What is the GOSPEL?

[shazeep]

so then, the devil lost his place, and was cast into the Lake, with death and hell

[shazeep]

and then there was silence in heaven
for the space
of about half an hour

[mfblume]

Wow, the more gospel we talk about, the more the hisses rise. This really shows how wickedness hates the work of the cross. Keep talking gospel, folks. It's doing something, or we wouldn't see this!

[Godsdrummer]

Originally Posted by mfblume

Then satan is saved.



I agree righteousness comes before baptism. But that does not mean baptism is not part of salvation. It 's a covenant issue. Signatures on the covenant are seals. Spirit seal and baptismal seal. God's and ours.

Mike
how many signatures do you need to sign before you are saved. Or how many covenants do you need to sign?

Where does it stop? How do I know if there are not more steps I must do or complete? What about holiness, is there a point ever that I can be sure of my salvation?

There was a teaching that the tabernacle in the wilderness was a tangible plan of salvation. Problem is/was that everything that is proposed as the plan of salvation was carried out by the high priest. The issue of sin was taken care of by the priest once a year till Christ finished the work by the cross then offering his blood in the heavenly H.O.H.

Now you say that although Christ fulfilled everything we must perform actions of our faith to receive salvation. OK Right.

As far as I see it, you are preaching a salvation of works. Call it anything you want. It is still works.

"As Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness"

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by Godsdrummer

Mike
how many signatures do you need to sign before you are saved.

Godsdrummer, what is a covenant?

Or how many covenants do you need to sign?

What is a covenant? It's a contract and testament. Right?

Where does it stop?

It stops where the Word says it stops. It begins where the Word says it begins.

How do I know if there are not more steps I must do or complete?

What did Peter command them the first day the Spirit was poured out? Simple.

What about holiness, is there a point ever that I can be sure of my salvation?

You are taking this into an area that has nothing to do with what I am saying. I am saying stick with the word, and don'[t add to it nor take away from it. Jesus said baptism saves. Peter said baptism saves. Paul said baptism washes sins. It's PART of salvation. And shazeep never acknowledges I say this, but without faith none of it does any good.

There was a teaching that the tabernacle in the wilderness was a tangible plan of salvation. Problem is/was that everything that is proposed as the plan of salvation was carried out by the high priest.

\

No problem there! The high priest is JESUS. And Jesus stood in OUR STEAD and acted as if we were doing it! His holiness was applied to us, and that makes it as good as what we did. So that's the difference. That principle is found in Heb 9.

The issue of sin was taken care of by the priest once a year till Christ finished the work by the cross then offering his blood in the heavenly H.O.H.

Now you say that although Christ fulfilled everything we must perform actions of our faith to receive salvation. OK Right.

We must apply that work of salvation to our lives, since it does not happen automatically. And everything done toi apply it to us are acts that prove we believe we cannot earn it , and prove God alone earned it for us through the work Jesus, our high priest, did.

As far as I see it, you are preaching a salvation of works. Call it anything you want. It is still works.

You say that because you have a totally different definition of works than what the bible deals with. We spoke of this before. You do not realize that works in the bible that are forbidden are things we do to earn salvation to prove OUR PERSONAL GOODNESS, and prove we have no need of the death of Jesus to take place. And if you take YOUR view of works all the way, then you have a salvation by works, too. How do I know? I already said this before and you never answered, but here it is again:

Joh 6:28-29....Then said they unto him, What shall we do, that we might work the works of God? ..(29)....Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.

Joh 6:28-29 Then they said to Him, "What should we do, that we may work the works of God?" (29) Jesus answered and said to them, "This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He sent."

It is a work to believe. Jesus said so himself! But that is not wrong, because that's not the kind of works the bible condemns. THINKING is a work, Godsdrummer. BELIEVING is a work. But it's part of what saves because it's not a work that earns salvation by proving our goodness and that we have no need of the cross.

The works themselves are not what save us in and of themselves. They are the works that prove we have real faith. But without that work then we don't have the real faith. that's why God would not have pronounced Abraham righteous if He foresaw Abraham would not be circumcised in obedience.

Now, you have not responded to many things I said in response to all your words directed to me. Unfair. But anyway, whatever. This time, I really want to see a response from you or anyone else about how Jesus said the WORK God requires is belief. Tell me why Jesus called that a work. And tell me how that does not betray your belief to be error when you say WORKS are WORKS and they cannot save, whether they are done to earn salvation and prove we're good enough without the cross, or not.

"As Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness"

And that BELIEF we have by looking to the cross with eyes of understanding IS A WORK according to Jesus. This proves WORKS that are condemned are only a certain KIND.

Really awaiting your response to what I wrote in red.

Blessings!

[Amanah]

A salvation that requires no action whatsoever from its recipient would of necessity be predestination, right?

[mfblume]

Originally Posted by Amanah

A salvation that requires no action whatsoever from its recipient would of necessity be predestination, right?

Good point.

[shazeep]

tag for tomorrow, what am i even doing here, lol, but go read Aquila's Marriage thing for your covenant ok. but don't read it right before bed

the Gospel is Word

[shazeep]

Originally Posted by Amanah

A salvation that requires no action whatsoever from its recipient would of necessity be predestination, right?

could you rephrase that?

Originally Posted by mfblume

Good point.

ya, i think so, too. but i might need to to interpret there, we'll see.

[shazeep]

Originally Posted by Godsdrummer

Mike
how many signatures do you need to sign before you are saved. Or how many covenants do you need to sign?

Where does it stop? How do I know if there are not more steps I must do or complete? What about holiness, is there a point ever that I can be sure of my salvation?

There was a teaching that the tabernacle in the wilderness was a tangible plan of salvation. Problem is/was that everything that is proposed as the plan of salvation was carried out by the high priest. The issue of sin was taken care of by the priest once a year till Christ finished the work by the cross then offering his blood in the heavenly H.O.H.

Now you say that although Christ fulfilled everything we must perform actions of our faith to receive salvation. OK Right.

As far as I see it, you are preaching a salvation of works. Call it anything you want. It is still works.

Man, and it's a lot of work. Why doesn't a little child have to do all this work? Why doesn't a little child need a priest, and doctrines, and snakes on a pole? You grew into an adult; but can you point to the day you started adulting? What, o what, is it that we have to learn how to do, that we so obviously once knew? All of this work, and no work can save you. There's nothing to do, but believe in the Word. And the letter kills, just like the Law. That's the Word, which manifested the Law--it's God breathed.
And no one after drinking old wine wants the new, for they say, 'The old is better.'

Which hopefully answers most of this, i think. So you might toggle back and forth

Now, you have not responded to many things I said in response to all your words directed to me. Unfair. But anyway, whatever. This time, I really want to see a response from you or anyone else about how Jesus said the WORK God requires is belief. Tell me why Jesus called that a work. And tell me how that does not betray your belief to be error when you say WORKS are WORKS and they cannot save, whether they are done to earn salvation and prove we're good enough without the cross, or not.