The Sabbath Day, Should You Keep or not Keep?

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Originally Posted by Aquila

Many look at it like this... just as the "book of the law" (Law of Moses) explained to Israel how God desired them to keep His 10 Commandments as a nation, Christ's commandments (the Law of Christ) teaches how God desires us to obey His 10 Commandments as a church. So, for us, the Law of Christ has replaced the Law of Moses.



Well, that is a touchy issue. But we have to start somewhere. I toss around these questions:

Was it a sin to not observe the Sabbath prior to Christ?

Did Christ keep the Sabbath?

How did Christ keep the Sabbath?

Better still.... is Christ the sabbath now?

Yes.

Is it a sin to violate any of the other commandments contained in the Ten Commandments?

Seeing that most preach that it is a sin to forsake the gathering together of the body on Sunday, why is it so outrageous to equate the same logic to a day that God appears to have sanctified from the time of creation?

Both are wrong. Who said forsaking gathering on a particular day like Sunday is a sin? It doe snot matter what "most preach". It matters with the bible says.

Doesn't anyone who violates a given commandment out of the Ten Commandments feel that the commandment they violate is somehow, "less binding" than the one's they find it easier to obey?

Jesus is sabbath unlike the other commandments he does not fulfill.

Is it a matter of salvation or sanctification?

Do I keep the Sabbath to be saved, or do I keep the Sabbath because I am saved?

Do I count the Sabbath as an obligation, or a gift to me from my Creator?

Do I view the Sabbath as a sacred delight that I am blessed to partake in?

Is failure or inability to keep the Sabbath an unforgiveable sin?

If I or individuals I know violated a given commandment, do I not seek God for mercy and grace believing that He will be merciful and gracious? Why wouldn't God be equally as gracious and merciful to those who fail to keep the Sabbath or are unable to keep the Sabbath due to circumstance?

One should approach Sabbath keeping with as much love, devotion, mercy, and patience (towards themselves and others) as they would any other commandment as we sanctify ourselves and grow into the fullness of Christ.

Isaiah 58:13-14 (KJV)
13 If thou turn away thy foot from the sabbath, from doing thy pleasure on my holy day; and call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the Lord, honourable; and shalt honour him, not doing thine own ways, nor finding thine own pleasure, nor speaking thine own words:
14 Then shalt thou delight thyself in the Lord; and I will cause thee to ride upon the high places of the earth, and feed thee with the heritage of Jacob thy father: for the mouth of the Lord hath spoken it.

It is not a sin to not gather on Sunday any more than it is to not keep sabbath, and Sunday is not the sabbath. But I've said this over and over again... we who recognize Christ as the true sabbath actually keep the sabbath, and are not violating it as if we're sinning. Christ fulfilled sabbath in Himself.

If we have Christ, we have the sabbath and everything else that foreshadowed Christ. Despite those who disagree, the New Testament's far too plain about Sabbath being a shadow of Christ. Takes some mighty reaching and twisting to say otherwise.

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by Aquila

The Jews have stuffed "Torah" with so much junk since the time of Moses it's incredible. My point is the a distinction between the Ten Commandments that was a part of the covenant made at Sinai... and the the "book of the law" (the Pentateuch) that was added to that covenant in Moab 39 or more years later.

Yes, and your point is in error. The BIBLE identifies the commandments, statutes, judgments, precepts, testimonies, ordinances, and laws as "the law of the LORD", or "God's Law". The BIBLE does NOT make the distinction YOU are making.

That's MY point. We must conform our doctrine to the Word, rather than trying to conform the Word to our doctrine.

Remember, Jesus said man shall live by EVERY WORD of God. God's law is not limited to one chapter in Exodus, nor is it limited to the Pentateuch. The whole Bible is God's law, it's God's WORD, the revelation of His will for us.

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by Aquila

Many look at it like this... just as the "book of the law" (Law of Moses) explained to Israel how God desired them to keep His 10 Commandments as a nation, Christ's commandments (the Law of Christ) teaches how God desires us to obey His 10 Commandments as a church. So, for us, the Law of Christ has replaced the Law of Moses.

The "law of Christ" is mentioned only once, in Galatians 6:2, in referencing to bearing one another's burdens. So "law of Christ" is not a system of legislation that can be set in contradistinction to the "law of Moses".

The WAY, the Doctrine of Christ, the totality of Christ's teachings, the faith once delivered to the saints, etc, is the proper interpretation and application of the law of the Lord, in a new covenant context.

Was it a sin to not observe the Sabbath prior to Christ?

Yes.

Did Christ keep the Sabbath?

Yes.

How did Christ keep the Sabbath?

Perfectly, giving us a perfect example of true Sabbath keeping.

Is it a sin to violate any of the other commandments contained in the Ten Commandments?

Yes.

Seeing that most preach that it is a sin to forsake the gathering together of the body on Sunday, why is it so outrageous to equate the same logic to a day that God appears to have sanctified from the time of creation?

What people preach isn't as important as what the Bible teaches.

Doesn't anyone who violates a given commandment out of the Ten Commandments feel that the commandment they violate is somehow, "less binding" than the one's they find it easier to obey?

Usually.

Is it a matter of salvation or sanctification?

What does "repent" mean? If you repent do you give up all known sin? And, can a person be sanctified who refuses to repent of sin?

Do I keep the Sabbath to be saved, or do I keep the Sabbath because I am saved?

We should keep the Sabbath because it is right to do so. Salvation is obtained by faith in Christ, not by a measurement of our performance. Salvation results in obedience to God's commandments from the heart, the work of faith.

Do I count the Sabbath as an obligation, or a gift to me from my Creator?

It is both. Your children are a gift from God, and you also have certain obligations towards them.

Do I view the Sabbath as a sacred delight that I am blessed to partake in?

Do you?

Is failure or inability to keep the Sabbath an unforgiveable sin?

Most sins are not unforgivable, except any sin not repented of.

If I or individuals I know violated a given commandment, do I not seek God for mercy and grace believing that He will be merciful and gracious? Why wouldn't God be equally as gracious and merciful to those who fail to keep the Sabbath or are unable to keep the Sabbath due to circumstance?

Inability, and unwillingness, are two different things.

One should approach Sabbath keeping with as much love, devotion, mercy, and patience (towards themselves and others) as they would any other commandment as we sanctify ourselves and grow into the fullness of Christ.

Naturally. But, "sanctify ourselves"? Christ sanctifies us. Sanctifying oneself simply means consecrating oneself to God so that He can work in and through us.

Isaiah 58:13-14 (KJV)
13 If thou turn away thy foot from the sabbath, from doing thy pleasure on my holy day; and call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the Lord, honourable; and shalt honour him, not doing thine own ways, nor finding thine own pleasure, nor speaking thine own words:
14 Then shalt thou delight thyself in the Lord; and I will cause thee to ride upon the high places of the earth, and feed thee with the heritage of Jacob thy father: for the mouth of the Lord hath spoken it.

AMEN!

[Esaias]

Aquila, the whole point of redemption is to transform us from walking examples of disobedience and selfishness into God-manifesting examples of the living, loving, Will of God, His character, personality, attributes, etc. We are predestinated, that is to say, God has foreordained that we should be conformed to the image of Christ. Christ was the law of God on full display in it's perfect application in a human life. That image or likeness is what God wants for each of us.

That is what "theonomy" is all about. Manifesting the perfect will of God in our life by the Spirit of Christ through faith.

[mfblume]

The basic distinction between law and grace is what governs our lives. Rules on rocks or the Spirit within. Lest people should confuse this with the thought that without rules on rocks we would commit sin and propose license to sin, the reality is that the Spirit of God does not lead one to sin. Now, I know some claim failure to keep sabbath is sin, as if the Spirit will lead one to keep sabbath. But the reality is Christ is the actual sabbath of which the day was a mere foreshadow.

As Israel crossed Jordan into the promised land forty years after being delivered from Egypt, and the walls of Jericho came down, the whole temple system of law cam literally crashing down forty years after the cross. The walls of Jericho are like the walls people maintained about law in order to confuse themselves and not enter the new mindset of grace. Paul had clearly shown that Law is gone. The ordinances written and engraved on stones was nailed to the cross. It was against us and removed out of the way. He noted that the law was a ministration of death engraved in stones. Talk about direct reference to the ten commandments. It was not that the law of God was evil, but rather the way law is implemented with commanding you and you making yourself obey without any Spirit of God involved whatsoever, is a TOOL THE DEVIL USED. Get the Spirit to instead lead us to live right, so the Spirit is involved, is a whole different universe.

And while a ROD took them through the Red Sea away from Egypt, a MERCY SEAT took them through Jordan into the promise land to see walls come down. Think of the difference between a rod and a mercy seat.

And a sure sign the engraved rules on stone have not been replaced by the governance of the Spirit is the sabbath day issue, because CHRIST IS THE ACTUAL SABBATH. It's not a sin to keep sabbath of course, but it's missing the issue when one does not see Christ as the actual sabbath.

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What law comes down to is a ministration of condemnation. Some have recently argued it was how law on stone was implemented in the covenant, but that is not what 2 Cor 3 said at all. He said the MINISTRATION of condemnation was engraved on stone. Period.

2 Corinthians 3:7 KJV But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:

Nothing is said about the books. Nothing is said about how that was implemented. It was THE LAW ITSELF ON STONE ALONE that was ministration of death and condemnation.

When Paul directly was given the tenth commandment, THOU SHALT NOT COVET, he said sin used that law and KILLED HIM. Law was the tool the devil used to kill, while Law itself was fine. That's how it is the ministration of death. It is because of the sin in our flesh that made it so. Sin in our flesh reacts with Law in the form of a rock rule, and kills us. But God takes the holiness of law out of the devil's hand as a weapon, and God's personal heart-relationship with us succeeds where law failed.

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And a focus on law and legalism always puts the focus on what we do or don't do, and analyzes the sinner.

One man said the sacrificial lamb was the one that was analyzed by the priest, NOT THE SINNER! So many legalists today point at and analyze the sinner, instead of analyzing the sacrifice! When we analyze the sacrifice we realize all the details of grace and how God made us righteous through the cross, not through self-efforts and performance of legalism.

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Esaias

Yes, and your point is in error. The BIBLE identifies the commandments, statutes, judgments, precepts, testimonies, ordinances, and laws as "the law of the LORD", or "God's Law". The BIBLE does NOT make the distinction YOU are making.

That's MY point. We must conform our doctrine to the Word, rather than trying to conform the Word to our doctrine.

Remember, Jesus said man shall live by EVERY WORD of God. God's law is not limited to one chapter in Exodus, nor is it limited to the Pentateuch. The whole Bible is God's law, it's God's WORD, the revelation of His will for us.

Most of the scholars and rabbis I've read expressed that the 603 laws in the "book of the law" (the Torah, the Law of Israel, the Law of Moses, Mosaic Code, whatever one wishes to call it), which was established in the Covenant at Moab, are predicated upon one, or can be categorized with, one of the Ten Commandments, which was the Covenant Sinai, established 39+ years prior. It was added to the original Ten Commandments, and is based on them. For example, Rabbi Shlomo Itzhaki (Rashi) wrote in the Shemos:

What distinguishes the Ten Commandments from all the other 613 laws in the Torah is that the Ten Commandments act as the “categories” under which all the other commandments are included (Rashi, Shemos 24:12).

What I'm calling the "Law of Moses", was given at Moab to help the Israelites understand HOW to obey the Aseros HaDibros (the Ten Commandments). That is why the 603 laws of Moses are not considered any less important than the 10, each is predicated upon and categorized in some way under each of the 10.

If one doesn't see a distinction between two covenants (made 39 years or more apart) I'm not sure what to say.

[Aquila]

Here's a thought that popped into my head while I was contemplating this...

If Jesus is the Sabbath, do we reject Jesus if we reject the Sabbath?

[Aquila]

Originally Posted by Esaias

The "law of Christ" is mentioned only once, in Galatians 6:2, in referencing to bearing one another's burdens. So "law of Christ" is not a system of legislation that can be set in contradistinction to the "law of Moses".

I believe that bearing one another's burden is part of loving one's neighbor. Christ's summation of the entire Torah (Love God. Love others.) is so broad and universally applicable, one doesn't really need any additional laws to help govern one's life. I believe that the Ten Commandments still stand to identify sin and to condemn sin. I don't believe that laws against laying in the same bed as a woman on her menses or laws regarding unclean meats, circumcision, etc., help us who live under the New Covenant to keep from sin. Now, in the context of ancient Israel, many of those things were regarded as ceremonial uncleanliness or as idolatry do to how pagans engaged in specific practices. For example, swine was a common sacrifice among pagans. To prohibit the eating of pork was to set a strong barrier between the Israelite and the commandment "You shall not make for yourself a carved image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth; you shall not bow down to them nor serve them. For I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children to the third and fourth generations of those who hate Me, but showing mercy to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My Commandments." But under the New Covenant we know that those gods don't even exist. The only time we should be concerned is if we know that a given meat (any meat) has been sacrificed to idols. This is to preserve our witness as Christians and also to not cause a weaker brother to stumble.

The WAY, the Doctrine of Christ, the totality of Christ's teachings, the faith once delivered to the saints, etc, is the proper interpretation and application of the law of the Lord, in a new covenant context.

Amen.

Perfectly, giving us a perfect example of true Sabbath keeping.

Amen.

What people preach isn't as important as what the Bible teaches.

My point is, most take a day not even established in Scripture (Sunday) and designate it as a day for ceasing earthly work, worship, and assembly. In doing this, they argue that forsaking the assembling of ourselves is "sin". And so, they have established that it is sinful if one doesn't honor that day as directed. However, these very same individuals who preach this will condemn Sabbath keepers of legalism if they choose to honor the very day God ordained from the time of creation itself.

In actuality, both camps basically teach that it is a "sin" to not observe the day chosen for worship. But which camp is obeying God?

What does "repent" mean? If you repent do you give up all known sin? And, can a person be sanctified who refuses to repent of sin?

I believe that there are two ontological categories of sanctification. First, one is sanctified by the very presence of the Holy Spirit abiding in their spirit. This is an ontological imputation of righteousness and separation unto God's purposes established as soon as one receives the baptism of the Holy Ghost. One's spirit is sanctified through the presence of the Holy Spirit.

The second ontological category of sanctification has to do with mortifying our flesh. This can be a process. And it does take a desire to following the promptings of the abiding Holy Spirit within. As one disciplines the flesh, they are aligning their outside lives with the inward reality of the Holy Spirit.

Of course, this requires a sanctification of the mind, which comes through studying God's Word. Knowing what God desires bears upon the will, which is prompted by the Spirit, to cause one to sanctify themselves.

If one knows the Word of God and flat out refuses to obey it, they are grieving the Spirit. And yes, eventually God will cease to deal with them, leaving them reprobate and on the path to destruction.

My first pastor taught us that, "...there is an invisible line drawn by God for every man. Woe unto the man who continues in rebellion and crosses that line. For he will have stepped out of God's grace."

We should keep the Sabbath because it is right to do so. Salvation is obtained by faith in Christ, not by a measurement of our performance. Salvation results in obedience to God's commandments from the heart, the work of faith.

Amen. That's why I don't know why keeping the Sabbath is something so offensive to those who say they are born again. For most of my spiritual life in Christ, I was raised not to pay heed to the Sabbath. However, something deep down inside me continues to draw me back to it, even though I've debated against it! LOL So, intellectually I know all the reasons why I shouldn't have to keep the Sabbath. But spiritually, something in me longs to be obedient and keep the Sabbath. I was told to thank God for that inner struggle. Because it testifies that God's Spirit abides in me, though my mind hasn't been completely renewed by the Word.

It is both. Your children are a gift from God, and you also have certain obligations towards them.

Ooooh. Excellent point.

Do you?

YES! Every time I have honored the Sabbath I have felt spiritually blessed beyond measure. It is like a blessed gift. And it is like as then entire world turns around the Sun bringing sunset on Friday, it enters a sacred state established in both time and space. A sanctuary not built with hands, but a tabernacle in time itself.

Inability, and unwillingness, are two different things.

Amen. I've tried to explain this to people that I know who seem to see what I've said about the Sabbath, but due to circumstances find it difficult to honor it in its entirety. I encourage them that God knows their heart and their desire to honor the Sabbath in its fullness. I encourage that they pray and seek the LORD, that He might eliminate the obstacles that hinder them from being unable to keep the Sabbath as He desires. Sometimes, we have to have our own experience with being delivered from our slavery in Egypt.

Naturally. But, "sanctify ourselves"? Christ sanctifies us. Sanctifying oneself simply means consecrating oneself to God so that He can work in and through us.

Essentially, yes. Remember, I see some ontological differences in relation to our sanctification which allows our sanctification to in a sense be finished, in process, and even not yet. And while we might disagree on this perspective, I don't think it's entirely salvific, especially if the end result of each of our reasoning is the same. Total sanctification.