Is the grass truly greener....on the other side?!?

[Brad Murphy]

It's not that the grass is greener on the other side of the fence... it is more that the pasture didn't exist in the first place.

[onefaith2]

Originally Posted by rgcraig

I realize we need each other for prayer and support, but if you have the POWER in you, you ARE the church. Your relationship with Jesus should be strong enough to help you make it.

I'm not sure the Bible supports your theory. Where does it say without the body, we are cut off? How can we be cut off if HIS spirit is in us?

According to Corinthians we are likened to a body.. one is the hand, the other is a the foot.. can we say to the hand we don't need the foot? No all are in the body for the purpose of edification. We are not are only edifiers. Each one of us isn't a prophet, evangelist, pastor, or teacher all in one. God put these gifts throughout the body for his purpose. The whole set up of the church is community, not isolation.

I mean the church in Rome lived the catacombs together when they were persecuted. We never find an isolated believer in the NT.

[onefaith2]

Originally Posted by Brad Murphy

It's not that the grass is greener on the other side of the fence... it is more that the pasture didn't exist in the first place.

sad that anyone would go to a church where there is no pasture or better yet no Saviour!

[Sister Alvear]

Let me see if I can express this without sounding rude ...
Years ago there were not many educated people in Pentecost. As people learned to read and research for themselves many things changed.
I remember growing up and at campmeetings people preached against wearing red, ladies had to use hose with seams (seamless hose was a BAD sign, doctors were a no-no...leaning on the arm of flesh. Amost everything was a sin...Adultry or an Asprin was about on the same level...babies were born at home...

As time passed you could not even buy hose with seams...lol...
I went to Brazil as a missionary and marrried...
when I was expecting Raul Jr people encouraged me to have him at home and trust God...However there came a time I had to decide , go to the doctor or die...he could not be born normal...I spent many hours in prayer until I felt the Lord wanted me to live and not die...I went...some back them made statements I failed the Lord...but years have passed as many that said things have since went to doctors...

Time teaches us a lot of things...balance and wisdom is one of them...

As I have often expressed, church is not a free for all but we must have guidlines within the OLD BLACK BOOK...

Sin will always be sin...The acts of the sinful nature are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.’ (Galatians 5:19-21)


The book of Proverbs mentions several deadly sins...


A proud look.
A lying tongue.
Hands that shed innocent blood.
A heart that devises wicked plots.
Feet that are swift to run into mischief.
A deceitful witness that uttereth lies.
Him that soweth discord among brethren


someone said the Bible mentions 667 things that are a sin...I am not for sure if that number is correct however many things are black and white in the Bible...other things might now be a sin but could become a sin...one writer spoke about weights...since we are in a race we sure don´t want weights!


Proverbs 14:34 Righteousness exalteth a nation: but sin is a reproach to any people.


May the Lord give us wisdom to know what sin really is...and what foolishness is...some so called doctrines are foolish. (in due respect)

I think it is fine to have convictions...we all should have our personal convictions...however for me to make others live my personal convictions is not a Biblical principle.

As a leader great power and authority is invested in me by God. One day I will stand before HIM and He will not only know about the ones I have helped to save HE also knows about the ones I run off because of ignorance!

In the study of Jewish legal terminology in Matthew 18:18
“I tell you the truth, whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven.

we learn that:

The expressions “bind” and “loose” were common to Jewish legal phraseology meaning to declare something forbidden or to declare it allowed.

The law was so complex...even with 615 commandents...some seemed in a grey area so the priests could establish bounds...

The Exegetical Dictionary of the New Testament adds: “‘Bind’ and ‘loose’ are technical terms in Judaism…with respect to teaching, the phrase is used for authoritative exposition of the law by an authorized, ordained rabbi, who has authority ‘to forbid and to permit.

HOWEVER they were writing what we nw call the Bible...there are now no new revelations...Gal. makes that plain...We cannot add or take from the book...

His word is forever established...I AM NOT SAYING THROW DOCTRINE OUT THE WINDOW...FOR DOCTRINE IS IMPORTANT....just make sure it is sound doctrine.


The Bible is our rule of faith and practice. But the Bible, like the Torah [Genesis through Deuteronomy], does not cover every situation that comes up in Christian life and leadership.

We face many different problems today than the first church...so that means we must pray and seek God to have the right answers. Jesus teachings are very important...He taught us to love...to care...

We need to be sure to follow God’s leadings in what we forbide or permit.

Jesus’ instruction to his disciples made perfect sense in the culture of his day, and still makes perfect sense today. We are always to look for God’s guidance before we make rules that forbid or permit people’s actions.


It is ok to tell people...the Bible is not clear or I do not understand...however I think...I feel...make sure your people understand what the Bible is clear about...Don´t try to make your people feel you have God´s latest revelation and some new light has shinned on your path...

Want to say more but time to leave for ladies meeting...maybe more later....as the writer of long ago said, follow peace with all men and holiness without no man shall see the Lord.

[Brad Murphy]

Originally Posted by onefaith2

sad that anyone would go to a church where there is no pasture or better yet no Saviour!

I just find it sad that people feel they have to live their life in a pasture rather than experiencing all that life has to offer. There is more to life than sitting on a pew, shaking out hairpins in the aisle, eating out, worrying whether someone else is watching television, and making peanut brittle.

[rgcraig]

Originally Posted by onefaith2

According to Corinthians we are likened to a body.. one is the hand, the other is a the foot.. can we say to the hand we don't need the foot? No all are in the body for the purpose of edification. We are not are only edifiers. Each one of us isn't a prophet, evangelist, pastor, or teacher all in one. God put these gifts throughout the body for his purpose. The whole set up of the church is community, not isolation.

I mean the church in Rome lived the catacombs together when they were persecuted. We never find an isolated believer in the NT.

Might want to read that a little more.

15 Now if the foot should say, “Because I am not a hand, I do not belong to the body,” it would not for that reason stop being part of the body.

No matter WHAT part of the body we are - - we ARE NOT cut off or cease to stop being part of the body!

Don't think that has anything to do with not going to church and if you don't you are cut off.

[ILG]

Good post Sis. A.

Originally Posted by Sister Alvear

Let me see if I can express this without sounding rude ...
Years ago there were not many educated people in Pentecost. As people learned to read and research for themselves many things changed.
I remember growing up and at campmeetings people preached against wearing red, ladies had to use hose with seams (seamless hose was a BAD sign, doctors were a no-no...leaning on the arm of flesh. Amost everything was a sin...Adultry or an Asprin was about on the same level...babies were born at home...

As time passed you could not even buy hose with seams...lol...
I went to Brazil as a missionary and marrried...
when I was expecting Raul Jr people encouraged me to have him at home and trust God...However there came a time I had to decide , go to the doctor or die...he could not be born normal...I spent many hours in prayer until I felt the Lord wanted me to live and not die...I went...some back them made statements I failed the Lord...but years have passed as many that said things have since went to doctors...

Time teaches us a lot of things...balance and wisdom is one of them...

As I have often expressed, church is not a free for all but we must have guidlines within the OLD BLACK BOOK...

Sin will always be sin...The acts of the sinful nature are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.’ (Galatians 5:19-21)


The book of Proverbs mentions several deadly sins...


A proud look.
A lying tongue.
Hands that shed innocent blood.
A heart that devises wicked plots.
Feet that are swift to run into mischief.
A deceitful witness that uttereth lies.
Him that soweth discord among brethren


someone said the Bible mentions 667 things that are a sin...I am not for sure if that number is correct however many things are black and white in the Bible...other things might now be a sin but could become a sin...one writer spoke about weights...since we are in a race we sure don´t want weights!


Proverbs 14:34 Righteousness exalteth a nation: but sin is a reproach to any people.


May the Lord give us wisdom to know what sin really is...and what foolishness is...some so called doctrines are foolish. (in due respect)

I think it is fine to have convictions...we all should have our personal convictions...however for me to make others live my personal convictions is not a Biblical principle.

As a leader great power and authority is invested in me by God. One day I will stand before HIM and He will not only know about the ones I have helped to save HE also knows about the ones I run off because of ignorance!

In the study of Jewish legal terminology in Matthew 18:18
“I tell you the truth, whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven.

we learn that:

The expressions “bind” and “loose” were common to Jewish legal phraseology meaning to declare something forbidden or to declare it allowed.

The law was so complex...even with 615 commandents...some seemed in a grey area so the priests could establish bounds...

The Exegetical Dictionary of the New Testament adds: “‘Bind’ and ‘loose’ are technical terms in Judaism…with respect to teaching, the phrase is used for authoritative exposition of the law by an authorized, ordained rabbi, who has authority ‘to forbid and to permit.

HOWEVER they were writing what we nw call the Bible...there are now no new revelations...Gal. makes that plain...We cannot add or take from the book...

His word is forever established...I AM NOT SAYING THROW DOCTRINE OUT THE WINDOW...FOR DOCTRINE IS IMPORTANT....just make sure it is sound doctrine.


The Bible is our rule of faith and practice. But the Bible, like the Torah [Genesis through Deuteronomy], does not cover every situation that comes up in Christian life and leadership.

We face many different problems today than the first church...so that means we must pray and seek God to have the right answers. Jesus teachings are very important...He taught us to love...to care...

We need to be sure to follow God’s leadings in what we forbide or permit.

Jesus’ instruction to his disciples made perfect sense in the culture of his day, and still makes perfect sense today. We are always to look for God’s guidance before we make rules that forbid or permit people’s actions.


It is ok to tell people...the Bible is not clear or I do not understand...however I think...I feel...make sure your people understand what the Bible is clear about...Don´t try to make your people feel you have God´s latest revelation and some new light has shinned on your path...

Want to say more but time to leave for ladies meeting...maybe more later....as the writer of long ago said, follow peace with all men and holiness without no man shall see the Lord.

[Digging4Truth]

The grass is always greener when you are walking in your own convictions and not held by fences you don't believe in.

[Sam]

Originally Posted by ILG

I can only speak for myself. My husband and I pastored for 10 years. For most of those years, I was a true believer. I was completely sold out and gave everything I had and then some. I didn't see any holes in the doctrine. In time, I began to see holes in the doctrines. The fact that people treated us like ........ the whole time we were in the UPC left no hard decisions. If the doctrine is incorrect, there is no need to put up with the ......... The grass is definitely greener. We don't attend church anywhere. I am much happier. I am not saying this route is for everyone, but at this stage in my life, it is the best thing I ever did. I may never return to anything. I do miss community, but since there never was a whole lot of that anyway, I probably more miss the idea or dream of what I wanted church to be more than what it really was.

I was not raised "in Pentecost." I was not raised in a church that accepted the inspiration of the Bible or the idea that there is a heaven or hell.

At the age of 17 I had an experience with the Lord. I asked Jesus Christ to come into my heart and He did. He accepted my invitation and I became a new creation. Soon afterward I joined a local Baptist Church where there was a lot of emphasis put on the Word. In time I discovered that there were some things in the Word that we weren't experiencing in that Baptist Church and I began to pray for an experience called "the Baptism in the Holy Spirit." Along the way I got baptized in the name of Jesus Christ (about 7 months after my salvation experience) and I received the Holy Ghost Baptism (about 14 months after my salvation experience). I went to a UPC Bible school for one year, attended UPC and other OP churches, was active in the churches, was licensed to preach and preached several places. Then it came to the place where I could no longer "believe" some of the stuff that OP churches were pushing, specifically the idea that
-sin was washed away at water baptism
-those who had not spoken in tongues were not children of God
-facial hair is a sin
-only those baptized in Jesus' name and baptized in the Spirit were in the "real" Church or the Body of Christ

Almost 25 years after my salvation experience, we left the ALJC church we were attending, i resigned my position as sectional youth leader, I told our district secretary I did not want to renew my ministerial license, and we went to no church for over 10 years.

I still read my Bible (some) and prayed (some) and belonged to a couple Bible Study groups at work where we met on our lunch hour. in time I started going to a Vineyard church (1992) and got active serving God again. We now go to a "trinity pentecostal" church (since 2006), I am ordained in two organizations (one OP and one trinity) and I feel good about myself and where I am in God. Just this past weekend I preached in an OP church where the pastor is a strict three-stepper. He knows how I believe and allows some liberty. I can fellowship Christians with different "labels" and realize that there is a lot of diversity in the Body of Christ. I have no problem accepting anyone (Catholic, Protestant, trinity, oneness, etc) who has placed his/her faith in Jesus Christ as Savior.

But, that's my story and that may not work for others.

[onefaith2]

Originally Posted by ILG

If I ever feel that nudge, I'm sure I will. For now, I feel encouraged alone. As a matter of fact, I remember once standing next to one of the little houses that Laura Ingalls Wilder lived in. I felt God speak to me. I felt Him say "Look at the family of Laura Ingalls Wilder. They were totally isolated, yet look what came out of their isolation" (they lived alone and isolated and yet through her writing, many, many people understand pioneer life). We were in Home Missions at the time and it gave me a lot of peace about how alone we were. I didn't realize at the time that this would define my life until this day, but it has. And I am at peace.

Oh I know he will nudge you. Heard tons of testimonies regarding people in a similar situation. Of course today we have TV (some do) and we have internet (all of us here do) so we can hear preaching and actually "go to church" without actually going to church.

Do you listen to preaching and confer with the HG gifts to his church and allow them to minister to you currently?