Baptism - Page 6

Aquila · #51 05-31-2011, 07:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Praxeas

What notes? lol

The above makes no sense whatsoever. If what Jesus was doing was expanding on John's baptism then why baptize in the name of the Father, Son and Spirit if it's just John's baptism expanded on?

The context tells the truth. Jesus says "All Power is given to ME in heaven and earth"

The greek word there is exousia, meaning authority.

The greek word for name is onoma. It means "name" but as in the English language "name" carries the connotation of authority too. When you do something in someone's name you are doing it by their authority.

Thus Jesus said THEREFORE, of because of the fact that HE has all authority in heaven and earth (Phil 2 the highest name named in heaven and earth)...therefore go and make disciples of Christ by baptizing them in the name or authority of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit and that is exactly what the Apostles did. That authority is in the name of Jesus

Php 2:9 Therefore God has highly exalted him and bestowed on him the name that is above every name,
Php 2:10 so that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, in heaven and on earth and under the earth,
Php 2:11 and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

Yet if one truly honors said authority, do they not do as said authority commanded? We have an exact quote from Christ in Matthew 28:19. We can only draw inferences from the book of Acts. Traditional Christianity would state that if one baptizes "in the name of Jesus Christ" (i.e. in the authority of Christ) they will baptize as Christ commanded (Matthew 28:19).

I'm now hesitant to "explain away" the exact words of Jesus in Matthew 28:19 to affirm an inference drawn from various verses in the book of Acts that do not have an exact quote of what was said.

Aquila · #52 05-31-2011, 08:01 AM

Ultimately the issue is that we have an exact quote from Jesus Christ regarding baptism and it's formula in Matthew 28:19. In Acts 2:38, 8:16, 10:48, 19:5, and 22:16 we simply have the inference made by some indicating a singular name formula. Is it safe to take inference over exact quotation? The Traditional Christian believes that every baptism in the book of Acts was performed in the authority of and giving reverence to Jesus Christ (in Jesus name). However, these baptisms were performed in obedience to the very words of Christ in Matthew 28:19.

Essentially the Trinitarian baptizing according to Matthew 28:19 cannot be accused of not obeying Christ. However, the one that baptizes using strictly a singular name formula is basing their practice on inference, and essentially neglecting the very words of Jesus in Matthew 28:19.

mfblume · #53 05-31-2011, 02:18 PM

From TIME magazine 1957:

Record from AD100:

(See Cover) The deacon raised his hand, and Publius Decius stepped through the baptistry door. Standing waist-deep in the pool was Marcus Vasca the wood-seller. He was smiling as Publius waded into the pool beside him. "Credis . . . ?" he asked.

"Credo," responded Publius. "I believe that my salvation comes from Jesus the Christ, Who was crucified under Pontius Pilate. With Him I die that with Him I may have Eternal Life." Then he felt strong arms supporting him as he let himself fall backward into the pool, and heard Marcus' voice in his ear—"I baptize you in the Name of the Lord Jesus"—as the cold water closed over him.

TGBTG · #54 05-31-2011, 02:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mfblume

From TIME magazine 1957:

Record from AD100:

(See Cover) The deacon raised his hand, and Publius Decius stepped through the baptistry door. Standing waist-deep in the pool was Marcus Vasca the wood-seller. He was smiling as Publius waded into the pool beside him. "Credis . . . ?" he asked.

"Credo," responded Publius. "I believe that my salvation comes from Jesus the Christ, Who was crucified under Pontius Pilate. With Him I die that with Him I may have Eternal Life." Then he felt strong arms supporting him as he let himself fall backward into the pool, and heard Marcus' voice in his ear—"I baptize you in the Name of the Lord Jesus"—as the cold water closed over him.

wohooo!!!!!!!

Funny that even the catholic writings records that water baptism was done in the name of Jesus Christ.

I also read in a particular copy of the NIV that the greek word "eis" is also translated as "into". IOW, Matt 28:19 reads as:
"Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them INTO the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit"

Now, that would definitely correspond with the baptism of Rom 6.

Aquila · #55 05-31-2011, 03:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mfblume

From TIME magazine 1957:

Record from AD100:

(See Cover) The deacon raised his hand, and Publius Decius stepped through the baptistry door. Standing waist-deep in the pool was Marcus Vasca the wood-seller. He was smiling as Publius waded into the pool beside him. "Credis . . . ?" he asked.

"Credo," responded Publius. "I believe that my salvation comes from Jesus the Christ, Who was crucified under Pontius Pilate. With Him I die that with Him I may have Eternal Life." Then he felt strong arms supporting him as he let himself fall backward into the pool, and heard Marcus' voice in his ear—"I baptize you in the Name of the Lord Jesus"—as the cold water closed over him.

Can you provide the source with which to verify? This appears to be written like fictional narrative used by an oped writer to lay the foundation for his or her opinion piece.

Aquila · #56 05-31-2011, 03:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mfblume

From TIME magazine 1957:

Record from AD100:

(See Cover) The deacon raised his hand, and Publius Decius stepped through the baptistry door. Standing waist-deep in the pool was Marcus Vasca the wood-seller. He was smiling as Publius waded into the pool beside him. "Credis . . . ?" he asked.

"Credo," responded Publius. "I believe that my salvation comes from Jesus the Christ, Who was crucified under Pontius Pilate. With Him I die that with Him I may have Eternal Life." Then he felt strong arms supporting him as he let himself fall backward into the pool, and heard Marcus' voice in his ear—"I baptize you in the Name of the Lord Jesus"—as the cold water closed over him.

Isn't this a quote from Church Ages Book Chpt. 1? And doesn't this have a Branhamite connection or wasn't it written by William Branham? I'm not finding any creditable historic sources in my research for the depiction given.

pastor RICK · #57 05-31-2011, 05:17 PM

forunatly we know that name of christ! JESUS. acts 4 ';12 ......

acerrak · #58 05-31-2011, 06:16 PM

i can quote the didiache which is around 70 ce to 120 ce which states father son holy ghost baptism way before this. and many others from justin mayrtr and up before the council of nicea..

mfblume · #59 05-31-2011, 10:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aquila

Isn't this a quote from Church Ages Book Chpt. 1? And doesn't this have a Branhamite connection or wasn't it written by William Branham? I'm not finding any creditable historic sources in my research for the depiction given.

Branham got it from TIME magazine. It is indeed in the TIME archives.

Sam · #60 05-31-2011, 10:50 PM

The following is a true record of a Baptism which took place in Rome A.D. 100 and was reproduced in TIME magazine, December 5, 1955.

"The deacon raised his hand, and Publius Decius stepped through the baptistry door. Standing waist-deep in the pool was Marcus Vasca the woodseller. He was smiling as Publius waded into the pool beside him. ‘Credis?’ he asked. ‘Credo,’ responded Publius. ‘I believe that my salvation comes from Jesus the Christ, Who was crucified under Pontius Pilate. With Him I died that with Him I may have Eternal Life.’ Then he felt strong arms supporting him as he let himself fall backward into the pool, and heard Marcus’ voice in his ear ---- ‘I baptize you in the Name of the Lord Jesus’ ---- as the cold water closed over him."

The above appeared on one of our previous forums. The first paragraph is commentary by the one who posted it. The second paragraph is a quote from the referenced magazine.

I remember reading that magazine in the high school library in my senior year while I was in study hall. I remember that article. The article compared a first century baptism to a modern baptism by immersion. Whoever wrote the article probably made up the lead in paragraph but felt like it represented (as far as he or she knew) early Christian baptism.

I had just been baptized in Jesus' name a short time before I read that article. I had been baptized October 27, 1955 at Elim Tabernacle (UPC) in Milwaukee, WI. I had been saved since March 28, 1955 and subsequently baptized in a lake by my Baptist pastor. I was searching for more truth and a closer walk with the Lord and was pretty sure baptism in Jesus' name was Scriptural but still had some reservations even though I had gone ahead and taken the "plunge."

Reading the article that day in the high school library was sort of a confirmation that early Christian baptism involved the name of Jesus.

Over these past 50 some years every once in a while I've wondered just what the date of that article was and if I'd ever see it again.

Thank you to the person who posted that link.

You can read the article here:
http://www.time.com/time/magazine/ar...893230,00.html