|
|
04-09-2018, 08:56 PM
|
|
Unvaxxed Pureblood too
|
|
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 40,294
|
|
Re: Should we teach others to rebel against standa
Quote:
Originally Posted by CC1
I think Jesus would be shocked at some of the things preached against today. The bible has been twisted and stretched so much you would think it is a rubber band!
|
CC1, you speak like you are talking about a historical figure? Someone no longer available for comment. But, it is always amusing how people claim others to be twisting and stretching scripture like a rubber band. When they sit in a church believing they are the chosen, but are the farthest thing from Bible truth. They hold not outward standards but the more important inward attire is totally lacking. So, they fabricate the perpetual sinner doctrine to even make up for that. Jesus working on the inside, showing on the outside, oh what a change in my life. Beards, no beards, who cares what is on your face. Because whether clean shaven, or whiskers to the floor, the smile which is supposedly pious is fake. Standards, no standards, still it is the inside that is rotten to the core. that is what is always hidden, that is what cannot be seen. Ditch the standards, David M. Wasmundtism of going Biblical, when the outer dress is discarded the inner man is still retarded, sick, and sadly full of mess.
This train is bound for destruction.
__________________
"all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed."
~Declaration of Independence
|
04-10-2018, 03:22 AM
|
|
Administrator
|
|
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: WI
Posts: 5,479
|
|
Re: Should we teach others to rebel against standa
Quote:
Originally Posted by BuckeyeBukaroo
If we are going to talk about lust in the sexual sin sense, then BY ALL MEANS YES WE NEED TO TAKE PRECAUTIONS to guard against lust and all other sexual sins.
Modesty is beautiful but it also serves as a deterrent against sin. There are practical lifestyle changes that believers can make that will help them in their walk. Avoiding low-cut blouses that expose the breast, tight fitting shirts, skirts and jeans that highlight body parts-- these are good, common sense "standards" to uphold. Some guys even feel the need to avoid sweatpants-- I won't dissuade him.
|
Lust is controlled by the grace given to us by God through the Holy Spirit when we crucify it with the flesh. If you keep waiting on people around you to dress modestly enough to keep evil imaginations at bay, instead of trusting in the power of the Anointed One to deliver you, you will never stop lusting.
The truth is, some women, hopefully without realizing it, can, in their attempts at modesty, give off an even stronger sense of their sexuality, and not even realize it. And if you asked a lot of different Pentecostal ladies how sexy an anointed man of God in a nice suit is to them, and if they were honest, you'd be surprised.
When my wife was at ABI, there was talk of one of the female students needing a shower, and a man there present admonished the ladies to not talk about such things in front of men, because it might trigger lust in them.
Bro, if you can help getting lost in lust when a woman mentions needing a shower, the problem isn't the shower or the mention of it, it's your flesh.
My wife even told me about a discussion had one time there about how when a woman's knees are bent, they can look like breasts to a man, and that was the justification of skirt and dress length and how a woman needed to make sure she was sitting in a certain way so a man wouldn't mistake her KNEES for her breasts, and have to go run off to the prayer room to take a cold Holy Ghost shower.
The fact is, standards are most strongly preached and adhered to at Apostolic Bible colleges, and the lust is so thick you can cut it with a knife. That's why for most of them, if the word "Bible" is in the name, it jokingly gets replaced with "Bridal" because most students meet their spouses there, and it's not chapel and missions and Bible-learning that interests many of them, it's the cute and modestly dressed member of the opposite sex sitting in the first pew, worshipping God, that's got their attention (Hey, it's normal. Better to marry than to burn, but let's not act like a whole lot of burning doesn't take place in Pentecost).
This doesn't mean a relaxing of the standard is in order or even something I would personally advocate--they can do what they want without my input just fine--but at least let's be honest enough to say that standards don't control lust, fornication, promiscuity, use of pornography and abuse of one's self with the same, and the like. Because they don't.
The issue is the heart. Fix the heart, indeed transform it, under the grace of the Master's hand, and no matter how a person is dressed or what standards they do or don't keep, the power of the Lord at work on you will keep you from sin.
Last edited by votivesoul; 04-10-2018 at 03:28 AM.
|
04-10-2018, 07:59 AM
|
Banned
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 31,124
|
|
Re: Should we teach others to rebel against standa
Quote:
Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa
Bro, a Bible revival?
If Jesus preached, David played his harp and the Apostle Paul took up the offering, you still wouldn't listen. You guys who pound the table with your so called Bible purity are what makes Atheists smile. If it wasn't so sad it would be funny.
|
Until we can get back to the Bible, we'll never know will we?
What I do know is this... I've been out of the institutional churches of Apostolic Christianity since 2008. I've spent that time worshipping alone in exile, worshipping with brethren in various churches on occasion, worshipping with brethren who felt disenfranchised, and even worshipping with non-Apostolics... and I'm still Apostolic. I firmly believe in Oneness and Acts 2:38 salvation. That's ten years. The only things that have fallen to the wayside in my life are the specific standards that are not taught in Scripture. In a very real sense, throughout these ten years, all I've had to lean on are the words of Jesus, the Psalms of David, and the teachings of Paul. I pray three times a day, speak in tongues every day, and I still believe in and experience the gifts regularly.
And though I've been out of the institutional Apostolic churches for 10 years... I have good friends and family in them. I've watched. I've watched as people have fallen away, become disenchanted, etc... and I normally don't see them keep the faith for 6 months after they disappear from the pews.
And, lastly, the only thing that makes atheists smile is when people who say they believe the Bible feel the need to not obey it or add to it. Because the atheist reasons that if it were indeed the Word of God, we'd obey it and not have the need to add to it.
|
04-10-2018, 08:01 AM
|
Banned
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 31,124
|
|
Re: Should we teach others to rebel against standa
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple
Dom,
I think I have hi fived YOU at least once
But, I bet if Aquila could get past preterism and immortal soul he and I could work together quite well.
|
It's all a divide and conquer tactic, because they still can't provide any B-I-B-L-E for their traditions and doctrines of men.
|
04-10-2018, 08:14 AM
|
Banned
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 31,124
|
|
Re: Should we teach others to rebel against standa
I believe it is important to note that Michael and I do not attend church together, nor are we starting a church together. The details of such are worthy of far deeper consideration than a passing remark.
However, we are united in that there is NO SCRIPTURE for a beard prohibition. On this we are firmly in the right, and we are united on the premise.
Now, I'd like to see someone either show me where Scripture prohibits a man from having a beard, or... see you guys admit that it is entirely a tradition of man.
|
04-10-2018, 08:40 AM
|
Banned
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 31,124
|
|
Re: Should we teach others to rebel against standa
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1ofthechosen
If standards are a boundary a fence, then if you remove someone's fence what are you doing? That's their landmark is it not? Of course everyone knows what the passage meant, but he was only using a illustration of that principal. He talked about a lot more, but we have only dealt with a 15 second remark he made about facial hair. Was the whole sermon about that no. And it's Deuteronomy 27:17 btw. He just made some statements in there about standards and I thought it was fitting for this forum, so I titled it that way. That is the name of the sermon though, "Thy Neighbor's Landmark".
|
What defines a "landmark" in this "spiritualized" notion of landmarks?
Shouldn't a "landmark" be built on the foundation of Scripture???
|
04-10-2018, 08:47 AM
|
Banned
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 31,124
|
|
Re: Should we teach others to rebel against standa
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1ofthechosen
This is a total misrepresentation, along with half you said. I never said that. You have been arguing about the beards this whole time. Saying someone thinks your demonic because of it and all this other stuff. No one ever said that, you did. Standards do not save you or make you lost, but they are a fence and a safety net. You are going overboard over nothing, is all I can say. So I'll say it one more time, find you a church where it is not preached and go there. But don't go somewhere where it is preached and try to change it, that makes no sense.
|
Then why are we eventually treated the way we are when we voice that we're not planning on shaving?
Maybe you're church is as you describe. Maybe I'd be welcome to participate at every level in your church. But this isn't the case in the majority of Apostolic Pentecostal churches, and from my experience, definitely not the case in the UPCI.
Frankly, there's more references that can be misunderstood as describing a Trinity than there are for a single prohibition on beards. lol
The point is... be it Trinity doctrine or be it a prohibition on beards... both are just traditions of man.
You know it. I know it. Everyone knows it.
We need a Bible Revival.
|
04-10-2018, 09:14 AM
|
Banned
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 31,124
|
|
Re: Should we teach others to rebel against standa
What if we believed in Hell? I mean, really believed in Hell?
Imagine a tradition of man that isn't even rooted in the Holy Scriptures that causes many to fall away, causes many not to even attend, and has become a representation of what the church stands for... causing apologists from other denominations to point out to the world our unbiblical position and lead possibly millions astray.
And let's imagine that a generation of men are taking a stand and explaining that this is both unbiblical and unnecessary, yet they are laughed at, mocked, and it is insinuated that they are just rebellious, vain, and prideful.
Who will be responsible for those lost souls?
We see a warning in James,
James 3:1 English Standard Version (ESV)
3 Not many of you should become teachers, my brothers, for you know that we who teach will be judged with greater strictness. If you teach such a tradition of man, and it serves only to alienate souls, and puff up sectarian pride, according to James, you'll be judged far more harshly. In fact, I believe you will answer for every soul lost on account of any and all unnecessary, unbiblical, and outright fabricated traditions of standards of men.
People's eternity is at stake. And I firmly believe that if any of the institutional organizations really believed in Hell, they'd tear down every tradition of man and unbiblical standard that serves to alienate the lost from the Gospel.
The Bible is complete and perfectly suitable to teach us all that we need to know to be saved and stay saved. Standards built on "biblical principles" are warranted. It's standards like the prohibition on beards that has absolutely no biblical merit that are the issue. Souls are lost over it.
Who will pay for such great loss? What is the only just penalty for those who have prevented so many souls from entering in???
Matthew 23:13 English Standard Version (ESV)
13 “But woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you shut the kingdom of heaven in people's faces. For you neither enter yourselves nor allow those who would enter to go in.
|
04-10-2018, 09:50 AM
|
|
Registered Member
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2018
Posts: 2,639
|
|
Re: Should we teach others to rebel against standa
Quote:
Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa
Sister Alvear? Where did the Apostle Paul admonish anyone to grow a beard? What about his Roman Judeans of the Diaspora brethren or Roman brethren, who may or may not had beards? Also does your husband have a beard? Does your son have a beard? Any of the Alvears pro beard?
|
Ok go to 39:30 to 43:00 at (40:25, 70:58 also) and listen to what he says. We are not the only ones saying these things. This is a great message btw. He's speaking the truth.
Last edited by 1ofthechosen; 04-10-2018 at 10:21 AM.
|
04-10-2018, 10:15 AM
|
|
Sister Alvear
|
|
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Brazil, SA
Posts: 27,037
|
|
Re: Should we teach others to rebel against standa
I have not listened to Jonathan preach this message...but he differs from many of the Ultra cons....so it stands to reason no one sees everything alike...
__________________
Monies to help us may be sent to P.O. Box 797, Jonesville, La 71343.
If it is for one of our direct needs please mark it on the check.
Facebook Janice LaVaun Taylor Alvear
|
Posting Rules
|
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is Off
|
|
|
| |
|