A Whole New Level of Apostolic Hero Worship - Page 6

Aquila · #51 08-13-2013, 10:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by StillStanding

I wouldn't mind having a tie of a preacher that preached a message that changed my life! It would be a constant reminder of promises that I made to God that night.

My list would be Merrill Ewing, TF Tenney and Mark Hanby. Not hero worship, but a monument of sorts of a life changing moment for me. I'm willing to pay up to $5! :-)

That's fair and understandable.

Aquila · #52 08-13-2013, 10:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nitehawk013

It's no different than selling peanut brittle or having a basket auction to raise funds for the church. No one looses their mind ove rpeanut brittle, but you snap over them havign the nerve to sell some ties?

Grow up.

I think at first glance it just looks like charismatic "prayer cloths" for sale. But you're right... it's a fundraiser... a rather gimmicky one... but a fund raiser.

Aquila · #53 08-13-2013, 10:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MarcBee

Public TV stations have learned that saying, "Please give" simply does not work as well as offering PREMIUMS to those supposedly giving for "the cause." When the premium is a calendar, the results are not as spectacular as if they could offer an authenticated lock of Mick Jaggers's hair. Some people (such as I) would laugh at those who regard Mick Jaggers hair as something more valuable than my own hair, but ebay might prove that MJ hair is in fact more valuable. And so also with religious relics of any kind--some people are unaffected by sentimentality, and therefore laugh at those who are sentimental about, or fascinated about certain objects.

Peanut brittle is thankfully less controversial.

Good point...

I think it's a bit worldly in it's marketing approach though. Why not simply implore the body to give as the early church would? Must we have some form of premium or profit from giving to the work of God? Not criticizing, just a question.

Aquila · #54 08-13-2013, 10:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

Preserving them in a shadow box is a great idea! I hope I am able to discard my lingerie drawer before I die.

lol

MissBrattified · #55 08-13-2013, 10:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jason Badejo

I'm shocked that people are defending this. If these were the ties of Kenneth Copeland, Creflo Dollar, and Benny Hinn and their followers were bidding on them, apostolics would be quick to speak against that, BUT since its happening within one of "our" churches with "our" men of God, then its all in "fun". Whatever. To me its another example of inconsistency. Rail against everyone else, but turn a blind eye to mess that goes on in your own back yard.

I haven't ever railed against ANYONE for raising money for missions--or any other good cause. I respect the charitable efforts and works of any organization, whether they're religious or secular.

On the other hand, you might have noticed a very lengthy thread a few months back about an Apostolic pastor who, among other things, was accused of grossly mishandling church funds. Despite the fact that he was Apostolic, not many people here took up for him, and in fact, the outcry was so great and angry that we ended up closing the thread.

People "rail" against Benny Hinn and others who come across as charlatans who are bilking people out of money for their own gain. No one would care if they were giving all of it to orphans and widows.

Pressing-On · #56 08-13-2013, 10:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aquila

I think at first glance it just looks like charismatic "prayer cloths" for sale. But you're right... it's a fundraiser... a rather gimmicky one... but a fund raiser.

Have you noticed how they take the "prayer cloth" story from the "people" feeling such a palatable anointing that they reached out to touch the Disciples with the handkerchiefs and/or aprons they had on their person to "leadership" anointing them with oil and handing them out? It is now a gimmick, IMO. Faith brings results, not the item in our hand.

Pressing-On · #57 08-13-2013, 10:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by StillStanding

I wouldn't mind having a tie of a preacher that preached a message that changed my life! It would be a constant reminder of promises that I made to God that night.

My list would be Merrill Ewing, TF Tenney and Mark Hanby. Not hero worship, but a monument of sorts of a life changing moment for me. I'm willing to pay up to $5! :-)

It would still have been only God who changed you. I would rather focus on that. I guess all the superstitious symbolism from Catholicism still annoys me. And it's hard not to make comparisons after the experience.

Aquila · #58 08-13-2013, 10:24 AM

But then there is an interesting twist here... while this is a fundraiser... I'd not be surprised if someone received healing or a much needed deliverance after coming into contact with some of these objects. The Bible states...

Acts 19:11-12
King James Version (KJV)
11 And God wrought special miracles by the hands of Paul:
12 So that from his body were brought unto the sick handkerchiefs or aprons, and the diseases departed from them, and the evil spirits went out of them.

We know that when the woman with an issue of blood touched the hem of Christ's garment "virtue" (power) departed from him, and many sought to touch him to receive the very same virtue...

Mark 5:30
And Jesus, immediately knowing in himself that virtue had gone out of him, turned him about in the press, and said, Who touched my clothes?

Luke 6:19
And the whole multitude sought to touch him: for there went virtue out of him, and healed them all.

I can only speak for myself... but I believe that the presence and power of God leaves some kind of "residual energy" or "power" behind that can be tapped into. I don't believe it's limited to cloth either. We read about Elisha's bones...

2 Kings 13:21
King James Version (KJV)
21 And it came to pass, as they were burying a man, that, behold, they spied a band of men; and they cast the man into the sepulchre of Elisha: and when the man was let down, and touched the bones of Elisha, he revived, and stood up on his feet.

I've heard testimonies about how churches have prayed over jackets, pillows, chairs, wrist watches, rings, pictures, cars, beds, etc., imparting spiritual "virtue" to those items to work a spiritual work in the lives of their loved ones. I've even experienced this. My son was troubled with nightmares and talking/crying in his sleep for a period of time and it greatly troubled me. He was very afraid of the dark and feared "monsters" under his bed, in his closet, etc. I had my pastor at the time pray over a prayer cloth and I tucked it in my son's pillow. From that very night he slept soundly. Whatever was troubling him departed. Please note... for me it was an experiment. I DIDN'T tell him about it. He was only three years old anyway and I'm not sure if he would have understood it. However, I wanted to see if it made a difference... and it did.

It's a bit mysterious to me and I don't profess to understand it all. But I believe in it.

So... that being said... I'll be curious to know if anyone who purchases one of these items receives some form of touch from the power of God that might reside within.

Historically speaking... I believe this is where the early church's belief in relics originated. Behind every legend is an element of truth. I'm interested to see what might happen.

Pressing-On · #59 08-13-2013, 10:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aquila

But then there is an interesting twist here... while this is a fundraiser... I'd not be surprised if someone received healing or a much needed deliverance after coming into contact with some of these objects. The Bible states...

Acts 19:11-12
King James Version (KJV)
11 And God wrought special miracles by the hands of Paul:
12 So that from his body were brought unto the sick handkerchiefs or aprons, and the diseases departed from them, and the evil spirits went out of them.

We know that when the woman with an issue of blood touched the hem of Christ's garment "virtue" (power) departed from him, and many sought to touch him to receive the very same virtue...

Mark 5:30
And Jesus, immediately knowing in himself that virtue had gone out of him, turned him about in the press, and said, Who touched my clothes?

Luke 6:19
And the whole multitude sought to touch him: for there went virtue out of him, and healed them all.

I can only speak for myself... but I believe that the presence and power of God leaves a residual energy behind that can be tapped into. I don't believe it's limited to cloth either. We read about Elijah's bones...

2 Kings 13:21
King James Version (KJV)
21 And it came to pass, as they were burying a man, that, behold, they spied a band of men; and they cast the man into the sepulchre of Elisha: and when the man was let down, and touched the bones of Elisha, he revived, and stood up on his feet.

I've heard testimonies about how a church prayed over a jacket, pillows, chairs, wrist watches, rings, pictures, cars, beds, etc., imparting spiritual "virtue" to those items to work a spiritual work in the lives of their loved ones. I've even experienced this. My son was troubled with nightmares and taking in his sleep for a period of time and it greatly troubled me. He was very afraid of the dark and feared "monsters" under his bed, in his closet, etc. I had my pastor at the time pray over a prayer cloth and I tucked it in my son's pillow. From that very night he slept soundly. Whatever was troubling him departed. Please note... for me it was an experiment. I DIDN'T tell him about it. I wanted to see if it made a difference... and it did.

It's a bit mysterious to me and I don't profess to understand it all. But I believe in it.

So... that being said... I'll be curious to know if anyone who purchases one of these items receives some form of touch from the power of God that might reside within.

Historically speaking... I believe this is where the early church's belief in relics originated. Behind every legend is an element of truth. I'm interested to see what might happen.

I would tend to think it was your prayers than the cloth. When I was a Catholic, we put palm leaves over the door to protect us from storms. Today, it seems rather ridiculous.

Aquila · #60 08-13-2013, 10:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

I would tend to think it was your prayers than the cloth. When I was a Catholic, we put palm leaves over the door to protect us from storms. Today, it seems rather ridiculous.

I see what you're trying to say... but in my mind it doesn't answer every point on the matter. For example, a DEAD man is thrown down on the bones of Elisha... and the man comes back to life. He had no "prayers" to be answered. He was worm food. After his lifeless body touched the bones... he was revived by the residual power (anointing) of God's Spirit that had permeated Elisha's material body back when Elisha was living.

2 Kings 13:21
King James Version (KJV)
21 And it came to pass, as they were burying a man, that, behold, they spied a band of men; and they cast the man into the sepulchre of Elisha: and when the man was let down, and touched the bones of Elisha, he revived, and stood up on his feet.

For some mysterious reason there was residual power present in Elisha's bones.

As for palm leaves and indigenous practices... many are superstitions. Many may also be ways to tapping into residual power left over from the creation. Something those adept in "magick" are quick to acknowledge.