Assemblies of God 2013 Statistics Released

[votivesoul]

Originally Posted by navygoat1998

I only said something because that is my denomination

If it was a Oneness organization would you be so quick to point out how data could be misrepresented or skewd or is that just reserved for those like the AG who you don't consider brothers in Christ?

I know you're an AoG man, but let me ask you: If it wasn't your denomination, would have been so quick to defend it?

I readily admit that all data in whatever form, can be manipulated to mean almost anything, including church organization and growth data. That is true of all groups, Oneness and otherwise.

But since this was a post about AoG growth data, my comments were limited to data regarding the growth, so-called, experienced by AoG.

Kind of weird, huh? Actually staying on topic.

[votivesoul]

Originally Posted by Reader

Freak out? Sacred cow? Funny!!

All I said was in response to you was - The exact same may be said of UPC growth, PAW, ALJC & all other Apostolic organizations.

And that's the truth!

The truth of your statement doesn't invalidate the truth of mine. I merely made an accurate case that the stats presented may not indicate what the AoG says they do.

And you all made assumptions about me, what I think, what I believe, what organizational affiliations I have and who I do and do not think is saved. See I never said a thing about the data of other organizations, or any other thing. You and some others brought up all the stuff you're picking on me for (presumptuously so, I might add). I merely made honest comments in good faith.

I even had someone respond in which they poo-pooed on how much Oneness people evangelize and work to see people filled with the Spirit just so they could launch into a diatribe about their perceived lack of discipleship among the Apostolic movement.

So, yes, I see it as a freak out. Too many are so ready to knee jerk and shoot from the hip and rush to speak before they think around here. Not everyone who posts at AFF has a hidden agenda or thinks so low of their fellow posters, or their affiliations and denominational positions just because a good swath of other posters actually do.

[Reader]

And you all made assumptions about me, what I think, what I believe, what organizational affiliations I have and who I do and do not think is saved.

How did I accomplish this by writing, "The exact same may be said of UPC growth, PAW, ALJC & all other Apostolic organizations"?

The truth of your statement doesn't invalidate the truth of mine.

Never said it did.

[votivesoul]

Originally Posted by Reader

How did I accomplish this by writing, "The exact same may be said of UPC growth, PAW, ALJC & all other Apostolic organizations"?

You're correct. You didn't say it. It was someone else. I apologize for lumping and conflating you with/into someone else.

Never said it did.

I know, but I wonder at the motives for making the point, since these other Oneness organizations were not a part of the original post. Were you just randomly musing or were you directing your comments toward me and my post?

I take it, it was the latter and not the former.

[n david]

Originally Posted by votivesoul

The truth of your statement doesn't invalidate the truth of mine. I merely made an accurate case that the stats presented may not indicate what the AoG says they do.

And you all made assumptions about me, what I think, what I believe, what organizational affiliations I have and who I do and do not think is saved. See I never said a thing about the data of other organizations, or any other thing. You and some others brought up all the stuff you're picking on me for (presumptuously so, I might add). I merely made honest comments in good faith.

I even had someone respond in which they poo-pooed on how much Oneness people evangelize and work to see people filled with the Spirit just so they could launch into a diatribe about their perceived lack of discipleship among the Apostolic movement.

So, yes, I see it as a freak out. Too many are so ready to knee jerk and shoot from the hip and rush to speak before they think around here. Not everyone who posts at AFF has a hidden agenda or thinks so low of their fellow posters, or their affiliations and denominational positions just because a good swath of other posters actually do.

Weird. I went through this thread three times and didn't see any of the parts in bold. In fact, the only one's who quoted you directly were NavyGoat1998, Keptbytheword and Reader and they did none of what you claimed. None of the other posts quote or even mention you.

Actually, most of the ire was directed at AR Pastor, not you.

[votivesoul]

The "you all" refers to those who are personally interacting with me, not everyone posting on this thread.

[Reader]

Originally Posted by votivesoul

You're correct. You didn't say it. It was someone else. I apologize for lumping and conflating you with/into someone else.

No harm done. Apology accepted.

I know, but I wonder at the motives for making the point, since these other Oneness organizations were not a part of the original post. Were you just randomly musing or were you directing your comments toward me and my post?

I take it, it was the latter and not the former.

Of course it was a comment in reply to your post but certainly not anything toward you personally. ANY church group stats could fit your description. Since this is an Apostolic forum and since I am aware of how some UPC stats have been formed in the past, I zeroed in on this.

Look at how some count Sunday School attendance as a regular stat, when many of those can be children bused in and not actual members of the church? Look at how some count Easter service instead of a regular midweek service when less people attend or a regular Sunday evening.

There can be many variables in numbers and some denominations have strict rules as to who is counted and they separate members from constituents.

[navygoat1998]

Originally Posted by votivesoul

I know you're an AoG man, but let me ask you: If it wasn't your denomination, would have been so quick to defend it?

I readily admit that all data in whatever form, can be manipulated to mean almost anything, including church organization and growth data. That is true of all groups, Oneness and otherwise.

But since this was a post about AoG growth data, my comments were limited to data regarding the growth, so-called, experienced by AoG.

Kind of weird, huh? Actually staying on topic.

Brother I was really defending the Holy Ghost Baptism based upon what I have seen and what I have been part of personally.

As far as numbers I think ALL denominations stretch numbers. It's like the adage, I have car worth 300,000 dollars but I could only sell it for 250,000 dollars, the car is only worth what somebody is willing to pay for it.


AG churches close their doors all the time and new ones are planted.

[Abiding Now]

Praying the AoG comes into the truth.

[Michael The Disciple]

Originally Posted by Abiding Now

Praying the AoG comes into the truth.

I pray they come to MORE truth. They have SOME truth.