The Message Bible

[TheLegalist]

Originally Posted by crakjak

"The Message", is a great English modern version of the Bible. It is not biased toward Universalism, one must have a revelation of UR by the Holy Spirit to overcome just such traditional brainwashing to endless punishment.

The truth of the total redemption of the creation, comes thru all versions and translations, when the translators are dedicated to be faithful to the text.

Yes, I do love "The Shack", it speaks to the heart of the brokeness of humanity in a way that "religion" can never do. Legalism (the Law) condemns but never provides any power to redeem.

BTW: Your post is a cheap shot, if you want to discuss or try to refute UR, have at it, I will take you on.

It's not a TRANSLATION! It's a personal opinion piece with added meaning per his theology. "The Shack" is about as heretical as it gets with it's antinomian doctrine and Universalism slant.

REVELATION.... ROFL yeah uh huh!

[crakjak]

Originally Posted by TheLegalist

It's not a TRANSLATION! It's a personal opinion piece with added meaning per his theology. "The Shack" is about as heretical as it gets with it's antinomian doctrine and Universalism slant.

REVELATION.... ROFL yeah uh huh!

An opinion is like a laugh, almost everyone has one. And you are very free to yours.

The Message is not a study bible, it is a reading bible. The Shack is not a doctrine paper, it is a parable.

Jesus spoke in "nothing" but parables to the masses, and He alluded to traditions and beliefs that He did not embrace, but He didn't waste time with trying to refute every faulty believe, He simply presented loving truth. The reason is the same as today, most cannot hear, because of their doctrines of men.

[TheLegalist]

Originally Posted by crakjak

An opinion is like a laugh, almost everyone has one. And you are very free to yours.

The Message is not a study bible, it is a reading bible. The Shack is not a doctrine paper, it is a parable.

Jesus spoke in "nothing" but parables to the masses, and He alluded to traditions and beliefs that He did not embrace, but He didn't waste time with trying to refute every faulty believe, He simply presented loving truth. The reason is the same as today, most cannot hear, because of their doctrines of men.

What we write creates images of doctrine when concerning religion. To say it's not a doctrinal paper is partly correct but parables are doctrinal as in what JESUS did! The doctrine that is spewed from that book is heretical and mocks God and his righteousness. It creates a false view of God's law and the NT teachings. HERECTICAL? You better believe it!

Also that reading Bible is pathetic and in many ways teaches incorrect usage of God's Word. It's not even a translation and at that not really even a paraphrase.

[crakjak]

Originally Posted by TheLegalist

What we write creates images of doctrine when concerning religion. To say it's not a doctrinal paper is partly correct but parables are doctrinal as in what JESUS did! The doctrine that is spewed from that book is heretical and mocks God and his righteousness. It creates a false view of God's law and the NT teachings. HERECTICAL? You better believe it!

Also that reading Bible is pathetic and in many ways teaches incorrect usage of God's Word. It's not even a translation and at that not really even a paraphrase.

It is only pathetic and heretical to you because it doesn't conform to your indoctrination, and what you believe has to be true.

I have heard the author of the Shack speak, he says he is not teaching Universalism, even though I can see UR in the book. Nor his he saying the Father is a large black women, it is an allegory, that speaks to the hearts of many folks that have been terribly beaten up by this life.

In one sense, you would appear to be the Pharisees condemning the broken because they were not able to keep all their laws. The Message and the Shack would be like Jesus speaking to the woman about to be stoned after being caught in adultery.

We are so prone to see God as the dictating tyrant and miss the fact that He is the Heavenly Father, that will finally defeat all evil and restore all that He created.

[Scott Hutchinson]

I have one,but I really use it.Nothing agains't it I just don't really care for it myself and that's just me,but I have been reading The Holman Christian Standard version and The New Living Translation though these days.

[crakjak]

Originally Posted by Scott Hutchinson

I have one,but I really use it.Nothing agains't it I just don't really care for it myself and that's just me,but I have been reading The Holman Christian Standard version and The New Living Translation though these days.

I really enjoy the NLT, as well as the Message.

[Scott Hutchinson]

I have nothing agains't the message,the way it reads I just don't get into it.
I favor the literal translations,ESV,NASB. I also enjoy reading the J.B. Phillips New Testament in modern english.

[crakjak]

Originally Posted by Scott Hutchinson

I have nothing agains't the message,the way it reads I just don't get into it.
I favor the literal translations,ESV,NASB. I also enjoy reading the J.B. Phillips New Testament in modern english.

I understand.

[TheLegalist]

Originally Posted by crakjak

It is only pathetic and heretical to you because it doesn't conform to your indoctrination, and what you believe has to be true.

I have heard the author of the Shack speak, he says he is not teaching Universalism, even though I can see UR in the book. Nor his he saying the Father is a large black women, it is an allegory, that speaks to the hearts of many folks that have been terribly beaten up by this life.

In one sense, you would appear to be the Pharisees condemning the broken because they were not able to keep all their laws.

oh yes... "their" laws. I tell people all the time. Go open that stupid Talmud and the Mishna all the time! Obey "their" laws. I never mentiond God's law at all. Like John 15, Mark 12:29-31..... NOOOT ME! I just point everyone elses system but God's justice system by which all men will be judged. pfffft

The Message and the Shack would be like Jesus speaking to the woman about to be stoned after being caught in adultery.

yeah... I bet Jesus would agree with this trash...

oh no doctrine in this at all...


"Why would the God of the universe want to be submitted to me?"

"Because we want you to join us in our circle of relationships," answers "Jesus." [1,p.145] Together the "trinity" explains:

"Authority, as you usually think of it, is merely the excuse the strong use to make others conform to what they want.... We carefully respect your choices...." [1,p.123]

"'Are you saying I don't have to follow the rules?'...

"'Yes. In Jesus you are not under any law. All things are lawful.'

"'You can't be serious! You're messing with me again,' moaned Mack.

"'Child,' interrupted papa, 'you ain't heard nuthin' yet.'...

"'...enforcing rules [says Sarayu] ...is a vain attempt to create certainty out of uncertainty. And contrary to what you might think, I have a great fondness for uncertainty. Rules cannot bring freedom; they only have the power to accuse.'"[1,p.203] [ACIM uses the word "attack" instead of "accuse."]

“Seriously, my life was not meant to be an example to copy. Being my follower is not trying to ‘be like Jesus’” (pg. 149).
Who said anything about being a Christian? I’m not a Christian . . . Those who love me come from every system that exists . . . I have no desire to make them Christian, but I do want to join them in their transformation into sons and daughters of my Papa.”

Does that mean that all roads will lead to you?” Jesus answers, “Not at all. Most roads don’t lead anywhere. What it does mean is that I will travel any road to find you” (pg. 182). On page 192, Papa tells Mack that “through his death and resurrection, I am now fully reconciled to the world.” Mack asks, “The whole world? You mean those who believe in you, right?” Papa answers, “The whole world, Mack.”
“Honey, I’ve never placed an expectation on you or anyone else. The idea behind expectations requires that someone does not know the future or outcome and is trying to control behavior to get the desired results.”
There is no mercy or grace in rules because they do not allow for even one mistake. Jesus fulfilled all of the law for us and now it has no jurisdiction over us. “Rules cannot bring freedom; they only have the power to accuse.” (page 202 - 203)
On page 203 Mack asks Papa “are you saying I don’t have to follow the rules?” Papa responds “Yes. In Jesus you are not under any law. All things are lawful.”



“Forgiveness is not about forgetting, Mack. It is about letting go of another person’s throat.”
“But I thought you forget our sins?”
“Mack, I am God. I forget nothing. I know everything. So forgetting for me is the choice to limit myself. Son, …because of Jesus, there is now no law demanding that I bring your sins back to mind. They are gone when it comes to you and me, and they run no interference in our relationship.

On page 96 it is said that the Father didn’t forsake Jesus on the cross, but that Jesus only felt forsaken because He was in such great pain

On page 120 Papa says that she doesn’t “need to punish people for sin”, but that “sin is its own punishment”. It’s not her “purpose to punish it”, it’s her “joy to cure it”.

"God, who is the ground of all being, dwells in, around, and through all things....” [panentheism]
--The Shack's "Jesus." [1,p.112]
"Those who love me come from every system that exists. They were Buddhists or Mormons, Baptists or Muslims.... I have no desire to make them Christian, but I do want to join them in their transformation into sons and daughters of my Papa, into my brothers and sisters.”
--The Shack's "Jesus." [1,p.182]
"In Jesus, I have forgiven all humans for their sins against me, but only some choose relationship."

We are so prone to see God as the dictating tyrant and miss the fact that He is the Heavenly Father, that will finally defeat all evil and restore all that He created.

[crakjak]

Originally Posted by TheLegalist

oh yes... "their" laws. I tell people all the time. Go open that stupid Talmud and the Mishna all the time! Obey "their" laws. I never mentiond God's law at all. Like John 15, Mark 12:29-31..... NOOOT ME! I just point everyone elses system but God's justice system by which all men will be judged. pfffft




yeah... I bet Jesus would agree with this trash...

oh no doctrine in this at all...


"Why would the God of the universe want to be submitted to me?"

"Because we want you to join us in our circle of relationships," answers "Jesus." [1,p.145] Together the "trinity" explains:

"Authority, as you usually think of it, is merely the excuse the strong use to make others conform to what they want.... We carefully respect your choices...." [1,p.123]

"'Are you saying I don't have to follow the rules?'...

"'Yes. In Jesus you are not under any law. All things are lawful.'

"'You can't be serious! You're messing with me again,' moaned Mack.

"'Child,' interrupted papa, 'you ain't heard nuthin' yet.'...

"'...enforcing rules [says Sarayu] ...is a vain attempt to create certainty out of uncertainty. And contrary to what you might think, I have a great fondness for uncertainty. Rules cannot bring freedom; they only have the power to accuse.'"[1,p.203] [ACIM uses the word "attack" instead of "accuse."]

“Seriously, my life was not meant to be an example to copy. Being my follower is not trying to ‘be like Jesus’” (pg. 149).
Who said anything about being a Christian? I’m not a Christian . . . Those who love me come from every system that exists . . . I have no desire to make them Christian, but I do want to join them in their transformation into sons and daughters of my Papa.”

Does that mean that all roads will lead to you?” Jesus answers, “Not at all. Most roads don’t lead anywhere. What it does mean is that I will travel any road to find you” (pg. 182). On page 192, Papa tells Mack that “through his death and resurrection, I am now fully reconciled to the world.” Mack asks, “The whole world? You mean those who believe in you, right?” Papa answers, “The whole world, Mack.”
“Honey, I’ve never placed an expectation on you or anyone else. The idea behind expectations requires that someone does not know the future or outcome and is trying to control behavior to get the desired results.”
There is no mercy or grace in rules because they do not allow for even one mistake. Jesus fulfilled all of the law for us and now it has no jurisdiction over us. “Rules cannot bring freedom; they only have the power to accuse.” (page 202 - 203)
On page 203 Mack asks Papa “are you saying I don’t have to follow the rules?” Papa responds “Yes. In Jesus you are not under any law. All things are lawful.”



“Forgiveness is not about forgetting, Mack. It is about letting go of another person’s throat.”
“But I thought you forget our sins?”
“Mack, I am God. I forget nothing. I know everything. So forgetting for me is the choice to limit myself. Son, …because of Jesus, there is now no law demanding that I bring your sins back to mind. They are gone when it comes to you and me, and they run no interference in our relationship.

On page 96 it is said that the Father didn’t forsake Jesus on the cross, but that Jesus only felt forsaken because He was in such great pain

On page 120 Papa says that she doesn’t “need to punish people for sin”, but that “sin is its own punishment”. It’s not her “purpose to punish it”, it’s her “joy to cure it”.

"God, who is the ground of all being, dwells in, around, and through all things....” [panentheism]
--The Shack's "Jesus." [1,p.112]
"Those who love me come from every system that exists. They were Buddhists or Mormons, Baptists or Muslims.... I have no desire to make them Christian, but I do want to join them in their transformation into sons and daughters of my Papa, into my brothers and sisters.”
--The Shack's "Jesus." [1,p.182]
"In Jesus, I have forgiven all humans for their sins against me, but only some choose relationship."

In context none of the above is problematic. Which part do you have a problem with?

However, this thread was about the "Message" not "The Shack".