think are wrong with the UPC.

Some of us are dealing with a couple of decades of pain that we were repeatedly told didn't exist when we were in the church. You will have to please excuse us for that.