Oneness Pentecostals and The Blood Of The Lamb

[seekerman]

Originally Posted by preacher clk

The high priest only rolled the sin away for a year. It was and had to be done each year. Plus there was plenty of self sacrifices daily. The blood of Jesus done away with the old law and now we live under grace.

Actually, while the high priest under the old covenant performed the ordinances and rituals, it was the blood which was offered for their sins. It was not redemptive blood, it was atoning blood. The blood of animals doesn't redeem.

Jesus on the other hand offered redemptive blood, blood which redeemed individuals.

[seekerman]

Originally Posted by Originalist

The blood of the Lamb is sufficient to "redeem" us, or pay our ransom. And what held us ransom? God's own justice.

However, what "saves" us, according to Titus 3:5 is "washing of rebirth and renewing of the Holy Ghost". This is when God himself comes to live in our hearts by his Spirit, baptizing us into the body of Christ. The blood of the Lamb bought this Holy Ghost renewing for us.

Paul said in Romans 5:10.....


His blood reconciled us so God could SAVE us by Christ's LIFE. It's the LIFE that actually does the saving. And what is this LIFE that saves us? Paul tells us in Romans 8:11....

Romans 5:10, 8:11 and Titus 3:5 all agree.

The blood paves the way for the Spirit of God to be able to dwell in us who were estranged from God by sin. But the blood (his death) without the Spirit ( his life) has no meaning.

Seekerman really does not understand what the sufficiency of the blood brings about.

In your opinion, what exactly did the blood of the Lamb of God redeem as related to individuals?

Rev 5:9 And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;

[Originalist]

Originally Posted by seekerman

In your opinion, what exactly did the blood of the Lamb of God redeem as related to individuals?

Rev 5:9 And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;

As individuals it has made a way where we can be infused with life once again. The word "redeem" in the Greek means "to pay a ransom". God's own justice held us ransom. He was obliged to destroy us. But the blood redeemed (purchased) the entire human race. He now owns the property rights to every human tabernacle. But those individual tabernacles must yield to the one who has claimed ownership over them. When they do so , he has promised to come and take residence within them, thus marking them as his own, and that they have yielded to his Lordship. Paul said it best in Ephesians 1....

13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

14 Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.

At the rapture, redemption is complete and the purchased possession is forever , literally present with the Lord.

Look at the same verses in the NLT....

13 And now you Gentiles have also heard the truth, the Good News that God saves you. And when you believed in Christ, he identified you as his own by giving you the Holy Spirit, whom he promised long ago.

14 The Spirit is God’s guarantee that he will give us the inheritance he promised and that he has purchased us to be his own people. He did this so we would praise and glorify him.

The Spirit is the mark and evidence that an individual has yielded to the one who paid their ransom and lays claim to ownwership over them. Those who refuse to yield ownership of their vessels to the rightful owner will be cast into hell....

26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,

27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.

28 He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:

29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?

30 For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people.

31 It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.

[seekerman]

Originally Posted by Originalist

As individuals it has made a way where we can be infused with life once again. The word "redeem" in the Greek means "to pay a ransom". God's own justice held us ransom. He was obliged to destroy us. But the blood redeemed (purchased) the entire human race. He now owns the property rights to every human tabernacle. But those individual tabernacles must yield to the one who has claimed ownership over them. When they do so , he has promised to come and take residence within them, thus marking them as his own, and that they have yielded to his Lordship. Paul said it best in Ephesians 1....

At the rapture, redemption is complete and the purchased possession is forever , literally present with the Lord.

Look at the same verses in the NLT....

The word redeemed means, according to Strong's....

agorazō
ag-or-ad'-zo
From G58; properly to go to market, that is, (by implication) to purchase; specifically to redeem: - buy, redeem.

While not in total disagreement with much of your post, I'm still attempting to determine what the benefit is of this blood redemption when it actually takes place for the individual. At some point in time, the blood redemption is applied/imputed and the person then becomes the possession of the redeemer. While there are various views of when the redemption blood is applied/imputed unto a person, there is some point where this occurs. Is that person then owned by God when the redemption actually takes place?

This is the question at hand...is the redemption blood of the Lamb of God sufficient to make one a possession of God once it's been applied/imputed to an individual. For example, when were you personally redeemed in your opinion? Has the redemptive blood of the Lamb of God been applied/imputed to you and was that redemptive blood sufficient in and of itself?

[THX4GRACE]

Even the Devils believe..........but they certainly aren't saved.

[navygoat1998]

Originally Posted by THX4GRACE

Even the Devils believe..........but they certainly aren't saved.

Do demons have faith unto Salvation??? What about you do you believe unto to Salvation or do you by pass the Cross and the shed blood of the Lamb?????

Is the Cross your cornerstone or is your stepping stone???

[Originalist]

Originally Posted by seekerman

The word redeemed means, according to Strong's....

agorazō
ag-or-ad'-zo
From G58; properly to go to market, that is, (by implication) to purchase; specifically to redeem: - buy, redeem.

While not in total disagreement with much of your post, I'm still attempting to determine what the benefit is of this blood redemption when it actually takes place for the individual. At some point in time, the blood redemption is applied/imputed and the person then becomes the possession of the redeemer. While there are various views of when the redemption blood is applied/imputed unto a person, there is some point where this occurs. Is that person then owned by God when the redemption actually takes place?

This is the question at hand...is the redemption blood of the Lamb of God sufficient to make one a possession of God once it's been applied/imputed to an individual. For example, when were you personally redeemed in your opinion? Has the redemptive blood of the Lamb of God been applied/imputed to you and was that redemptive blood sufficient in and of itself?

The Holy Spirit sanctifies/washes/ justifies/seals/ imparts the new birth BY (or because of) the blood of the Lamb. So ultimately, the blood's work is accomplished when you are born of the Spirit.

[larrylyates]

Hebrews 10:19
Having therefore, brethren, boldness to enter into the holiest by the blood of Jesus,

1 John 1:7
But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.

1 Peter 1:2
Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.

Revelation 1:5
And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood,

Ephesians 1:7
In Him we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of our trespasses, according to the riches of His grace

Hebrews 9:12
and not through the blood of goats and calves, but through His own blood, He entered the holy place once for all, having obtained eternal redemption.

Acts 2:37-38
37 Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?
38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Why is it that you can accept the truth of everyone of these scriptures except Acts 2:38?

Every example we have in scripture reveals that they were baptized in the Name of Jesus and spoke in tongues. Why is it that you can't take that at face value?

Also, there is not a single example in scripture of an unbaptized believer or anyone Baptized using the words of Mt 28:19. The apostle Matthew wrote those words and he was present at Pentecost when Peter spoke the words of Acts 2:38. That would have been the best time to correct him and remind him of Mt 28!

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by seekerman

Eph 1:7 In Him we have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of our trespasses, according to the riches of His grace

1Pe 1:18 knowing that you were not redeemed with perishable things like silver or gold from your futile way of life inherited from your forefathers, 19 but with precious blood, as of a lamb unblemished and spotless, the blood of Christ.

Why don't the oneness Pentecostals believe in the sufficiency of the blood of the Lamb?

Why don't you stop beating your wife?

Same premise, same fallacy.

[seekerman]

Originally Posted by Esaias

Why don't you stop beating your wife?

Same premise, same fallacy.

No, not really. Many oneness pentecostals have the view that the blood of the Lamb is applied at baptism but is insufficient for salvation until the person to whom the blood is applied also receives the Holy Ghost with the evidence of speaking in tongues. In that case the blood of the Lamb of God is insufficient without something added to it.