Will A Person Who Has Obeyed Acts 2:38 but lies and steals go to hell?

[Rico]

Originally Posted by Berkeley

How often can you sin without living in a state of sin? What determines if it is a "fall" or a constant state?

Well, she made the distinction of this person "continuing" to engage in the same behaviour. I can see people continuing some behaviours because of addictions and so forth, but lying isn't an addiction.

[berkeley]

Originally Posted by Whole Hearted

Not everything that speaks in tongues is of God. One who lives in sin and talks in tongues is just as lost as the one who has never been baptised or talked in tongues.
Behold old things pass away and all things become new.

Based on this assessment, my conversion was dis-genuine.

[Rico]

Originally Posted by Berkeley

This is what I speak of:

Judge not, that ye be not judged.
For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again.

Well, unless you are planning on being a constant liar you shouldn't have anything to worry about, should you?

[berkeley]

Originally Posted by Rico

Well, she made the distinction of this person "continuing" to engage in the same behaviour. I can see people continuing some behaviours because of addictions and so forth, but lying isn't an addiction.

What determines if it is continuous? Falling once a week?
Once a month?

Twice a year??

[Emma Bontrager]

Originally Posted by TalkLady

Emma, it's one thing to lie and another to be wise. .....It is wise to be silent when you disagree and I would never tell someone that a lousy message was preached. .......The message might not have meant so much to you, but it might have been just what someone else needed. ILG needs to teach you a few things.

Well, if they hurt your feelings or you think the ordnung is stupid, you better keep your mouth shut. The bishop has the right to hurt your feelings. For example, if you can't afford the material for a longer skirt for your girls and the hemline is slightly short and he calls you on it, it doesn't matter if you are too poor. It is your own stupid fault. It's your husband's responsibility to make enough money and your responsibility to get it sewn. He could look at you snidely and say "Your skirts are too short. You need to spend some time making new dresses", implying you are lazy and make you feel like a terrible heel and if you told him you had no money for new material, it would simply be no excuse and too awful bad. Even your own preachers here know that. When folks whine about being hurt in church conflicts it's their own stupid fault. They will tell you glowing stories about how THEY were hurt and just went forward and didn't get offended at all. That's because they know what holiness really is. No money is no excuse and nothing is an excuse for saying anything bad about God's anointed even if they falsely accuse you of everything under the sun. There is never excuse for you. That's what true holiness is.

[TalkLady]

(EDIT: This was not typed in response to Emma's most recent post, even though it came after hers)......Well, all we can do is pray for this type of person. In the end, God is the judge even if all the details about their actions are never known to Man. What amazes me is how others can just pat people on the back and accept whatever they tell them. Some people are just good "spiritual politicians".....If the right mix of power is there, sometimes it appears that the lying and stealing don't count. Of course, let's think of all of this as conjecture and purely hypothetical but I would like to know how others would vote - if they were ever faced with dealing with this type of person.

[Rico]

Originally Posted by Berkeley

What determines if it is continuous? Falling once a week?
Once a month?

Twice a year??

Brother, I would say the will of the person engaging in the behaviour would play a big role in deciding that. It's one thing to have something buffet you that you cave in to because of weakness. It's another thing entirely to know something is wrong and insist on continuing in the behaviour.

[TalkLady]

Originally Posted by Emma Bontrager

Well, if they hurt your feelings or you think the ordnung is stupid, you better keep your mouth shut. The bishop has the right to hurt your feelings. For example, if you can't afford the material for a longer skirt for your girls and the hemline is slightly short and he calls you on it, it doesn't matter if you are too poor. It is your own stupid fault. It's your husband's responsibility to make enough money and your responsibility to get it sewn. He could look at you snidely and say "Your skirts are too short. You need to spend some time making new dresses", implying you are lazy and make you feel like a terrible heel and if you told him you had no money for new material, it would simply be no excuse and too awful bad. Even your own preachers here know that. When folks whine about being hurt in church conflicts it's their own stupid fault. They will tell you glowing stories about how THEY were hurt and just went forward and didn't get offended at all. That's because they know what holiness really is. No money is no excuse and nothing is an excuse for saying anything bad about God's anointed even if they falsely accuse you of everything under the sun. There is never excuse for you. That's what true holiness is.

Emma, methinks you have been around some very atrocious people - or your perception was skewed. Methinks thou should just go to another locale. There are many good "bishops" out there. Don't let one or two turn you against them all. I'm not going to let that happen to me!

[stmatthew]

Romans 6: 1-14 (NLT)
Well then, should we keep on sinning so that God can show us more and more kindness and forgiveness? 2 Of course not! Since we have died to sin, how can we continue to live in it? 3 Or have you forgotten that when we became Christians and were baptized to become one with Christ Jesus, we died with him? 4 For we died and were buried with Christ by baptism. And just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glorious power of the Father, now we also may live new lives.
5 Since we have been united with him in his death, we will also be raised as he was. 6 Our old sinful selves were crucified with Christ so that sin might lose its power in our lives. We are no longer slaves to sin. 7 For when we died with Christ we were set free from the power of sin. 8 And since we died with Christ, we know we will also share his new life. 9 We are sure of this because Christ rose from the dead, and he will never die again. Death no longer has any power over him. 10 He died once to defeat sin, and now he lives for the glory of God. 11 So you should consider yourselves dead to sin and able to live for the glory of God through Christ Jesus.
12 Do not let sin control the way you live; [fn1] do not give in to its lustful desires. 13 Do not let any part of your body become a tool of wickedness, to be used for sinning. Instead, give yourselves completely to God since you have been given new life. And use your whole body as a tool to do what is right for the glory of God. 14 Sin is no longer your master, for you are no longer subject to the law, which enslaves you to sin. Instead, you are free by God's grace.


If one continues to be bound by sin, it is because they have refused the power of Christ available to them that breaks every bondage and frees the believer.

[ChTatum]

Would "lying" include preaching for doctrine the commandments of men?

Just to clarify....