Gay Hate?

[FlamingZword]

Originally Posted by Jay

I am considering researching every sin that is forbidden by Scripture. I believe that this would make an interesting study as there are more than we can sit and list off the top of our heads.

There are many sins, some physical seen (prostitution, drunkeness, idolatry and other easily noticed.)

However there are sins that are spiritual and can not be seen, like (Pride, jealousy, hatred and others such inner sins)

It is not really about this sin or that sin, it is the fact that we are sinners and just can't help sinning. It is only by the power of the Holy Spirit that we can live in this world.

a sin may become socially aceptable, but it still sin in God's eyes.

Homosexuals want their sin to be socially aceptable, but even if they ever achieve that Goal, it is still a sin in God's eyes.

If they ever achieve that Goal, I wonder what will be the next acceptable sin, bestiality or pedophilia?

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by FlamingZword

We have a very bigoted and intolerant God.

No sexual inmoral will make it into heaven
No idolater will make it into heaven
No male prostitute will make it into heaven
No homosexual offender will make it into heaven
No cowardly will make it into heaven
No Unbeliever will make it into heaven
No vile person will make it into heaven
No sexually inmoral will make it into heaven
No practicer of magic arts will make it into heaven
No liar will make it into heaven

and a few more in other scriptures.

I Cor 6:9, Rev 21:6

I myself can not make it into heaven for I have basically done each of these things.

I was not raised a Christian, so in my younger years I have practiced sexual inmorality, I was an idolater, I have been a male prostitute, I experienced with homosexuality, I have behaved like a coward at times, I have not believed God at times, I have sometimes been a vile person, I have read astrology and practiced magical arts, I have sometimes lied and have done many other such things.

However I trust in Jesus and have repented of my past sins, So if I am going to get into heaven it won't be because of my purity, but because of Jesus Christ.

Keep up the good fight brother!

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Jay

I am considering researching every sin that is forbidden by Scripture. I believe that this would make an interesting study as there are more than we can sit and list off the top of our heads.

I think it would be a greater task to research the character and person of Jesus with regards to how he related to the law. Because we are not called to keep the law... we are called to be conformed into the image of Jesus.

For example, I had fallen into the notion that I was required as a Christian to follow the Ten Commandments... then some Sabbath keepers busted the Fourth Commandment on me. So... I began keeping the Sabbath with them so as to not violate the commandment. And then I read of how Jesus said that the sabbath was made for man... not man for the sabbath. And how Jesus himself called himself the "Lord of the Sabbath". When I received the understanding that we're not called to obey the law... but to be conformed into the image of Jesus, He being our standard, I realized... the entire law was made for man... not man for the law. More specifically, the law was made for Israel. Therefore to live by it would only conform me into the likeness of Israel... not Christ. Christ's righteousness superceeded the law. He demonstrated a love that would heal and allow the disciples to pluck corn on the sabbath day.

I might not keep the law perfectly. I might have my issues in my struggle against my flesh. However, I have learned that Christ demands that I strive to be as much like Him as possible. That requires loving God with all my heart.... and demonstrating that love by loving others as myself... not by keeping some body of laws or list of codes.

[Aquila]

Romans 12:18
If it be possible, as much as lieth in you, live peaceably with all men.

We are called to live peaceably with all men. Sadly, many souls that desperately need Jesus (both gay and straight) and will be turned off to Christ.

Regardless of our interpretations on various social issues in our nation... we must be wise.

[Jay]

Originally Posted by Aquila

I think it would be a greater task to research the character and person of Jesus with regards to how he related to the law. Because we are not called to keep the law... we are called to be conformed into the image of Jesus.

For example, I had fallen into the notion that I was required as a Christian to follow the Ten Commandments... then some Sabbath keepers busted the Fourth Commandment on me. So... I began keeping the Sabbath with them so as to not violate the commandment. And then I read of how Jesus said that the sabbath was made for man... not man for the sabbath. And how Jesus himself called himself the "Lord of the Sabbath". When I received the understanding that we're not called to obey the law... but to be conformed into the image of Jesus, He being our standard, I realized... the entire law was made for man... not man for the law. More specifically, the law was made for Israel. Therefore to live by it would only conform me into the likeness of Israel... not Christ. Christ's righteousness superceeded the law. He demonstrated a love that would heal and allow the disciples to pluck corn on the sabbath day.

I might not keep the law perfectly. I might have my issues in my struggle against my flesh. However, I have learned that Christ demands that I strive to be as much like Him as possible. That requires loving God with all my heart.... and demonstrating that love by loving others as myself... not by keeping some body of laws or list of codes.

I agree with you in part. However, how is a man to know that he may have a relationship with God, if he is never told. Sin has separated us from God, but the only way to know of our sin is through the Law. Thus we need the Law so that we may know where the boundaries are. The Law is made for us so that we may obtain mercy and to judge those who transgress it. Thus there is a need even yet for the Law. However, because we may obtain mercy of the One who wrote the Law, we are not bound by the power of the Law.

Originally Posted by Aquila

Romans 12:18
If it be possible, as much as lieth in you, live peaceably with all men.

We are called to live peaceably with all men. Sadly, many souls that desperately need Jesus (both gay and straight) and will be turned off to Christ.

Regardless of our interpretations on various social issues in our nation... we must be wise.

I agree with this statement too. I believe that there is a much better way to teach and preach against sin. I do not believe that we should be making homosexuality out to be a greater sin than any of the others. Drunkenness, for example, is a far more prevalent sin, however we are more used to seeing it and do not notice it anymore. Further it does not move in direct opposition to the design of God for man. However, it is as or more destructive for all of that.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Jay

I agree with you in part. However, how is a man to know that he may have a relationship with God, if he is never told. Sin has separated us from God, but the only way to know of our sin is through the Law. Thus we need the Law so that we may know where the boundaries are. The Law is made for us so that we may obtain mercy and to judge those who transgress it. Thus there is a need even yet for the Law. However, because we may obtain mercy of the One who wrote the Law, we are not bound by the power of the Law.

I agree with you in part. I believe that the Law is a ministry of death designed to condemn all comers, forcing them into the realization that they cannot please God based on works or behavior... but rather, they need a Saviour, they need... grace. The Law doesn't set the bounderies for me... else a ham sandwich would be an abomination. Working on Saturday would be a grave sin punishable by death, etc, etc. JESUS is my boundary. I'm to prayerfully seek to be conformed into His image and likeness increasingly with every passing day. The very person of Jesus is the standard we strive to meet. It's not about what we do... it's about what we are becoming. The Law was nailed to the cross with my old man and no longer applies to me. I'm a partaker in the divine nature, being fashioned into the image and likeness of Jesus. To subject myself to the Law would be... lowering my standard. I'm not impressed by the Law. Frankly, it would only conform me into the image and likeness of ancient Israel (not Christ) if I could keep it all.

I agree with this statement too. I believe that there is a much better way to teach and preach against sin. I do not believe that we should be making homosexuality out to be a greater sin than any of the others. Drunkenness, for example, is a far more prevalent sin, however we are more used to seeing it and do not notice it anymore. Further it does not move in direct opposition to the design of God for man. However, it is as or more destructive for all of that.

Amen.

[Jay]

I am not speaking of the laws concerning the Temple or regarding Jewish customs of separation. I speak of the Law that governs the actions of man. That which says, "Murder not, commit no sexual immorality, steal not, revere the Lord, be in obedience to authority, etc", is the law that I am discussing. While there has been some overlap, it is actually very small, and can be readily distinguished upon analyzing the Scripture.

I do not believe that we shall actually be able to agree upon the function of the Law. I remain convinced that it is entirely possible for a Christian to transgress the Law, and therefore it remains in force.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Jay

I am not speaking of the laws concerning the Temple or regarding Jewish customs of separation. I speak of the Law that governs the actions of man. That which says, "Murder not, commit no sexual immorality, steal not, revere the Lord, be in obedience to authority, etc", is the law that I am discussing. While there has been some overlap, it is actually very small, and can be readily distinguished upon analyzing the Scripture.

I'm not even bound by those bro. Paul put it this way,

Romans 13:9
For the commandments, “You shall not commit adultery, You shall not murder, You shall not steal, You shall not covet,” and any other commandment, are summed up in this word: “You shall love your neighbor as yourself.”

Again, I'm above that law. I'm living in the new nature that was found in Christ. Therefore, Jesus alone is my standard. He is what I am becoming. Daily conformed into His image and likeness more and more. I am only bound by the law of Christ, the law of Love. I am to love my neighbor as myself. In this I fulfill the law. For, if I love my neighbor as myself... I will not murder, harm, steal, speak evil, covet, or anything else that might harm him/her.

So, I don't buy into all that. Again, it's lowering my standards. Besides, you can't have only part of the law. You must accept the whole law none at all.

I do not believe that we shall actually be able to agree upon the function of the Law. I remain convinced that it is entirely possible for a Christian to transgress the Law, and therefore it remains in force.

Ummm... I'm dead to the Law. I'm hardly bound by it. If I transgress... the sin is a failure to show my love for God by loving my neighbor. If I fail to bear fruit, it isn't that I've broken a law, it's that I've not fully manifested Christ in me and I've lived for the flesh.

The battle used to be Law vs. Flesh. Now it's Spirit vs. Flesh. Big difference.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Jay

I am not speaking of the laws concerning the Temple or regarding Jewish customs of separation. I speak of the Law that governs the actions of man. That which says, "Murder not, commit no sexual immorality, steal not, revere the Lord, be in obedience to authority, etc", is the law that I am discussing. While there has been some overlap, it is actually very small, and can be readily distinguished upon analyzing the Scripture.

I do not believe that we shall actually be able to agree upon the function of the Law. I remain convinced that it is entirely possible for a Christian to transgress the Law, and therefore it remains in force.

I'm curious... can you post a comprehensive list of all of the laws we're all still supposedly bound by???

[Jay]

Originally Posted by Aquila

I'm curious... can you post a comprehensive list of all of the laws we're all still supposedly bound by???

Do not murder

Love, revere, and obey God

Worship God only

Know that there is only one God

Commit no fornication

Commit no adultery

Commit no bestiality

Commit no homosexuality

Do not steal

Do not desire anything that does not belongs to another

Do not become intoxicated

Do not kidnap

Do not lie or make any deception

Do not blaspheme God in any form

Obey those in authority (so long as their commands do not transgress the Law)

Do not break the Law



That is a start, I have to go to work, but I can provide more than a few references to anything that I have posted so far. All of these are in effect for all men at all times.