H.R. 3200 The Real Deal

[Light]

Originally Posted by HaShaliach

Greek I can handle - its the English that gives me a head ache. LOLOL

Yes English get me to.
I am working on your first post, some statements I agree with you and some I don't. It will take some time as I have other things I must do.

[A.W. Bowman]

Originally Posted by Light

Yes English get me to.
I am working on your first post, some statements I agree with you and some I don't. It will take some time as I have other things I must do.

LOLOL Have a life!

As to agreements: Not a problem. I am not looking for agreements from the community, only that the bill actually be studied. Is it what our country needs?

I have a real heart burn with it, while others may "love it". Opinions will vary among people according to their perception of the problem and its solution. But, I have seen first hand how the currently ran government (administrated) health care works. To give over all health care authority to them is, to me, like signing an execution warrant for those individuals deemed no longer worthy of life (the procedure is too expensive, the patient is too old, too sick, or is too something else ..., etc.). These decisions will be made more on policy lines rather than on medical realities.

Remember how HMO administrators use to do the same thing (and sometimes still do)? Medical decisions were based primarily on expected return-on-investment (cost effective) results, i.e., corporate profits.

However, I think one can still sue HMO's for wrongful death decisions, which has driven them to be a little more careful in their decision-making process. But, with a federally imposed program, there is no recourse, no appeal, and no alternative. It will be the "old HMO" approach to health care all over again, but this time it will be nation wide!

I may be wrong - but that is how I see it.

[A.W. Bowman]

My final comment on this subject: On Facebook -

Sarah Palin: Concerning the "Death Panels"

Regardless of what one think of her personally, this is a well [publicly] documented presentation.

[coadie]

Sen Coburn is an M.D. from Oklahoma.
He introduced ammendments that remove the authority for the end of life activity in the bill. His ammendments have been rejected. When a doctor sees it as having a "death Panel" clause and authority, he speaks up.

http://www.lifeissues.org/radio/r2008/08/08-22-08.htm

Dr. Coburn is also anti abortion and gets a lot of hate from his position.

[coadie]

Originally Posted by HaShaliach

My final comment on this subject: On Facebook -

Sarah Palin: Concerning the "Death Panels"

Regardless of what one think of her personally, this is a well [publicly] documented presentation.

Isn't that awesome. She exposed some sneaky wording and they have made changes since then.

The Word "abortion" isn't in the bill. They decievers use family planning and womens health to cover it.

[coadie]

The New Zealand government has already attempted rationing by temporarily denying the breast cancer drug Herceptin.

•

Page 42: The "Health Choices Commissioner" will decide health
benefits for you. You will have no choice. None.

"An acute shortage of dialysis machines is causing numerous premature deaths in the UK, a study by the country's National Kidney Research Fund indicates. More than 100,000 people have kidney disease but only 34,000 are receiving dialysis or have had a kidney transplant.

Of the 71 UK kidney treatment units surveyed, 12 have been forced to turn away patients. Other units reported that they have been forced to take emergency measures to accommodate increasing numbers of patients. Some offer patients dialysis only 2 times a week instead of 3, while others hold overnight treatment sessions. Most units reported they were working at full capacity, with no appointment times for new patients. "Some providers acknowledged that the final options for such patients are conservative management and/or death," the report said."


In America, we already have too many kidney patients who need dialysis or a transplant for the services available. Fortunately, private insurance has stepped in and now covers home dialysis units that are life savers for thousands.

Rationing? 34% of Renal failure patients recieve Dialysis?

According to data released by the Forum, Chicago neighborhoods in the 60620 zip code lead the nation in new cases of kidney failure. Neighborhoods outside Los Angeles and in Philadelphia, Washington, D.C., Jacksonville, Baltimore, Detroit, New York City and in Los Angeles follow closely behind as disease "hot-spots" according to a top-twenty breakdown of newly diagnosed ESRD cases in zip-codes nationwide.



"Currently, more than 400,000 Americans suffer from ESRD and that number is expected to double in the next decade," said Kent Thiry, Chairman of KCP. "The most effective ways to prevent the onset of kidney failure are earlier detection and better disease management initiatives."

So the Death panel says you are too old for a trnasplant. 55 years. Like Dr Emanual says no "reciprocity" with society.

The Death Panel is called "Advanced Care Planning Associates" Is that a good spin?

[coadie]

Originally Posted by Aquila

I'm going to look at each individual point to see if it is misinformation or not. One I see right off the bat is:

• Page 354: Government will restrict enrollment of SPECIAL NEEDS
individuals.

At first glance this makes the uninformed scream in outrage. BUT... this provision is necessary because most of those with special needs will be directed to the multiple programs ALREADY in place for them. By restricting enrollment for special needs cases the program can be selective in order to cover only those who AREN'T covered or don't qualify for programs currently in place. This was one thing I heard about early and looked into because I was a volunteer theraputic programmer for the handicapped with Echoing Hills/Echoing Valley Residential Centers.

Every point has to be looked into individually to find why the provision exists. Anyone who believed point on page 354 would prevent the handicapped from much needed care is obviously in need of a little more information than what they are being told by the individual who compiled this list. For the record... this is what is called misinformation.

Stumped? Looks like you have had 6 days and all you can come up with is a chain e-mail from a newspaper blogger?

That is a typical inferior response.
Starting another cut and pastge thread shows sloppy work.

E-mail 'analysis' of health bill needs a check-up
By Angie Drobnic Holan
Published on Thursday, July 30th, 2009 at 5:08 p.m.
http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-me...-needs-check-/


It may be the longest chain e-mail we've ever received.

All the left has is hot air and smoke and mirrors.
With all the free time people have at work to do "research" on google, they need to improve responses. Koolaid is not an energy drink.