However, if an issue is truthful and solid, you cannot tear it down.
When I was in the automotive engineering industry, during the prototype phase of new vehicles, our engineers would do "pull" tests on all of the welds.
They had performed a weld study based on computer calculations, and thought they had sufficient amounts and placements of welds in a particular panel, but the ultimate test was the "pull" test.
In essence, they took a panel, and grabbed it with clamps, pliers, pneumatic chisels, etc and tried to tear it apart. If the panel came apart too easily, it was back to the drawing board, or computer.
But, if they pulled and pulled, applying the same amount of torque and stress that a car may experience during a crash, and the weld spots held true, they knew they had been successful.
Same should be with our idealogies and paradigms.......if they can't stand up to the "pull' test, we probably need to go back to the drawing board.
Very true.
In the end, if the only argument is "No one who <fill in the blank> will make it to heaven" or "No one who doesn't <fill in the blank> will make it to heaven" is all you have, all your doing is arguing from the standpoint of tradition and are too bull headed to change.
Very true.
In the end, if the only argument is "No one who <fill in the blank> will make it to heaven" or "No one who doesn't <fill in the blank> will make it to heaven" is all you have, all your doing is arguing from the standpoint of tradition and are too bull headed to change.
Know ye not that the bull headed shall inherit the Kingdom of Heaven? Epley 4:4
However, if an issue is truthful and solid, you cannot tear it down.
When I was in the automotive engineering industry, during the prototype phase of new vehicles, our engineers would do "pull" tests on all of the welds.
They had performed a weld study based on computer calculations, and thought they had sufficient amounts and placements of welds in a particular panel, but the ultimate test was the "pull" test.
In essence, they took a panel, and grabbed it with clamps, pliers, pneumatic chisels, etc and tried to tear it apart. If the panel came apart too easily, it was back to the drawing board, or computer.
But, if they pulled and pulled, applying the same amount of torque and stress that a car may experience during a crash, and the weld spots held true, they knew they had been successful.
Same should be with our idealogies and paradigms.......if they can't stand up to the "pull' test, we probably need to go back to the drawing board.
we have some fold using nuclear weapons on truth and calling it a pull test....
but I get what you are saying and agree. Bad teaching will make people leave good doctrine in a heartbeat.
bad doctrine will cause people to reject both good and bad at the same time. we have all seen that.
__________________ If I do something stupid blame the Lortab!
we have some fold using nuclear weapons on truth and calling it a pull test....
but I get what you are saying and agree. Bad teaching will make people leave good doctrine in a heartbeat.
bad doctrine will cause people to reject both good and bad at the same time. we have all seen that.
I think we all need to be careful how we teach things, as well.
It's one thing to teach that certain things are not good for a Christian to do, even if we don't have chapter and verse.
But, to preach those same things as issues of heaven or hell, when the scripture NOWHERE gives such gravity to the subject, is adding to the Word, in my humble opinion.
We should be like Paul, when he said, "All things are lawful, but not all things are expedient".
There are certain things that may not necessarily send me to hell, but they surely are not conducive to living an overcoming life!
No, we don't have to have chapter and verse to preach against things, just common sense is all that's needed in most cases.
However, we must certainly DO need chapter and verse if we're going to pronounce eternal damnation on someone's soul for engaging in that activity!
__________________ "Many people view their relationship with God like a "color by number" picture. It's easier to let someone else define the boundaries, tell them which blanks to fill in, and what color to use than it is for them to take a blank canvas and seek inspiration from the Source in order to paint their own masterpiece"
“9 Wherefore we labour, that, whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him. 10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.” (2 Corinthians 5:9-10)
As Christians, we will appear at the Judgment Seat of Christ to receive reward for our Christian service. Our sins are forgiven, the sentence of death has been lifted, and there is no condemnation in Christ, but there will be a day of reckoning and reward. We will receive a just reward on the basis of our works, whether good or bad.
What is the purpose of the judgment seat of Christ if every area of discipleship is a Heaven or Hell issue? On this forum I have read almost everything imaginable cited as a reason for hellfire and damnation (eg. Prayer, church attendance, soul winning, tithes and offerings, outward standards, . . .). Perfect obedience was only attained by Christ, and yet, on this forum, it seems to be the standard for admission to the everlasting kingdom.
Let’s take prayer for an example.
It would seem to be self evident that if a person never prays that they are not saved. Saved people pray, but what about the vast majority of Christians who fall short of praying the optimum number of hours per day, or who are inconsistent in their prayer lives? Will the person who fails to pray every day be lost? Will the person who falls short of the magic number of minutes per day (whatever that is) be lost? I would say, “no.” Their failure to attain perfect obedience will not cause them to lose their salvation, but will result in lost reward at the Judgment Seat of Christ.
The same could be said of very area of Christian discipleship. Some will produce thirtyfold, some sixtyfold, some one hundredfold, but all will give account for their service to the Master.
If I must live in fear of Hell over every detail of my Christian life, I will become frustrated and condemned, and join the throngs who have given up or who have no hope of Heaven because of the demands of legalistic religion. If I have confidence in my salvation in Jesus Christ, then I may serve without condemnation, but with great carefulness knowing that I must one day give account to God for how I have lived.
I know that frustration. I've grown out of it because I know the longsuffering and grace of God is real.
Thank you for your response.
__________________
His banner over me is LOVE.... My soul followeth hard after thee....Love one another with a pure heart fervently. Jesus saith unto her, Said I not unto thee, that, if thou wouldest believe, thou shouldest see the glory of God?
To be a servant of God, it will cost us our total commitment to God, and God alone. His burden must be our burden... Sis Alvear
Perhaps not, but on another thread, Bro. Epley said that there are no non-Apostolic Christians (not a direct quote), and I disagree. I think "Christian" befalls anyone who is making any effort to follow Christ and His teachings. Whether they have "arrived" or not, is another matter.
I think God sees them that way as well!
__________________
His banner over me is LOVE.... My soul followeth hard after thee....Love one another with a pure heart fervently. Jesus saith unto her, Said I not unto thee, that, if thou wouldest believe, thou shouldest see the glory of God?
To be a servant of God, it will cost us our total commitment to God, and God alone. His burden must be our burden... Sis Alvear
Yeah, sorry. The "collective" you.
My soul followeth hard after thee....Love one another with a pure heart fervently. 
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