Hillary Supporters Should Be Worried

[jfrog]

Originally Posted by Aquila

Actually, they were. President Obama was criticized by the GOP as not having enough experience to be President. However, he was elected to the Illinois State Senate in 1996. In 1999, Obama ran for Congress and lost. From 2003 to 2004, served as chair of the Health and Human Services Committee. In 2004 Obama was elected to the US Senate. Obama served in the US Senate until he campaigned and won the Presidential election in 2008.

What I find interesting is.... the GOP criticized Obama for not having enough political experience to be President. Yet, the GOP is now supporting a GOP candidate that has never held political office before in his life. LOL

Hmmm... what's the difference between the two men. Well, the do have different skin tones. And one is a billionaire while the other wasn't. One was married, I believe, three times, one has only been married once. I could go on. But it gets uglier.

But, to answer my questions... I reside in Ohio. Then Senator of Illinois, Barak Obama had done next to nothing for me at the time. But at least he had held public office.

So, I couldn't help but notice, you didn't even answer my questions. You just performed a well trained "re-direct". I'll ask them again:

- How many public offices has Trump held?

- What has Donald Trump done for you and/or those you love?

I'm interested in your answers.

Yawn

[Originalist]

Originally Posted by Aquila

And things are still better than they were under our last "business minded" President, President Bush. lol

Are you insane? For the first 6 years of the Bush Administration there was steady growth and low unemployment with REAL jobs. The labor participation force was much higher. However, the economy tanked because the Federal Government's involvement was artificially inflating the housing market which led to the bubble. Everything the government funds winds up creating an artificial demand, leads to higher prices and a catastrophe.

now say something about the Schip program.

[jfrog]

Originally Posted by Aquila

Actually, they were. President Obama was criticized by the GOP as not having enough experience to be President. However, he was elected to the Illinois State Senate in 1996. In 1999, Obama ran for Congress and lost. From 2003 to 2004, served as chair of the Health and Human Services Committee. In 2004 Obama was elected to the US Senate. Obama served in the US Senate until he campaigned and won the Presidential election in 2008.

What I find interesting is.... the GOP criticized Obama for not having enough political experience to be President. Yet, the GOP is now supporting a GOP candidate that has never held political office before in his life. LOL

Hmmm... what's the difference between the two men. Well, the do have different skin tones. And one is a billionaire while the other wasn't. One was married, I believe, three times, one has only been married once. I could go on. But it gets uglier.

But, to answer my questions... I reside in Ohio. Then Senator of Illinois, Barak Obama had done next to nothing for me at the time. But at least he had held public office.

So, I couldn't help but notice, you didn't even answer my questions. You just performed a well trained "re-direct". I'll ask them again:

- How many public offices has Trump held?

- What has Donald Trump done for you and/or those you love?

I'm interested in your answers.

#1. I would hardly say that the GOP is supporting Donald Trump.

#2. I remember the 2008 election pretty vividly. Barack Obama hadn't even served 1 term in the Senate. He had very little experience. It wasn't just the GOP that drove that point home. Hillary Clinton talked a lot about his inexperience too as well as she battled him in the Democratic primaries (aka the real presidential race of 2008).

Obama actually was a lot like Trump at that time. He was basically a blank political slate that people could project their hopes and desires for the country into. His message was hope and change. That's basically Donald Trump's message in "Make America Great Again".

In the 2008 election Obama was viewed as the political outsider. That is why his message of hope and change resonated so much. People could see him as an outsider who could finally understand them and their needs and put policies into action to see them fulfilled.. This is almost exactly who and what Donald Trump is in 2016.

#3 Trump has held 0 public offices. Just to catch you up with the times, right now people want outsider candidates and those are candidates who are seen as inexperienced in politics. At this point in time this is actually one of Donald Trump's biggest assets.

#4 Trump is about hope and change. He hasn't done anything for anyone yet because he is a political outsider and that's the "in" thing to be at the moment. However, it's the hope that he will change things that draw people to him. At the present time America is so desperate to start going in the "right" direction that all it takes is a message of hope. The reason hope alone will do is because there haven't been any proven experienced individuals that we can look to as agents of taking America in the "right" direction.

#5 hypocrisy abounds on both sides of the political spectrum. I hope you can't just see Republican Hypocrisy. In complaining that Republicans are hypocrites for supporting a canadidate like Trump when the blasted Obama for similar things, you are missing the Democrats that supported Obama and now are blasting trump for similar things to Obama. It goes both ways. Both sides are tied when it comes to political hypocrisy.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by aegsm76

How could they not when the media and other people LIE about it.
Take a look at how the media is portraying the latest two police shootings of black men.
Tulsa - original narrative was a black pastor, whose SUV had broken down in the road as shot as his hands were up.
Now we know that two 911 calls were made that led police to believe that he was on something, he did not respond to officers commands, he kept reaching for his pockets, he put his hands up without the police ever requesting it, he walked back to his SUV with police telling him to stop, a vial of PCP was found in the SUV, the SUV was STILL RUNNING and wasn't broken down, he spent 4 years in prison, in 2012 his own father said that his son had a problem with PCP.
Charlotte - original narrative was that disabled man was shot in his car as he was reading a book.
Now we have a photo that shows a gun dropped after he was shot.

Repeat a lie long enough and most people will believe it.

I'm frustrated with the media on the police shootings too. They speak before they have the facts and they get people worked up. Well, let's see.... do you remember who's bright idea it was to privatize the media and loosen regulations, leading to corporate owned media sources that jump to report anything to get ratings???? The conservatives.

Since then, sad to say it, real news is rare (on both sides). Everything is just banter and commentary with the network's opinion injected for public digestion. I wish they'd mechanically report the facts and allow us to make up our own minds as to what we think about the situations.

Oh, since we're on the subject of the media. Here's another thing that burns me up. The media outlets are primarily liberal or conservative. Both sides report from the most extreme position possible. And they portray every circumstance in the most sensational way. They also give the impression that the political parties are almost at war with one another. And here we are, the American people, picking sides.... and going to war against one another with name calling, blah, blah, blah. But back in D.C. and in the state capitol.... members of both parties are going out to lunch together, laughing, making deals, negotiating, compromising terms, and legislating.... like they are just in different high school clubs. It's bad for the people to be divided to such an extreme measure. They are just trying to lock in voting blocks through emotional and psychological manipulation.

Oh.... back to the race thing.... minorities tend to vote for the politicians who have policies and initiatives that address their needs. And sadly, most minorities aren't in the best financial position. So, they tend to vote for the candidate who has solid plans on job training and job creation, educational grants and funding, subsidized health insurance (because they can't afford it), public assistance, who will protect grandma's Social Security from being invested on the open market to be lost to banks and corporations, etc. And guess what, most of those candidates are Democrats. Yes, they want a hand. And we liberals are bleeding hearted weenies who are more than willing to use the government to help those folks out if we can. And when it comes to civil rights.... TODAY (because we have a disgusting history) Democrats are more likely to support any issue calling for a civil right. That's just in our nature. That's why we're liberals. lol

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by n david

The media is all in for a race war, and liberals and Democrats are doing what they can to help push people off the cliff.

The media wants anything that produces higher ratings.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Esaias

Notice how, in your world, "racist" means "white conservative".

It's more complicated than that. Democrats can be just as racist as Republicans. Same for liberals vs. conservatives. However, in a liberal's mind there is a difference between racism and righteous indignation. For example, if we enslave a people for several hundred years, liberate them, but still oppress them by denying them property rights, education, jobs, etc. we only liberate them to poverty and hardship. So, we pass necessary amendments and legislation to secure those basic rights of these now free people. It doesn't mean their hardship goes away over night. In fact, the hardship imposed can have an effect for several generations. So... if THEY seem racist, is it racism? Or is it a righteous indignation brought on by the realization that you're people were not only enslaved, but systematically oppressed for generations and that is why you're in dire straights today? It's different. Then there are the little things that are systematic. For example, banks refuse more loans to invest in various areas of a community because those areas are poorer and perhaps have higher crime rates demographically. Those areas are also home of many minorities who are 160 years behind the rest of us when it comes to having civil rights and the ability to work for and store up wealth for the next generation. So, they feel discriminated against on the grounds of their race. After all... had they immediately weren't denied civil rights on the grounds of their race once "freed"....perhaps they would not be stuck in the ghettos. It's a hard thing to understand. My fiancé's family is a good example. Her great, great, grandfather was able to purchase land and start a business and future generations inherited his life's work. Now, at the time he was buying land and starting a business.... minorities around him were denied an education, property rights, and even jobs on account of their race. Guess where their great, great, grandchildren are today? Do you realize we are only now seeing a large scale shift of wealth from generation to generation in pockets of our minority population? I pray the trend continues and they are able to catch up to the rest of us. I also pray that those who are in poverty begin taking advantage of the opportunities liberals have fought to give them with grants and low interest student loans specifically designed for minorities. Heck, I'd be happy of they'd put down the whiskey and at least go VOTE.

However, there seems to be another side of things too.... that's when one gets into "white privilege". A lot of folks who are white have never faced the hardships caused by hundreds of years of subjugation and discrimination. We think, "Get over it already. C'mon, just get a job. Why aren't you educated? Why this? Why that?" Well... if we had what happened to them happen to us... we'd know why. I remember talking to a woman at a bus stop about welfare and poverty. I was a rather conservative young man at the time. I made a comment on how people on welfare don't need food stamps because they are typically fatter than the rest of us. Buddy, did she go off! LOL She tried to give me a lesson on how poor people have so little money, all they can buy is what they afford, and how what they can afford is typically not good for you. And so you have fat people struggling with malnutrition because they are desperately poor. I didn't start to get it until I started the South Beach Diet (recommended by my doctor to help get my weight and blood pressure down). When I started trying to buy HEALTHY foods... I noticed... they were EXPENSIVE compared to the foods that are high in carbs, sugars, etc. that are terrible for you. And then I imagined.... only having $400 a month in food stamps to cover me and my kid. Wow.... if I'm going to fill our stomachs all month, it's going to be... the cheap stuff. And guess what.... we're going to be overweight and we're going to have greater health problems. And privileged people are going to look at us and judge us... thinking... we're too fat to need any more food stamps. The story below the surface begins to come into light. Things aren't what they seem. The simplistic first impressions that take little thought and contemplation are so often seriously mistaken. I realized, I was judging those people on welfare (mostly minorities) from a position of.... privilege.

Most racism isn't intentional. It's due to perception from a position that has no idea or empathy of another's circumstance. It's often irrational fear based on appearance. The woman who pulls her purse closer to her side if a man of color is going to pass her on the sidewalk. It's subtle, and like I said, often unintentional. But it is real. When companies hire more white people because they are simple perceived as being more reliable than the minorities applying because a number of them don't have vehicles. Why don't they have vehicles? Grew up in poverty. Why? Lack of opportunity. Why? Social rejection. Why? Attitudes going back to days of oppression. Why? Because their people were enslaved. And perhaps those minorities without a car are will prove just as reliable on a bus route. In fact, most desperately want the job so that.... they can go buy a car! LOL So... here they are desperately trying to overcome economic and social hardships all brought about because of... their racial heritage. It's not cool. So, we pansy bleeding heart liberals do things like make hiring standards based on demographics that kick doors open wide for a matching percentage of the local minority population. We're just too darned sensitive. We want to catch them up and help. We don't always know how to help in the right ways. And many times our brilliant ideas backfire. But we swear by all that is within us.... we'll NEVER stop trying. They are fellow Americans. We WILL find a way to help them realize the American dream. And... we will oppose any notion of "liberty" that would allow collaborated efforts to reject them. Yep, bleeding hearted suckers. That's us, the liberals.

because "minorities" don't support a candidate "in droves", it must be because the candidate and his supporters are "racist".

No, it's more about policies. Is that candidate REALLY doing anything to help address the issues minorities face? Or are they just offering more "liberty"... that will ultimately grant more liberty across the board.... including more liberty to discriminate? Republicans have a history of slashing welfare programs because they say we can't afford them....only to turn around and give the very same money in corporate subsidies to corporations recording record profits. Minorities feel that. Especially those still struggling economically. So guess what... they ain't voting for you. And if you're not sensitive to the implications of their plight that originates in they're being a minority that was subjugated for several hundred years.... it's racist.

Typical democrat, always pandering, always using the race card. The "equality" you seek will never be achieved as long as people like you are involved in the political narrative. You guys are your own worst enemy.

Like I said, we liberals are weenies. lol

[jfrog]

Originally Posted by Aquila

It's more complicated than that. Democrats can be just as racist as Republicans. Same for liberals vs. conservatives. However, in a liberal's mind there is a difference between racism and righteous indignation. For example, if we enslave a people for several hundred years, liberate them, but still oppress them by denying them property rights, education, jobs, etc. we only liberate them to poverty and hardship. So, we pass necessary amendments and legislation to secure those basic rights of these now free people. It doesn't mean their hardship goes away over night. In fact, the hardship imposed can have an effect for several generations. So... if THEY seem racist, is it racism? Or is it a righteous indignation brought on by the realization that you're people were not only enslaved, but systematically oppressed for generations and that is why you're in dire straights today? It's different. Then there are the little things that are systematic. For example, banks refuse more loans to invest in various areas of a community because those areas are poorer and perhaps have higher crime rates demographically. Those areas are also home of many minorities who are 160 years behind the rest of us when it comes to having civil rights and the ability to work for and store up wealth for the next generation. So, they feel discriminated against on the grounds of their race. After all... had they immediately weren't denied civil rights on the grounds of their race once "freed"....perhaps they would not be stuck in the ghettos. It's a hard thing to understand. My fiancé's family is a good example. Her great, great, grandfather was able to purchase land and start a business and future generations inherited his life's work. Now, at the time he was buying land and starting a business.... minorities around him were denied an education, property rights, and even jobs on account of their race. Guess where their great, great, grandchildren are today? Do you realize we are only now seeing a large scale shift of wealth from generation to generation in pockets of our minority population? I pray the trend continues and they are able to catch up to the rest of us. I also pray that those who are in poverty begin taking advantage of the opportunities liberals have fought to give them with grants and low interest student loans specifically designed for minorities. Heck, I'd be happy of they'd put down the whiskey and at least go VOTE.

However, there seems to be another side of things too.... that's when one gets into "white privilege". A lot of folks who are white have never faced the hardships caused by hundreds of years of subjugation and discrimination. We think, "Get over it already. C'mon, just get a job. Why aren't you educated? Why this? Why that?" Well... if we had what happened to them happen to us... we'd know why. I remember talking to a woman at a bus stop about welfare and poverty. I was a rather conservative young man at the time. I made a comment on how people on welfare don't need food stamps because they are typically fatter than the rest of us. Buddy, did she go off! LOL She tried to give me a lesson on how poor people have so little money, all they can buy is what they afford, and how what they can afford is typically not good for you. And so you have fat people struggling with malnutrition because they are desperately poor. I didn't start to get it until I started the South Beach Diet (recommended by my doctor to help get my weight and blood pressure down). When I started trying to buy HEALTHY foods... I noticed... they were EXPENSIVE compared to the foods that are high in carbs, sugars, etc. that are terrible for you. And then I imagined.... only having $400 a month in food stamps to cover me and my kid. Wow.... if I'm going to fill our stomachs all month, it's going to be... the cheap stuff. And guess what.... we're going to be overweight and we're going to have greater health problems. And privileged people are going to look at us and judge us... thinking... we're too fat to need any more food stamps. The story below the surface begins to come into light. Things aren't what they seem. The simplistic first impressions that take little thought and contemplation are so often seriously mistaken. I realized, I was judging those people on welfare (mostly minorities) from a position of.... privilege.

Most racism isn't intentional. It's due to perception from a position that has no idea or empathy of another's circumstance. It's often irrational fear based on appearance. The woman who pulls her purse closer to her side if a man of color is going to pass her on the sidewalk. It's subtle, and like I said, often unintentional. But it is real. When companies hire more white people because they are simple perceived as being more reliable than the minorities applying because a number of them don't have vehicles. Why don't they have vehicles? Grew up in poverty. Why? Lack of opportunity. Why? Social rejection. Why? Attitudes going back to days of oppression. Why? Because their people were enslaved. And perhaps those minorities without a car are will prove just as reliable on a bus route. In fact, most desperately want the job so that.... they can go buy a car! LOL So... here they are desperately trying to overcome economic and social hardships all brought about because of... their racial heritage. It's not cool. So, we pansy bleeding heart liberals do things like make hiring standards based on demographics that kick doors open wide for a matching percentage of the local minority population. We're just too darned sensitive. We want to catch them up and help. We don't always know how to help in the right ways. And many times our brilliant ideas backfire. But we swear by all that is within us.... we'll NEVER stop trying. They are fellow Americans. We WILL find a way to help them realize the American dream. And... we will oppose any notion of "liberty" that would allow collaborated efforts to reject them. Yep, bleeding hearted suckers. That's us, the liberals.



No, it's more about policies. Is that candidate REALLY doing anything to help address the issues minorities face? Or are they just offering more "liberty"... that will ultimately grant more liberty across the board.... including more liberty to discriminate? Republicans have a history of slashing welfare programs because they say we can't afford them....only to turn around and give the very same money in corporate subsidies to corporations recording record profits. Minorities feel that. Especially those still struggling economically. So guess what... they ain't voting for you. And if you're not sensitive to the implications of their plight that originates in they're being a minority that was subjugated for several hundred years.... it's racist.



Like I said, we liberals are weenies. lol

You will quickly lose the moral highground if you continue down the path of "justified racism"

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Originalist

Are you insane? For the first 6 years of the Bush Administration there was steady growth and low unemployment with REAL jobs. The labor participation force was much higher. However, the economy tanked because the Federal Government's involvement was artificially inflating the housing market which led to the bubble. Everything the government funds winds up creating an artificial demand, leads to higher prices and a catastrophe.

You guys get into government, break things, and then blame government. lol

It is common knowledge that the deregulation and expansion of subprime lending in the housing market allowed for the creation of junk bonds and the ability to sell them overseas. Who pushed for that and got it? The Republicans. Frankly, had the Republicans NOT pushed for deregulation of the housing market.... much of what blew up in our faces wouldn't have existed. It was primarily deregulation that was the problem. Not government. In fact, with many of the GOVERNMENTAL regulations on the books prior to the deregulation craze.... we'd not have had a crisis. So, thank a conservative for holding to that failed logic that helped cause the collapse. LOL

Here's an article specifying those major players in the collapse and what role they played....

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/mone...ticle-1.366267

now say something about the Schip program.

My step daughter, along with roughly 8 million other children have benefitted from the program.

[Jito463]

Originally Posted by Aquila

do you remember who's bright idea it was to privatize the media

Uh, WHAT?!?!?!?!?!?! Since when has the media been government run? It's always been run by the private sector!

[aegsm76]

Originally Posted by Aquila

I'm frustrated with the media on the police shootings too. They speak before they have the facts and they get people worked up. Well, let's see.... do you remember who's bright idea it was to privatize the media and loosen regulations, leading to corporate owned media sources that jump to report anything to get ratings???? The conservatives.

Since then, sad to say it, real news is rare (on both sides). Everything is just banter and commentary with the network's opinion injected for public digestion. I wish they'd mechanically report the facts and allow us to make up our own minds as to what we think about the situations.

Oh, since we're on the subject of the media. Here's another thing that burns me up. The media outlets are primarily liberal or conservative. Both sides report from the most extreme position possible. And they portray every circumstance in the most sensational way. They also give the impression that the political parties are almost at war with one another. And here we are, the American people, picking sides.... and going to war against one another with name calling, blah, blah, blah. But back in D.C. and in the state capitol.... members of both parties are going out to lunch together, laughing, making deals, negotiating, compromising terms, and legislating.... like they are just in different high school clubs. It's bad for the people to be divided to such an extreme measure. They are just trying to lock in voting blocks through emotional and psychological manipulation.

Oh.... back to the race thing.... minorities tend to vote for the politicians who have policies and initiatives that address their needs. And sadly, most minorities aren't in the best financial position. So, they tend to vote for the candidate who has solid plans on job training and job creation, educational grants and funding, subsidized health insurance (because they can't afford it), public assistance, who will protect grandma's Social Security from being invested on the open market to be lost to banks and corporations, etc. And guess what, most of those candidates are Democrats. Yes, they want a hand. And we liberals are bleeding hearted weenies who are more than willing to use the government to help those folks out if we can. And when it comes to civil rights.... TODAY (because we have a disgusting history) Democrats are more likely to support any issue calling for a civil right. That's just in our nature. That's why we're liberals. lol

What an amazing mix of logic and confusion.
You blame the Conservatives for today's news media being liberal?
Really?

Now, I do agree with your third paragraph.

On your last one, do you know what the definition is of insanity.
Doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result.
Is the black community in better shape with all of the liberal "help"?
My observation is no.
And liberals are bleeding hearted weanies because they love to "help" people using other people's money!
Let me give you two different quotes that sum up liberals and conservatives.

"If you are not a liberal at twenty, you have no heart and if you are not conservative at forty, you have no brain."

“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the people discover they can vote themselves largess out of the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidate promising the most benefits from the public treasury, with the result that democracy always collapses over a loose fiscal policy--to be followed by a dictatorship.”