Tithe-vs-Paying Your Bills

[*AQuietPlace*]

Originally Posted by Godsdrummer

AquietPlace

Did I not say good time and bad good economy and bad. My life experiances included losing jobs pay cuts and situations beyond my control. The fact is if we are good stewards we will never get into debt beyond anything we cannot take care of should we lose job etc.

I take lituraly the passages that speak that we should not owe any man anything. We then become servant to the debt. God never gives us garentees of jobs ect he does promise we will have those things we need. Roof, food and clothing.

That's true when it comes to debt. The best plan is to have no debt at all. Then, if your income drops drastically, you aren't saddled with debt you can't pay.

I was just referring to the fact that sometimes our income can drop so drastically that we can't even cover the basics adequately.... food and housing.

[SteppingStone]

It seems to me that scripture says if we don't provide for our own we have departed from the faith. So paying tithes (Bondage) would leave you short on your bills how can you provide for your own? Now if you were a farmer and you gave a tenth of your crops you would still have food wouldn't you? Or if you raised sheep, etc.

Paying tithes...

[Aquila]

Biblically speaking the poor were not required to tithe under the Law of Moses. Neither were tradesmen. The tithe was strictly commanded to farmers. It was an agrarian land tax, if you will.

Jesus warned the religious leaders of his day....

Matthew 23:14
Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye devour widows' houses, and for a pretence make long prayer: therefore ye shall receive the greater damnation.

The Pharisees devoured widows' houses. Meaning they required the tithe and offerings to the point of extortion. Requiring a tithe of those who cannot afford to pay it spiritual oppression.

[Godsdrummer]

Originally Posted by *AQuietPlace*

That's true when it comes to debt. The best plan is to have no debt at all. Then, if your income drops drastically, you aren't saddled with debt you can't pay.

I was just referring to the fact that sometimes our income can drop so drastically that we can't even cover the basics adequately.... food and housing.

AQP
I know each situation is differant, but speaking from my life experiances and those around me. I have lost many jobs and have had my income cut by more than half many times. Still God so fit that all the basics were covered. But I did not sit around waiting for thing to come out of nothing I did what I had to do to see to it my family had the neccesitys. I would find and min. wage job to keep things going. I would mow lawns or what ever it took. That is the problem I have seen too many times others expect God to just come down and take care of everything without any effort on our part.

God allows us to go through things to build caricture, but this only happens if we let it build caricture.

[corvet786c]

Where in the NT is it required to pay tithes? Are you giving your pastor mint, cummen and anise? Does seem like money to me?

[faithit166]

althou there is no scripture in the new testament speaking of tithing their are many in the old that speak of it i rely on malachi 3;10 bring all the tithe in the storehouse that their be meat in my house,and prove me now herewith saith the lord of host if i will not open you the windows of heaven and pour you out a blessing that their shall not be room enough to recieve it noone can out give god.i need gods blessings in my life and if i am faithful to him he will in turn be faithful to me he loveth a cheerful giver

[Digging4Truth]

Originally Posted by faithit166

although there is no scripture in the new testament speaking of tithing their are many in the old that speak of it i rely on Malachi 3;10 bring all the tithe in the storehouse that their be meat in my house,and prove me now herewith saith the lord of host if i will not open you the windows of heaven and pour you out a blessing that their shall not be room enough to receive it no one can out give god. i need gods blessings in my life and if i am faithful to him he will in turn be faithful to me he loveth a cheerful giver

He will also be faithful to those who study and understand His word.

Malachi 3:10...
Bring all the tithe into the storehouse.

This discourse is in reference to a problem Malachi's contemporary, Nehemiah, faced in Jerusalem. Nehemiah found that an Ammonite (Which was forbidden to even be part of the congregation) was living in the storehouse. The tithe was supposed to be kept in the storehouse but the priests (who had no instruction to handle any portion of the tithe other than the 10% of it God said they could have) were handling the whole of the tithe themselves. They had sent the Levites out to work in the fields rather than receive their portion and were allowing and taking part in sales on the sabbath.

You'll notice that when Malachi starts writing his book he is speaking to all of Israel. Then in the 2nd Chapter he says... priests... this is for you. This verse is part of that discourse. He is speaking to the priests. They had emptied the storehouse and allowed someone to live there that was forbidden to be there.

That there will be meat in my house...

Yes... meat. Because the tithe was never, in any portion of the Bible, exacted upon anyone's wage. It was an agricultural tithe recognizing from where the bounty comes from.

See if I will open up the windows of heaven. "Windows of Heaven" is consistently in reference to rain (an agricultural need) in all of the OT. Including this verse.

It is true... one cannot out give God. But one can interpret His Word outside it's intent.

For more information you can look at my thread from 3 years ago on the subject of Malachi & Nehemiah by clicking here.

[faithit166]

thanks for the post but i will continue paying my tithes over any bill first,if i put him first hell make sure my bills get paid just like he always has god bless you,he is faithful.

[Digging4Truth]

Originally Posted by faithit166

thanks for the post but i will continue paying my tithes over any bill first,if i put him first hell make sure my bills get paid just like he always has god bless you,he is faithful.

Indeed. And I would never suggest anything less.

We must simply ensure that we do not teach others a lie. Very few preachers do this and even fewer saints.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by faithit166

thanks for the post but i will continue paying my tithes over any bill first,if i put him first hell make sure my bills get paid just like he always has god bless you,he is faithful.

I see an important issue here.

Since tithing isn't a binding commandment in the NT church, paying tithes first is elevating it to the point of "law". This departs from "Grace".

Also, as believers we are told that if we do not provide for own own families, we're worse than infidels. You have to provide food, clothing, shelter, transportation, etc. in this day and age. If you do not provide these things for the sake of giving an unbiblical 10% to the church, you're failing to meet a NT responsibility. I remember being told that if I didn't tithe I'd be cursed. We'd tithe and not have enough money for groceries. So we'd borrow money for groceries from her mom. I used to praise God and give him credit for her assistance. Today I realize, I failed in my duty to provide for my family and burdened another to give to a bloated and wealthy pastorate. Needless to say, her mother never visited our church.

That leads to the final point I can think of. If we tithe and don't pay our bills what witness is that to our creditors? What witness is that to the world at large when we seek assistance because we gave to a religious institution?

If it's sincerely your desire to give to that point, and your family agrees to the sacrificial giving, burdening another to meet your needs is out of the question. In addition, if you're giving because your church requires you... it's extortion. Like the Pharisees of old, they are robbing the poor and the widow.