I'm firmly convinced that the majority of pastors are honest men. Unfortunately, we only hear about the dishonest ones.
I'd love for someone to start a thread about an honest pastor. But, unfortunately, you don't turn on the evening news and hear that "Thousands of planes took off and landed safely today", you only hear about the one that crashed.
And even more unfortunately, many people will say "Air travel is SO dangerous, I'm NEVER flying".
And, unfortunately, when people read these kinds of threads, many of them will say, "I'm NEVER paying my tithes now, because ALL preachers are dishonest crooks with huge homes".
Sorry, but I HATE the broad brush, folks.
BINGO!! That's exactly what I've been trying to convey, Michael! Thanks for saying it better and more concisely than I did
My pastor lives in a two story, 4 bedroom house, which has 1956 square feet, and was built in 2005. According to the online public records he paid $187,708 for it. He and his wife and his two teen agers (one boy and one girl) live there. I don't know what his salary from the church is. His wife works full time. He drives a PT Cruiser and she drives a Honda (I think). I don't think either car is new.
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Sam also known as Jim Ellis
Apostolic in doctrine
Pentecostal in experience
Charismatic in practice
Non-denominational in affiliation
Inter-denominational in fellowship
I do not know what my pastors house is worth. I can guess, knowing the market here and where it is and all. probably 700K to 1MIL. He drives a Lincoln Navigator and an Audi. Do I care? NOPE. He entertains, he works like a dog pastoring about 1000 people total, and he worked hard and long before he could get it too. Whenever there is a need in the church or outside it that comes to his attention he and his wife are dropping 500 to 1000 to help out all the time. He is blessed because he blesses others. He uses what God has given to him wisely.
He hasn't got the largest house in our church though, one man has a home valued at over 2.5MIL. We have several business owners in our church who own rather large and expensive homes.
The problem is most UPC pastors pearch tithe or rob God.
So Like may holiness standards, Tithe is included with heaven and hell.
Yet they take 10% and build castles like Saddam.
I am fore being blessed, Iam for spending their money where they like.
,but the question is when is enough enough.
We make fun of the money stealing with other orgs, (TBN) yet we may look the other way at those living high in the UPC.
I know of a UPC minister running about 250 and making over $200,00 a year
Actually, its not my business, nor is it yours, to sit around wondering if they're spending too much on their house, or if their salary is too high.
That is between them and God.
Could it be that some pastors are excessively compensated? Perhaps. But what good does it do to speculate about that on a forum like this?
Be careful, before you start to sound like one of those "busybodies" the apostle Paul wrote about.
__________________ http://endtimeobserver.blogspot.com
Daniel 12:3 And those who are wise shall shine like the brightness of the firmament; and those who turn many to righteousness, like the stars for ever.
Actually, its not my business, nor is it yours, to sit around wondering if they're spending too much on their house, or if their salary is too high.
That is between them and God.
Could it be that some pastors are excessively compensated? Perhaps. But what good does it do to speculate about that on a forum like this?
Be careful, before you start to sound like one of those "busybodies" the apostle Paul wrote about.
I know of a pastor that feels the complete opposite. He says that because the people work hard for their money and give in the offerings he is ought not betray their trust and he ought to give an account to them, seeing as they are the people of GOD. He drives a Jaguar, but he'll tell you how much he paid for it and how he got it the second you compliment him on his car, and he'll give the glory to GOD, and what he paid for the car is not bad at all... You can guess I agree with this pastor... (this pastor friend is VERY conservative btw, but he is no lord over GOD's heritage).
I know of a pastor that feels the complete opposite. He says that because the people work hard for their money and give in the offerings he is ought not betray their trust and he ought to give an account to them, seeing as they are the people of GOD. He drives a Jaguar, but he'll tell you how much he paid for it and how he got it the second you compliment him on his car, and he'll give the glory to GOD, and what he paid for the car is not bad at all... You can guess I agree with this pastor... (this pastor friend is VERY conservative btw, but he is no lord over GOD's heritage).
GOD BLESS!
Bro. Alex
Yes, I understand, and I agree that a pastor should be wise and conscientious regarding the salary he is paid and how he spends it.
But I'm saying if we try to judge from the outside looking in, that's where it gets tricky. There are a lot of factors involved. Such as ...How much of his money is from salary and how much from outside sources? How much money has he gained from stocks, real estate investments etc?. What about family money, gifts, blessings from other members? What if he bought his $500,000 house as a foreclosure and got it for just $340,000... is he still wrong? A pastor might have multiple streams of income -- he may have a regular job, a church salary, plus a pension he is receiving...all at the same time. What about money he may have inherited in the past? Etc, etc, etc. Things aren't always what they may seem.
That's why its not our place to try to judge a pastor/minister by his house or his car, because we don't know the whole story. If he's spending excessively, that's something for God to deal with him about. If his church is paying him what we might consider an excessively high salary, thats for the church board to deal with, not for us to gossip about. As long as he's not stealing money, it's best to leave it alone.
Speculating about a pastor's finances usually doesn't lead to anything good, and it's often rooted in a spirit of envy and gossiping.
Just my 2 cents.
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(And I agree with you about the Jaguar, by the way. I saw a 2004 Jag a few days ago for about $12K.. and looking at it you would think anybody driving it paid 3 times as much)
__________________ http://endtimeobserver.blogspot.com
Daniel 12:3 And those who are wise shall shine like the brightness of the firmament; and those who turn many to righteousness, like the stars for ever.
Well, in the case of Bernard, I'd say it's fair for him to collect all of his book's royalties, I mean that's just fair. I don't know how much that'd bring in, but lets say it brought in a million (maybe I'm way off here, I probably am) then he gets that money and he can do whatever he wants. But, it's probably not wise for him to collect a salary from the church if this is the situation...
I think $20,000 should be plenty. U can get a nice trailer for that i think.
You poor misguided soul you.......
As long as they don't live in tornado alley..............
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If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.
2 Chronicles 7:14 KJV
He hath shewed thee, O man, what is good; and what doth the LORD require of thee, but to do justly, and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with thy God? Micah 6:8 KJV
Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is. 1 John 3:2 KJV
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