Divine Flesh - Post Resurrection - Page 8

mfblume · #71 08-23-2007, 11:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Asternship

Shalom Shalom Heavenly Flesh definition is soley one created by the Apostolic oneness groups .To promote what they deem as real instead of what is actually real doctrine.Catholics and Protestants really dont use this phrase or word and definition to difine Dualism or fully man and fully God.Apostolics simply borrow dualism from the catholics and claim it being biblical as they do.

Asternship

Heavenly flesh doctrine is not Apostolic. The mainline Orthodox churches in Ethiopia preached this for many years. Research would better equip you to respond to this issue.

#72 08-24-2007, 05:39 PM

SHalom Shalom

I think you better research your sources much better .Dualism comes from the Greeks which states that Man is Both GOOD and EVIL Then catholics took it over to designate that yeshua was both fully man and fully God,GOOD and EVIL.

YOU deny your own belief that Jesus was both Fully Man and FULLY GOD.WOW it is your doctrine.That you believe Yeshua was of the Man of the earthly and of the man of the heavenly.WOW.

Asternship

#73 08-24-2007, 05:41 PM

Shalom Shalom

Dualism = Fully man and Fully God which is same as Heavenly Flesh doctrine.

Asternship

mfblume · #74 08-25-2007, 02:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Asternship

SHalom Shalom

I think you better research your sources much better .Dualism comes from the Greeks which states that Man is Both GOOD and EVIL Then catholics took it over to designate that yeshua was both fully man and fully God,GOOD and EVIL.

YOU deny your own belief that Jesus was both Fully Man and FULLY GOD.WOW it is your doctrine.That you believe Yeshua was of the Man of the earthly and of the man of the heavenly.WOW.

Asternship

You do not even call yourself Apostolic, on an apostolic forum. What gives?

Anyway, sir, eveyrone thinks the othe rperson did not research properly. So your words mean very little. You must show proof. Not words.

mfblume · #75 08-25-2007, 02:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Asternship

Shalom Shalom

Dualism = Fully man and Fully God which is same as Heavenly Flesh doctrine.

Asternship

Wrong. Heavenly flesh is apart from the teaching of Oneness. Are you Oneness?

ApostolicTexas · #76 08-26-2007, 12:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mfblume

You cannot see a body if it is not physical. What about my response to you that MEN DID SEE HIS GLORY when you questioned that and asked where did they ever see His glory?

As men physically saw it as I quoted to you, when you said it cannot be seen physically.

Of course He did... .just as over 500 saw it after His resurrection. And you never responded to my note how that Paul joined himself to the group of over 500 when Paul referred to his experience in Acts 9, indicating Paul saw the same thing the 500 did. Not something different. All this, includiong the fact that the bible does not say He lost his physical body, tells us He retained it.

Stephen saw his glory just as men saw the glory physically beforehand. And Stephen saw Jesus enough to recognize Him as Jesus, just as men did beforehand. This vision has all the elements of everything the 500, and others, saw. Add that to the fact that the bible says nothing about Him losing his physical body, and it all is the only sensible conclusion.

One has to add to the Bible in order to say the bible shows He does not still have that spiritual physical body.

My point was and has been and it can be proven..which you seem to have a hard time understanding IS

Acts 1:9-11..the apostles present here witnessed Jesus ascend into the cloud..THEY were the last one to EVER see THAT body..Noone has seen it since...I find it ironic noone has seen Jesus in THAT body again..When Jesus DID appear to Saul it was NOT in THAT body He left the earth in..We do not have the reason why Jesus appeared that way to Saul but we know He did.

I do not deny a physical ressurected Christ...I deny that He today has retained that body he left with simply because He no longer needs it..

Flesh and blood cannot inherit the KOG...
Paul said He no longer knew Christ After the flesh..
Paul describes God..1 Tim 1:17 as He is and as He always has been..I believe Jesus was on the earth as the same time as God He indwelt heaven
John vision is nothing compared to the Jesus he saw post ressurection in all his glory..God is a Spirit...why would he need that body he left in? It was a vehicle,a tool a mode for the invisible to be seen visible..It is no longer needed..The blood was offered..The sin problem has been solved..God is now God as He has always been..He is not limited..He fills heaven and earth..as bad as others want to believe Jesus still is inside the body he left in..I simply just find no proof..and no reason for it to be so..Paul description of the body of Christ is the New Testament church made up of many members today..We are HIS body..People can see Jesus in us...[at least they should be able]We are ambassadors..representives..for the One True Invisible God...Jesus

mfblume · #77 08-26-2007, 01:36 PM

Texas,

I already showed you that JESUS APPEARED IN ANOTHER FORM to the two on the road to Emmaus. Was it the same body as the one others recognized in his familiar form? You agree "yes", because you believe the body that left was the same one that existed from before His death to after his death until the ascension.

But you claim that something DIFFERENT was seen by Paul, despite the fact that Paul grouped himself with the folks WHO SAW HIS PHYSICAL BODY BEFORE THE ASCENSION in 1 Cor 15. That alone defeats your doctrine. And you claim Paul saw a DIFFERENT BODY by sheer virtue of what APPEARED to Paul, despite the fact you agree he appeared in OTHER FORMS in appearance while it was the same body, nevertheless, before the ascension.

Brother, it seems no matter what anyone says you WANT to believe in no physical resurrection for the church despite the fact that our bodies shall change just as Christ's did, which you admit was a PHYSICAL CHANGE in Christ's case.

Sorry, but I see confusion in your responses and neglect of blatant statements made in scriptures.

Take care.

ApostolicTexas · #78 08-26-2007, 08:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mfblume

Texas,

Quote:

I already showed you that JESUS APPEARED IN ANOTHER FORM to the two on the road to Emmaus. Was it the same body as the one others recognized in his familiar form? You agree "yes", because you believe the body that left was the same one that existed from before His death to after his death until the ascension.

and I agree he did..this was BEFORE his ascension..the last eyeballs to see the ressurected body of Jesus was the disciples in acts 1:19-11..Paul described what he saw and it does not say he saw the nail scarred body..He said He saw a LIGHT..it was so bright it blinded him...this appearance of Jesus is the first appearance mentioned in scripture AFTER the ascension..

Quote:

But you claim that something DIFFERENT was seen by Paul, despite the fact that Paul grouped himself with the folks WHO SAW HIS PHYSICAL BODY BEFORE THE ASCENSION in 1 Cor 15. That alone defeats your doctrine. And you claim Paul saw a DIFFERENT BODY by sheer virtue of what APPEARED to Paul, despite the fact you agree he appeared in OTHER FORMS in appearance while it was the same body, nevertheless, before the ascension.

I do not claim nothing...I simply showed scripture of what the Bible says brother..Paul may have grouped himself with those who saw Jesus but that in no way erases the fact of what Paul saw..Paul saw a LIGHT..He did not describe nail scars or a hole in his side lets stay within scripture..You accuse me of going outside of it?..

Quote:

Brother, it seems no matter what anyone says you WANT to believe in no physical resurrection for the church despite the fact that our bodies shall change just as Christ's did, which you admit was a PHYSICAL CHANGE in Christ's case

.

I am tired of defending my belief here..I DO NOT deny a physical ressurection..I have proof Jesus arose from the dead..I have the Holy Ghost

I believe Jesus arose from the grave IN A PHYSICAL BODY this is the GOSPEL...I simply do not believe Jesus still lives in THAT body he left this earth in..He exists as God filling heaven and earth..Why does he need the body anymore? The purpose of God manifesting himself in flesh has been accomplished..

Quote:

Sorry, but I see confusion in your responses and neglect of blatant statements made in scriptures.

Take care.

No...what you see is misunderstanding..you cannot understand How I believe Jesus lives in his CHURCH on this EARTH TODAY...not sitting upon some literal physical throne in heaven TODAY..The kingdom of God is within you...not in some future coming and setting up a literal physical kingdom reiging from Jerusalem..Jesus is God and as God He is invisible omnipresent filling heaven and earth...So please tell me..Why does Jesus still need that body he left with?

Take care yourself

ApostolicTexas · #79 08-26-2007, 09:15 PM

Where is Jesus Christ now?

Acts 8:3-As for Saul, he made havock of the church, entering into every house, and haling men and women committed them to prison.

Acts 22:8
8 And I answered, Who art thou, Lord? And he said unto me, I am Jesus of Nazareth, whom thou persecutest.
KJV

Jesus told Saul that He was the church that he was persecuting.

Michael The Disciple · #80 08-27-2007, 10:33 AM

This "no body" doctrine floors me. But most Apostolics embrace a "no body" doctrine for the Old Testament as well as the new. Unreal.

Yet behold the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ!

7: Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen. Rev. 1:7