Trump or Biden will win?

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Esaias

Where does the Bible say a country gets "transformed into Mystery Babylon"?





So then wouldn't that mean Mystery Babylon is NOT a country but a spiritual system? So then Mystery Babylon is NOT "the USA" but something else, non physical, non tangible?





So if some preacher shows up doing signs and wonders and tells you to move out west with him to his farm in Kansas, you'll be at the front of the bus?



What would that look like? Will it be on Youtube? Or TBN? Or word of mouth?



So then you have no idea if we are any closer than the folks in AD 500 were?

Wow, this could of saved me from a whole lot of typing.

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

I am sitting here looking at the list. You know why I am not going to post it? Because you don’t really care and would prefer your cynical posts.

Please post the list.

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

Did you think the entrenchment could be drained in one term. He got rid of a lot of players in the Republican Party. Try the Lincoln Project. A lot are hanging out there.

Honestly, he made a lot of people believe just that. Don't you agree?

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

People who pray for their leaders also think that it is imperative to vote. That doesn’t mean they trust man over God. They just feel that being cynical solves nothing and doesn’t exude the faith the cynic believes he has.

Who is being cynical? Brother Esaias is far from cynical, but just being honestly real in that he sees a system morally corrupt, broken beyond repair. The verse which tells us to pray for our leaders didn't have voting. In the region of Judea during the time of Christ and then Paul. Your governors were appointed by Rome. They lived under occupation, and while you might be able to bring your grievances before a synagogue Beit Din, all other matters were pretty much out of your hands. Even during the time when the KJV was compiled. In England you didn't get to vote, and if you were poor, or a woman you had no say. Even in America the poor, minorities, the illiterate, and women couldn't vote. Prayer unto God had to be made by these huddled masses to receive peace from dictatorships. Brother Esaias and myself are just stating the obvious, the system is broken. We only get a choice between death by gunshot or death by starvation. Just a choice who will kill you quicker. The Democrats or the Republicans. Donald trump is just a devil who is wearing the dress you like. he was supposed to drain the swamp, but now we are told "was he supposed to do that in one term?" Ah YES! Because he isn't a king, and he only has four years if he isn't elected for a second term. So, YES, if you are going to bust some heads, get it going but skippy. Joe Biden, Kamala Harris, are super bad. But they are super bad for a reason. So instead of two choices Joe and Don, Joe leaves you with nothing. Don already been tweeting for four years, and well, let's just keep what we got. Then when the four years are over. Then what? Jared Kushner? Ivanka Trump? Mike Pence? Time proves all things, I just see things are so banged up, and nothing is really going to get better.

Jesus is our president, and He is our ONLY hope for a brighter day.

Convert the United States through the power of the Holy Ghost and then let's see what happens.

[Pressing-On]

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

Please post the list.

You are reminding me of a ladies meeting I attended. The speaker spoke about fear and had pages of scriptural notes that she had studied. She said that she thought about making copies and handing them out, but decided against it as it was our own personal responsibility to study it ourselves.

Honestly, he made a lot of people believe just that. Don't you agree?

Only someone who doesn’t understand how our government works would believe in could happen in 4 years. Think about how many years it takes a new pastor to turn a church around after a church split.

I am happy he got rid of Jeff Flake, et al.

Who is being cynical? Brother Esaias is far from cynical, but just being honestly real in that he sees a system morally corrupt, broken beyond repair. The verse which tells us to pray for our leaders didn't have voting. In the region of Judea during the time of Christ and then Paul. Your governors were appointed by Rome. They lived under occupation, and while you might be able to bring your grievances before a synagogue Beit Din, all other matters were pretty much out of your hands. Even during the time when the KJV was compiled. In England you didn't get to vote, and if you were poor, or a woman you had no say. Even in America the poor, minorities, the illiterate, and women couldn't vote. Prayer unto God had to be made by these huddled masses to receive peace from dictatorships. Brother Esaias and myself are just stating the obvious, the system is broken. We only get a choice between death by gunshot or death by starvation. Just a choice who will kill you quicker. The Democrats or the Republicans. Donald trump is just a devil who is wearing the dress you like. he was supposed to drain the swamp, but now we are told "was he supposed to do that in one term?" Ah YES! Because he isn't a king, and he only has four years if he isn't elected for a second term. So, YES, if you are going to bust some heads, get it going but skippy. Joe Biden, Kamala Harris, are super bad. But they are super bad for a reason. So instead of two choices Joe and Don, Joe leaves you with nothing. Don already been tweeting for four years, and well, let's just keep what we got. Then when the four years are over. Then what? Jared Kushner? Ivanka Trump? Mike Pence? Time proves all things, I just see things are so banged up, and nothing is really going to get better.

Jesus is our president, and He is our ONLY hope for a brighter day.

Convert the United States through the power of the Holy Ghost and then let's see what happens.

And yet, Paul appealed to Rome, knowing he had a God and a government.

I don’t understand why you two guys believe that anyone voting or supporting their candidate thinks that the person is above God. And I don’t understand how you two guys believe that people supporting their candidate have somehow put the Gospel message in a box in the meanwhile. That makes no logical sense.

Brother Bernard, my pastor and others encourage us to vote, do you believe they don’t believe and preach the gospel? Do you believe they suspend disciplining people because they vote?

[shag]

1 Tim. 1-2
I urge, then, first of all, that petitions, prayers, intercession and thanksgiving be made for all people— 2 for kings and all those in authority, that we may live peaceful and quiet lives in all godliness and holiness. 3 This is good, and pleases God our Savior, 4 who wants all people to be saved and to come to a knowledge of the truth.



I need to do much better at this.

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

You are reminding me of a ladies meeting I attended. The speaker spoke about fear and had pages of scriptural notes that she had studied. She said that she thought about making copies and handing them out, but decided against it as it was our own personal responsibility to study it ourselves.

What a lazy excuse. Where did you get that from teacher? Go look it up yourself! Thanks.

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

Only someone who doesn’t understand how our government works would believe in could happen in 4 years. Think about how many years it takes a new pastor to turn a church around after a church split.

I am happy he got rid of Jeff Flake, et al.

But we weren't told that. We were told that he was going to go around taking names, and busting heads. He would drain the swamp. We weren't told it would never happen the first four years, and if he was fortunate enough to get another four he could finish job. So tell me PO, if he doesn't get it done in the next four years and we get another Swamp Monster in 2025, what will be your excuse then? Also the analogy of a new pastor turning things around could be longer than 8 years. Do you know how a BROKEN GOVERNMENT WORKS!!!! Do you understand the meaning of Drain the Swamp? Do you know that the Donald wasn't the first to use that term? Have you ever visited D.C.? Niccolo Machiavelli would not be proud of you.

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

And yet, Paul appealed to Rome, knowing he had a God and a government.

Did Paul vote Nero into office of the Emperor? Where is the post where Esaias or myself ever said there should be no system of laws? Paul was a free BORN Roman citizen. Here, I'll do what your lazy teacher did, go look up Roman FREEBORN citizen rights, and get back to me.

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

I don’t understand why you two guys believe that anyone voting or supporting their candidate thinks that the person is above God.

Where did either of us make the above comment?

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

And I don’t understand how you two guys believe that people supporting their candidate have somehow put the Gospel message in a box in the meanwhile.

Where did either of us say that?

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

That makes no logical sense.

Well, that's where in a forum discussion we then ask for clarification of our statements.

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

Brother Bernard,

I guess General Supe doesn't have term limits? How long has Brother David Bernard been General Superintendent? Since 2009? I don't know him, I know of him, I don't know him. Whether or not he encourages or discourages people to vote, tells you how to vote, or tells you not how to vote, means nothing to our conversation. Does Brother Bernard tell the 3 million people in the UPCI how to vote?


[QUOTE=Pressing-On;1595121]
my pastor [/qute]

Emphasis on your pastor. I don't know your pastor, I don't know what he believes outside of assuming he believes what the United Pentecostal Church International believes. But while he encourages you to vote, he doesn't tell you who to vote for or how to vote? The pulpit isn't really a place to campaign for a seat in government. We preach the Word to salvation, not what government official is going to make the world a brighter place. You might be in the world, but you are not of the world.

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

and others encourage us to vote, do you believe they don’t believe and preach the gospel? Do you believe they suspend disciplining people because they vote?

I'm sorry sis, but I don't know where you are going with the above thoughts.
Maybe you could clarify?

[Esaias]

My doubts about the efficacy of modern voting are based entirely on three things:

1. The actual system in place is provably fake and ineffective due to secret unverifiable balloting and the use of black box voting machines and the control exercised by political hacks over counting and announcing the results.

2. The usefulness of a general population steeped in sin and rebellion to be able to elect decent government or even produce decent candidates.

3. The hand of God upon a nation that collectively thumbs its nose at Him repeatedly.

All three conditions incline me to believe "voting" by the general public is an exercise in futility. Not to mention it doesn't select the POTUS anyway, legally (Electoral College, anyone?).

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

Only someone who doesn’t understand how our government works would believe in could happen in 4 years. Think about how many years it takes a new pastor to turn a church around after a church split.

How long does it take a new boss to fire old management and bring his own team in? Only someone who doesn't understand how organizations and leadership work would believe it couldn't happen in 4 years.

Speaking of which, why are all Trump's team appointments basically swamp creatures?

I don’t understand why you two guys believe that anyone voting or supporting their candidate thinks that the person is above God.

Who said that?

And I don’t understand how you two guys believe that people supporting their candidate have somehow put the Gospel message in a box in the meanwhile. That makes no logical sense.

If a person's efforts to save America and right the ship are focused on voting for a corrupt political machine and a corrupt candidate rather than on promoting national repentance, then they have boxed the Gospel and put it in the closet like xmas ornaments, only to be taken out at special religious occasions like Sunday and funerals. Muh "separation of church and state" like the Baptist Masons like it.

Brother Bernard, my pastor and others encourage us to vote, do you believe they don’t believe and preach the gospel?

If they don't preach that Jesus Christ is our Lawgiver, Judge, and King, and that all persons including civil servants must live in accordance with every word that proceeds out of the mouth of God, and that all persons including civil servants must obey the Holy Bible in all areas of life (including in the exercise of their public office), then they are not preaching the Gospel, likely due to not believing it or even knowing what it is.

Do you believe they suspend disciplining people because they vote?

No idea what you are asking here.

[Pressing-On]

I will stick with this more balanced and reasonable view of the church and politics.

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

I will stick with this more balanced and reasonable view of the church and politics.

So you DON'T believe that man is to live by every word of God?

You DON'T believe that Jesus Christ has ALL authority in heaven AND EARTH?

You DON'T believe "the Lord is our Lawgiver, Judge, and King"?

And neither does Bernard?

Is that what you are trying to say?

[Esaias]

I have said it for years: the number one opponents of nationwide revival are people who identify as Christians. The people who are most adamant that God should stay out of public life are the people who call themselves believers in Jesus.

Sad.

No wonder God said "If my people which are called by my name REPENT and HUMBLE THEMSELVES..."

It's the average run of the mill professing Christian who needs to repent more than the atheist, satanist, talmudist, muslim, liberal, communist, or whatever other "-ist" people want to blame their problems on.