Is God judging America

[pelathais]

Timmy is a survivor of the wrath of God. Timmy knows what it's like to sin with haughty impunity and then watch while the Almighty takes it out on some hillbillys living over by the river.

[Jermyn Davidson]

Originally Posted by TJJJ

Again, do you feel God is going to soon, or is He already, judging America?

What do you think?

I think the days of GOD judging whole countries are done-- ending at the Cross.

I admit, my opinion could be ill-informed.

[TJJJ]

Originally Posted by Jermyn Davidson

I think the days of GOD judging whole countries are done-- ending at the Cross.

I admit, my opinion could be ill-informed.

Interesting point. Although it could be argued about 70 AD.

Could it be just that instead of God judging nations, He allows the natural rewards and fruits of sin to bring natural judgment upon the actions of all?

I had not thought of the effects of the cross on national judgment though.

[Jermyn Davidson]

Originally Posted by TJJJ

Interesting point. Although it could be argued about 70 AD.

Could it be just that instead of God judging nations, He allows the natural rewards and fruits of sin to bring natural judgment upon the actions of all?

I had not thought of the effects of the cross on national judgment though.

I just don't know of one example of an entire country being wiped out because of the sins of a few, or many, in that country, since the Cross.


However, I do believe that the prayers of the righteous can stop things or alter things from happening-- things that would happen if no one prayed.

[Jermyn Davidson]

Some say the civil war was God judging America.

But those folks don't consider that every country has internal conflicts that many times turn into war.

If anything, it was the Grace of God that once it was over, it was over and it never developed into this ongoing, destructive kind of thing that continued for generations.


God CONTINUES to shed His Grace on the country that is the number one producer of pornography!



If He was to punish America for her sins, I think we would have already been punished-- and maybe it is only the prayers and lives of the righteous that is preventing the utter desolation of America.

But I just don't see GOD utterly destroying all human life in any country since the Cross and before the return of Jesus Christ! HALELU JAH!!


One thing though, when I read the Bible, I don't see America existing as America and making it through "The Tribulation Period"-- something drastic has to happen to America for all the other stuff to take place, IMHO.

[TJJJ]

Originally Posted by Jermyn Davidson

Some say the civil war was God judging America.

But those folks don't consider that every country has internal conflicts that many times turn into war.

If anything, it was the Grace of God that once it was over, it was over and it never developed into this ongoing, destructive kind of thing that continued for generations.


God CONTINUES to shed His Grace on the country that is the number one producer of pornography!



If He was to punish America for her sins, I think we would have already been punished-- and maybe it is only the prayers and lives of the righteous that is preventing the utter desolation of America.

But I just don't see GOD utterly destroying all human life in any country since the Cross and before the return of Jesus Christ! HALELU JAH!!


One thing though, when I read the Bible, I don't see America existing as America and making it through "The Tribulation Period"-- something drastic has to happen to America for all the other stuff to take place, IMHO.

I agree with your statement of God not destroying all human life, but judgment can take many different ways. There was captiviy, oppression, famine and etc. (Deut 28)

We have seen countries go though extensive hardship when their core beliefs were in opposition to rghteousness. Communism and etc.

Do you think that some judgments, not necessarily death, could be happening today? And I don't mean just in this country now! You have been to Aphganistan I believe, do you think that is because of their being crossways in their belief?

[pelathais]

Originally Posted by Jermyn Davidson

... One thing though, when I read the Bible, I don't see America existing as America and making it through "The Tribulation Period"-- something drastic has to happen to America for all the other stuff to take place, IMHO.

I can't find America before the Great Tribulation either. The Bible seems to be silent when it comes to the New World.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by pelathais

A "patriot" of the old Soviet. The "wrongs" you identfiy are simply things you've made up. I'm more concerned about the welfare of the poor and needy than you are. You just make stuff up, whereas I'm looking for real problems that are affecting real people.

Immature indeed. I don't know how concerned you are for the poor, I assume as a Christian YOU'RE very concerned. However, the political establishment isn't. That's my point dear brother. As for YOU caring more that I do...I HOPE YOU DO.

I've worked as a liaison for the United Way for the past 5 years. I worked as a volunteer Therapeutic Programming Assistant with the MRDD for a non-denominational facility for three years, serving families that were underprivileged and couldn't afford programs for their MRDD children. As a United Way liaison my family offers health donations every paycheck to the local foodbank and a clothing closet specializing in people who are in drug rehab and trying to re-enter the work force. I've volunteered locally at the St. Mark's soup kitchen and they know my name well. Also my wife and I were ACTS (Alcohol Chemical Treatment Series) instructors serving underprivileged kids on probation relating to drug offenses.

I don't know you're background in this area... I hope you DO care more and give more of yourself than I do. That would be beautiful.

No they weren't. And those "billionaires" were supporters of the Democratic Party - just look at the list of people under indictment and going to jail. Your tactic of trashing Republican for "being rich" has failed miserably once Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac floundered. The predatory billionaire lenders at Countryside, Wachovia and WaMu? All big time supporters of the Dems. That guy in Texas who finally turned himself in (Stanford Financial) after stealing from 1,000's of dirt poor Antiguans - a Democrat.

Who brought up "Democrat" or "Republican" both parties have exploited the poor and the needy for their own ends. The Republicans have profited the most financially off of cutting programs to facilitate tax cuts and the Democrats profit off of them politically for "compassion points" to maintain public office. Both are seriously exploiting those in need.

Again - you're making this up. In fact, if I called you a "liar" would you be stirred up enough to try and find a single program that fits your bill here? Nope.

Bro...you're very ignorant if you think I'm lying. It was a big story here locally when benefits serving over a 1000 elderly Ohioans was cut do to cut backs in Federal Funding. This funding was cut to facilitate the tax cuts. Again, I work for the City as an Account Reconciler I. My duties include the bid tabs, the purchasing process, and the balancing of interdepartmental spending accounts, contracts, and purchase orders. We juggle money all day long. Just last Friday our office sent 11 Funding Request Memos to City Hall due to the lack of available federal funds that were available before Bush's slash-and-burn tax cut scheme.

No you didn't. Reread your post. And what Enron did was illegal. How could they have been simply following some government "policy?" They were indicted and convicted. What "government policy" will get you thrown in jail for following it? None. You made it up.

Bro...here's what I said...

We hail and praise policies that favor the rich and the powerful. We worship politicians who are hirelings for ENRON and countless other powerful companies that fleece the public trust and defraud their employees of fair wages and pensions.

I'm criticizing the indiscriminate tax breaks offered to corporations by politicians serving as their hirelings and lap dogs. Odds are YOU praised Bush's policy of giving companies like ENRON OUR tax money. Of course, none of us knew how bad off many of these companies were. The issue isn't the tax cut so much as the indiscriminate give away. These companies should have had to offer financial reports on their status for qualifying for the tax benefits.

Kind of like your buddy Stanford's "Bank" in Antigua. Did you see the people lining up to try and get pennies on the dollar from their hard earned savings? And will Barak Obama and the Dems return their money to them? Nope. Redistribution from Antigua to the DNC. Aquila loves those numbers.

Again, because you worship at the alter of your Republicanism you are automatically assuming that I'm anti-Republican and pro-Democrat. There's enough blame to go around. It's just everyone's quick to call the Democrats on it... you guys don't have the GUTS to call the Republicans on it.

Ohio is dependant upon Federal dollars for local building inspections? That's just plain graft, my friend. And, since the Bush tax cuts resulted in a net gain to the Treasury - why was anything cut?

You are highly uninformed. The CDBG funding is part of a federal block grant system that was seriously cut during the Bush tax cut plan. The President's budget request for the year 2006 proposed eliminating 18 different community and economic development programs and replacing them with one program called the 'Strengthening America's Communities Grant Program.' The largest program that was effected under this program was Community Development Block Grant (CDBG) which awarded $4.7 billion in support for community development to cities, counties and states across the country. The budget proposal reduced total community and economic development funding by $1.6 billion, or 30 percent. Why did they do this? To facilitate the Bush Tax Cuts. You need to get informed.

When you're cutting taxes - you cut them for the tax payers, whoever they may be. In this country the upper 10% of wage earners pay more than half of all income taxes. So when you want to boost your economy what taxes do you cut? Simple, you cut the taxes that are being paid.

You deserve a biscuit. LOL You're RIGHT. However, in the name of "tax cuts", under the Bush plan we saw a massive tax money give away given to corporations and those making over $200,000 a year. The majority of this money was invested in foreign markets. To perform the stimulating tax cuts you're talking about we need targeted tax cuts. Tax cuts targeting the middle class. It's the middle class that spends the money in the economy and doesn't invest overseas. Obama's plan offers health tax cuts for the middle class, something the Bush Tax cuts didn't provide.

No, I voted Republican in the past election cycle. The "robber barons" all supported democrats. Read your newspaper.

The Robber Barons under Bush plundered the public trust and gave it away to the money powers controlling them. They were nothing but lap dogs for the oil companies and corporate America.

And since you've been beating your wife and wearing her hosiery all in the name of "social justice" I want to know how you justify that kind of behavior. You worship on the altar of selling crack to elementary school children and stealing from the savings of poor Antiguans all at the expense of starving children in the Sudan. How can you sleep at night?

What???? LOL You've lost your everlovin' mind bro. LOL

Hey! It's fun just to make stuff up and rant about it. You're probably responsible for Brad Pitt and Jennifer breaking up too, you rascal you.

I couldn't help it, Jennifer said she wanted me and that Brad just didn't understand her.

Well, too bad you're doing so with such a dim bulb. Let's see, all your "robber barons" were Dems and Libs. All of the "policies" that have created the current mess (Freddie Mac, Fannie Mae and the subprime stuff) were Democratic inspired programs.

You need to study the deregulation of the banking industry that goes all the way back to the mid 80's. And don't get on some rant involving CRA and the low interest adjustable rate mortgages, I'll have to get my wife in here to explain it to you because she worked for National City and can explain the situation far better than I can. The excessive issuance of ARMs was due to the abuse of deregulation.

The graft and corruption of the Democratic Party is rife - but facilitated by a lap dog media.

Both parties have their propaganda machines...perhaps we need a truly independent media that is forced to offer both sides equal time and rebuttal to avoid all the spin? Just a thought.

And the poor are still largely poor despite throwing trillions of dollars at them. And now even Middle Class wage earners are losing their homes because of the failed fiscal policies of the Libs. And to "cure" this the Democratic Congress passed an "Emergency" "stimulus" bill before any member of Congress can even read it. It was THAT important.

Bro...that's ignorant. It's more complicated than that. And both the Libs and Cons had a part to play in the crisis. You're one sided accusations reveals your partisan bias.

Then the bill just sat on Obama's desk while he took Michelle to Chicago for Valentine's Day and then he came out to Denver to sign the thing several days later on the same stage where he had his fake Greek columns raised. Pretty important piece of Legislation there. The only "Emergency" was that they get the thing passed before anyone could actually read it. What a bunch of crooks.

So Obama gave several days for Congress to review the bill and you're blaming the fact that Congress didn't review it on Obama? LOL

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by pelathais

Yes you did.

The "cuts" you describe are being made either by statute in a spending authorization bill from within a department if the managers and directors are given latitude with a program. Therefore, the "blame" for such cuts (if any) belongs to those making the cuts. Don't blame those who are taking advantage of a tax rate cut and exposing more of their wealth to taxation and ultimately paying more tax dollars.

Educate yourself.

Who called who a "socialist liberal?" Those names are called when tax rates are raised, not when they're being lowered as you are deescribing. And the "rebate schemes" are always weighted toward the poor end - in fact people who never even paid any taxes end up getting refunds and those evil rich people only get a fraction back of what they paid.

Bush tax cuts didn't cut taxes for the middle class...it was a rebate. People got a bribe, oh, a check to help them buy a new television or hub caps for their cars....multiplied millions were given to corporations who invested the money in foreign markets in addition to actually having their "taxes cut". The Bush Tax cuts just tossed a bone to the middle class.

The game is designed and set up to redistribute massive amounts of wealth from "the rich" to the special interests of the Democratic Party. That's why we end up spending 100's of millions on "birth control" as part of a "stimulus plan." And Billions go to A.C.O.R.N. to reward them for their voter fraud efforts.

Oh gawd.

Do you have any opinion that's not been featured on Rush Limbaugh? LOL

To say America is "heartless" and that Americans "exploit the poor is a lie. I paid over 20x's the amjount of charitable contributions than Joe Biden paid in the last 4 years. And, I'm helping to support 2 seperate food banks with that. No Aquila's buddy Joe thinks I need to "give" more to ensure that the special interests are well funded and Joe can get re-elected.

Wait a minute my hard of reading friend. I never said that Americans are heartless or that Americans exploit the poor. The average American has proven to be more generous than anyone can imagine. My issue is the exploited system that's being used for profit by both the Democrats and the Republicans.

I say, "That's robbery and unjust." Aquila says, "Shut up and paid dear old Joe the money that he wants."

Maybe if you were as much of a Christian as you are a Republican... you'd understand that my issue is with both parties and the system in general.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by pelathais

And a similar situation is found in America... where?

Ignorance.

If I told you again you'd not believe me, just as you already didn't. You'd just want to debate it point by point to justify the slash and burn policies of the Bush Administration that left millions of needy Americans behind. You can't even admit that Bush's policies were bad policy as far as conservatism is concerned, you're too loyal politically. You're a prime example of why judgment's coming our way.