ALJC vs UPCI

[amh]

Originally Posted by Servant's <3

You are an idealist in a world that is far from it as possible. It would be expensive to merge. That is probably the biggest reason.

Is it right that money should be a reason... no...

However, there would have to be long lasting and mutual benefits to all individuals in both groups for them to consider it.

Yeah. I was going to mention money issues but I didn't want to.

I can't think of any terrible disadvantages for anyone though. ALJCers already go to UPCI events, no one goes to ALJC events (lol just kidding), so things like camp meetings and conferences wouldn't change much. They'd just be bigger, which might not be the best thing in the world but it wouldn't hurt that much.

I guess I am an idealist but praise God for that because I used to be an awful pessimist.

[Servant's <3]

I would not characterize myself as a pessimist.... I hope for idealism but I act like a realist.

The apostle Paul was a realist in my opinion.

[commonsense]

A bit off topic, but as a child in the North.......for approx 10 yrs(maybe more)..
There were 4 UPC churches and 3 PAW churches that formed their own unofficial alliance of churches for the purpose of fellowship.

I was a child in the 1950's so my memory may be off
We had monthly fellowship meetings at various churches____probably an unofficial rotation. And every summer we had Bible Camp. That was what it was called. Rented a county campground. One yr UPC picked evangelist and the next yr the PAW made the selection. Fabulous services!!!

Breakfast
(I'm sure there was also prayer)
AM--classes for children (not sure about the adults )

Noon:Lunch== not part of the cheap weekly cost you purchased a la carte

Then recreation for all { baseball on a sandlot down the road and around the bend...and a very blue,clear lake for swimming.....while the girls went swimming== the boys were playing ball+++when we dried our hair etc the boys went swimming________
did I mention>>rustic! as in a pump for water and outhouses?
The lake was our bath/shower for the day!!!
We took shampoo down to the lake with us

2pm afternoon Bible Study--I just remember really good Bible teaching

4pm supper

6pm choir practice
7 or 7:30 evening service

My point is that we had very good unity among the 2 organizations....this was not sanctioned by either organization as far I know/ in da north...this was in part due to geography--not only 2 organizations but also 2 states.

Yes, there were no doubt differences in standards____but when you are 7 or 8 , not an issue

This ended approx 1964____________new ministers on the scene may have not shared the unity/friendship.

Now there is too much ME MY MINE......unfortunately God is not the 1st choice _______________

[Barb]

When I was a young'un in the church I knew only about 'us' and 'them'...the 'them' in this mix was anyone who was not 'us': Trinitarian Pentecostals, Baptists, Catholics, etc.

Today the 'us' and 'them' mindset is widespread within the Apostolic church. In my opinion, there is too much of this sectarian mentality among us to ever have another merger.

Sadly we will never again see the cohesiveness and mutual respect for a differing view that we saw in 1945, more's the pity.

[good samaritan]

I have noticed people focus on a major problem that is too big for any one person to solve. We should focus on the small part we play and it is amazing the results that may come. a small ripple created in a pond can somewhat grow and move the surface of the entire pond. Be a person who seeks unity without offending. Sometimes people may create disunity for the cause of unity. Ironic. Influence others not by you words, but by your life.

[amh]

Originally Posted by commonsense

A bit off topic, but as a child in the North.......for approx 10 yrs(maybe more)..
There were 4 UPC churches and 3 PAW churches that formed their own unofficial alliance of churches for the purpose of fellowship.

I was a child in the 1950's so my memory may be off
We had monthly fellowship meetings at various churches____probably an unofficial rotation. And every summer we had Bible Camp. That was what it was called. Rented a county campground. One yr UPC picked evangelist and the next yr the PAW made the selection. Fabulous services!!!

Breakfast
(I'm sure there was also prayer)
AM--classes for children (not sure about the adults )

Noon:Lunch== not part of the cheap weekly cost you purchased a la carte

Then recreation for all { baseball on a sandlot down the road and around the bend...and a very blue,clear lake for swimming.....while the girls went swimming== the boys were playing ball+++when we dried our hair etc the boys went swimming________
did I mention>>rustic! as in a pump for water and outhouses?
The lake was our bath/shower for the day!!!
We took shampoo down to the lake with us

2pm afternoon Bible Study--I just remember really good Bible teaching

4pm supper

6pm choir practice
7 or 7:30 evening service

My point is that we had very good unity among the 2 organizations....this was not sanctioned by either organization as far I know/ in da north...this was in part due to geography--not only 2 organizations but also 2 states.

Yes, there were no doubt differences in standards____but when you are 7 or 8 , not an issue

This ended approx 1964____________new ministers on the scene may have not shared the unity/friendship.

Now there is too much ME MY MINE......unfortunately God is not the 1st choice _______________

This is wonderful. I wish it was more like that now.

[amh]

Originally Posted by Barb

When I was a young'un in the church I knew only about 'us' and 'them'...the 'them' in this mix was anyone who was not 'us': Trinitarian Pentecostals, Baptists, Catholics, etc.

Today the 'us' and 'them' mindset is widespread within the Apostolic church. In my opinion, there is too much of this sectarian mentality among us to ever have another merger.

Sadly we will never again see the cohesiveness and mutual respect for a differing view that we saw in 1945, more's the pity.

It's all very saddening, to think organization matters more than beliefs these days.

[Servant's <3]

Why do you think organization matters more than belief? Anyone with any sense would not say that fellowship can only be had with those of a particular organization.

I would not be averse to fellowship with ALJC'ers. Especially considering the similarities in doctrinal beliefs.

That being said mergers do not HAVE to happen to have harmony.

[Bowas]

The "United" part of the UPC is from when they did merge/unite several years ago with various Pentecostal organizations.
If the UPCI and ALJC did merge, that would not be all the oneness organizations left out there. According to this link, http://www.apostolic-churches.com/organizations.html there are many oneness organizations.
I see no need to merge them all into one super organization, any more than I feel all hamburger fast foods restaurants should merge into McDonalds. While they all server burgers, fries and drinks, some prefer the taste or service of Burger King over McDonalds. Leave it alone and attend what suits you.

[amh]

Originally Posted by Servant's <3

Why do you think organization matters more than belief? Anyone with any sense would not say that fellowship can only be had with those of a particular organization.

I would not be averse to fellowship with ALJC'ers. Especially considering the similarities in doctrinal beliefs.

That being said mergers do not HAVE to happen to have harmony.

And mergers don't have to happen. I just like the idea of it.

I just know a few UPCers that essentially idolize the org. They think it's better than any other and if you point out any flaw that it might have they get offended. That faction before blood mentality is wrong. I'm UPC now but if the UPC ever stops preaching sound doctrine, I'm out.