QUESTION: Did This UPC pastor Steal Money from the church?? you decide

[chaotic_resolve]

Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea

My answer to this situation is still GETTEST THOU A JOB AND PAY RESTITUTION FOR AS LONG AS IT TAKES ...

Why do that . . . if his pastor-friends and others are giving him money to bail him out?

I imagine he'll keep his license, HQ will wink, grin and look the other way and he'll be back pastoring in a few years somewhere else.

[Trouvere]

Originally Posted by Pragmatist

I don't think a pastor needs a 5 bedroom home unless he has at least 4 kids.

What makes them think they need a lavish lifestyle?

Hey I want a lavish lifestyle.I don't have it but don't kill my dream...lol.......Don't we all want to go to heaven? That seems lavish to me.


BTW what is wrong with a pastor having nice things? Is this the be poor until you die dirt farmer pastors club??????
BTW if any of you were caught up in this ,and don't worry if its true he is going to be serving jail time,
how would it effect you if everyone stoned you? God knows all things so you best not be failing in
any area.

["GL"]

Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea

My answer to this situation is still GETTEST THOU A JOB AND PAY RESTITUTION FOR AS LONG AS IT TAKES ...

Agreed.

And while you're doing it, go sit under a man of God to whom you are willing to be accountable.

[Pragmatist]

Originally Posted by Trouvere

Hey I want a lavish lifestyle.I don't have it but don't kill my dream...lol.......Don't we all want to go to heaven? That seems lavish to me.


BTW what is wrong with a pastor having nice things? Is this the be poor until you die dirt farmer pastors club??????
BTW if any of you were caught up in this ,and don't worry if its true he is going to be serving jail time,
how would it effect you if everyone stoned you? God knows all things so you best not be failing in
any area.

I don't want a lavish lifestyle. I do want to have a comfortable living, but not lavish. In MY opinion, if a pastor had the funds, he should provide a good life for his family, ensure a decent retirement, and if there's money left over, GIVE IT TO GOD.

["GL"]

MOW, has the church had counsel regarding handling this in a biblical manner?

It seems that it would be best to work out a system of repayment/restitution/public apology rather than taking it to a court of law.

What is your opinion on how this should be handled biblically, based on your knowledge of the situation?

The guilty parties will definitely be answering to God...

[ThePastorsCoach]

This is very sad. I heard he was losing his Hummer and Escalade and possibly his home. In the multitude of counselors - there is safety.

[chaotic_resolve]

Originally Posted by AtlantaBishop

This is very sad. I heard he was losing his Hummer and Escalade and possibly his home. In the multitude of counselors - there is safety.

You know, I'm not against pastors being taken care of by their saints . . . if the saints know and are aware of what their money is being spent on. However, when saints are left in the dark, and money is taken from designated offerings or the church needs the money for bills, etc - then the pastor needs to learn some discipline and stop living like a rock star.

[ManOfWord]

Originally Posted by Trouvere

Hey I want a lavish lifestyle.I don't have it but don't kill my dream...lol.......Don't we all want to go to heaven? That seems lavish to me.


BTW what is wrong with a pastor having nice things? Is this the be poor until you die dirt farmer pastors club??????
BTW if any of you were caught up in this ,and don't worry if its true he is going to be serving jail time,
how would it effect you if everyone stoned you? God knows all things so you best not be failing in
any area.

If you want a lavish lifestyle, then wisely invest your OWN money. The church I pastor is only 200 people but they take care of me well. However, my salary is below 60K. I started out 10 yrs ago here making 300/week and worked a full time job because the church couldn't afford to pay me. So basically, I worked to be able to afford to pastor.

I bought a brand new sports car last year. The reason I could afford it because I bought one just like it 2yrs old with 9K mi. on Ebay in 2002. I kept it in good shape and made $5k when I sold it. So I took my profit and and bought a 2005 model in 2006. I was able to negotiate a good price, and my payment on a brand new car is less than it was on my used car.

I have nice things. The only debt my wife and I have is our home and 2 cars. We pay our credit card balance off every month. The reason I have nice things is that unless something is a bargain, I don't buy it. I don't pay full price for hardly anything. I wear nice clothes and 100% silk ties. (when I wear them) I pay no more than $12 for my ties and rarely pay more than $120 for a suit. I love K & G Men's Mart!!! Most folks think I dress very well. I am also not ashamed to buy brand name, second hand clothing either.

I guess my whole point is that the pastor shouldn't put an undue financial burden on the people to support his life style. My wife works a part time job that gives my family full medical coverage so that saves money for the church. I have also been in top 10 givers in our church for years and one year was the top giver.

So, the question is, do pastors have to live a meager lifestyle and be dirt poor? Certainly not!!!

I have found out that God means what He says when He says, "good measure, pressed down and running over."

[Scott Hutchinson]

I'm not a pastor so I don't worry about a church paying me.
Seriously I thought churches boards and such to keep pastors honest in their money dealings when it comes to church monies.

[ManOfWord]

Originally Posted by "GL"

MOW, has the church had counsel regarding handling this in a biblical manner?

It seems that it would be best to work out a system of repayment/restitution/public apology rather than taking it to a court of law.

What is your opinion on how this should be handled biblically, based on your knowledge of the situation?

The guilty parties will definitely be answering to God...

The reason this has gone as far as it has, IMO, is that repayment/restitution/public apology was NEVER a part of the equation. The people were extremely upset and the pastor was protected from facing them.


My opinion of how something like should be handled is 2 words: FULL DISCLOSURE. Truth sets people free. Honesty and forthrightness is ALWAYS the best thing to do. I was taught by a wonderful mentor when I was a purchasing excutive that no matter what the cost, a person does the RIGHT thing. My pastor, this man's father, taught me that as well.